LOTR ring inscription

Started by Nongyu te Syulang Swokioang'itan, January 26, 2014, 01:01:28 PM

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Tìtstewan

I used <ei> because those rings was originally given as a gift to the kings.
That sentence let my silly brain blown up...I think <us> doesn't work too.
Nine for Mortal Men doomed to die,
Volawa ioi livu sawtute a zene tìyeverkup,

?!?!?!

As for the other sentences, I'm going to correct them.


Quote from: Plumps on January 27, 2014, 04:49:36 AM
Mortor a (tsatsengit) tok ayukìl?
This would mean "where the shadows are"
The English original says In the Land of Mordor where the Shadows lie., in German it was translated as: "Im Lande Mordor, wo die Schatten drohn."

We seriously need more words...

BTW
If somone is good in Latin:
Tres anuli regibus alborum sub caelo
Septem dominis nanis in lapideis eorum palatis
Novem hominibus mortalibus morituris
Unus domino nigro in throno suo
Terra Mordoris quo iacent umbrae
Anulus unus omnes regnare, omnes invenire,
Anulus unus venari tenebrisque vincere
Terra Mordoris quo iacent umbrae.


and in Quenya:
Neldë Cormar Eldaron Aranen nu i vilya,
Otso Heruin Naucoron ondeva mardentassen,
Nertë Firimë Nérin yar i Nuron martyar,
Minë i Morë Herun mormahalmaryassë
Mornórëo Nóressë yassë i Fuini caitar.
Minë Corma turië të ilyë, Minë Corma hirië të,
Minë Corma hostië të ilyë ar mordossë nutië të
Mornórëo Nóressë yassë i Fuini caitar.

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Plumps

Quote from: Tìtstewan on January 27, 2014, 05:57:23 AM
Quote from: Plumps on January 27, 2014, 04:49:36 AM
Mortor a (tsatsengit) tok ayukìl?
This would mean "where the shadows are"
The English original says In the Land of Mordor where the Shadows lie., in German it was translated as: "Im Lande Mordor, wo die Schatten drohn."

What did we say about translating the meaning, not the words? ;D As I said, it's even more difficult for peotry because speech there is condenced and has more idiomatic and metaphorical uses. What does it mean, "shadows lie"? As I understand it, it's a hyperbol for a land full of shadows, where darkness thrives and evil has its home. Ergo, where the shadows are :D

And thanks, but I know the German versions ;) I have read the books a few times, in German as well as in English.

eejmensenikbenhet

Having a go at it, using some of the suggestions above:


Three Rings for the Elven-kings under the sky,Pxeya ko'on *Elvenä pxeyktanur a äo taw,Three rings ElvenGEN leadersDAT,Tert under the sky,
Seven for the Dwarf-lords in their halls of stone,Kinä *Kitwerkìyä ayeyktanur a feyä kelkumì letskxe,Seven DwarfGEN leadersDAT,Plur themGEN home-in stoneADJ,
Nine for Mortal Men doomed to die,Volaw Letsukterkupa Sawtuter a syay lu kxitx,Nine Able-to-dieADJ HumansDAT,Plur (whose) fate is death,
One for the Dark Lord on his dark throne,'Awa Tìvawmä Eyktanur a vawma *heyntsengsìn,One DarknessGEN LeaderDAT dark seat-on,
In the Land of Mordor where the Shadows lie.Atxkxemì alu Mortor a tok ayukìl.Land-in that is Mordor (where) are shadows.
One ring to rule them all, one ring to find them,'Awa ko'onìl eyk frapot, 'awa ko'onìl run fot,One ring rules all-them, one ring finds them,
One ring to bring them all and in darkness bind them'Awa ko'onìl zamunge frapot, sì tìvawmì 'awstengyem fot,One ring brings all-them, and darkness-in binds them,
In the Land of Mordor where the Shadows lie.Atxkxemì alu Mortor a tok ayukìl.Land-in that is Mordor (where) are shadows.

Not completely satisfied, but by using the adpositions as affixes, I believe it would be closer to the Dark Speech example we have. Why? Because in Black Speech, affixes are used to indicate location as well.

Herwìna

#23
If you're going to use a word for dwarves that people aren't widely familiar with, why not Khazad, their word for themselves in their own tongue?
Siyevop nga nìzawnong ayukmì, vaykrr oengeyä mefya'o ultxaräpun fìtsap nìmun.

Oe zawng
nga zawng
nìwotx awnga zawng
fte oeti zeykivawng

Ngal yamom fì'ut srak?!

`Eylan Ayfalulukanä

Quote from: Plumps on January 27, 2014, 04:49:36 AM

Well, one could also argue that Tolkien used the image of "the One Ring" only as a metaphor for any tool of power but maybe that is too literary-studies for many people :P

The scholars can argue this stuff back and forth, but they never have any fun. Most of us just enjoy the stories for what they are. A ring is a ring ;)

I am surprised though, that eejmensenikbenhet stuck with in 'Awa ko'onìl zamunge frapot, sì tìvawmì 'awstengyem fot,. is used to join items in a clause, and ulte is used to join clauses and sentences. In this case, two clauses are being joined.

I think Tìtstewan did capture the proper meaning with his translation of Atxkxemì alu Mortor a tok ayukìl. Its good to see the word uk get some usage.

I like Herwina's suggestion of using Khazad for 'dwarf'. It sounds much more 'dwarvish' as well as 'Na'vi-ish'.

In any case, lots of good work being done here!

Yawey ngahu!
pamrel si ro [email protected]

Prrton


Mortormì alu tsatseng a lìng ayuk.

This is very evocative (to me) of the Nazgûl and their ilk, etc.


Plumps

Quote from: Prrton on January 27, 2014, 04:16:28 PM

Mortormì alu tsatseng a lìng ayuk.

This is very evocative (to me) of the Nazgûl and their ilk, etc.

Uuuuuh, good one! :D

Tìtstewan

Here the text in that language, but it have no official source. Maybe we can go with this to be close to Na'vi?
Gakh Nazgi Golug durub-ûri lata-nût,
Udu takob-ishiz gund-ob Gazat-shakh-ûri,
Krith Shara-ûri matûrz matat dûmpuga,
Ash tug Shakhbûrz-ûr Ulîma-tab-ishi za,
Uzg-Mordor-ishi amal fauthut burgûli.
Ash nazg durbatulûk, ash nazg gimbatul,
Ash nazg thrakatulûk, agh burzum-ishi krimpatul
Uzg-Mordor-ishi amal fauthut burgûli.

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`Eylan Ayfalulukanä

Quote from: Prrton on January 27, 2014, 04:16:28 PM

Mortormì alu tsatseng a lìng ayuk.

This is very evocative (to me) of the Nazgûl and their ilk, etc.


That's rather interesting! Although 'float in the air' and 'lie' are opposite in definition, their meaning in this context are close.

Ma Tìtstewan, I am assuming that is the entire original text in Sindarin?

Yawey ngahu!
pamrel si ro [email protected]

Tìtstewan

The "original" is written in the "black language", but we know officially only that inscription on the ring which is written in this language. And that inscription is part of the ring poem.

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`Eylan Ayfalulukanä

Quote from: Tìtstewan on January 27, 2014, 09:29:08 PM
The "original" is written in the "black language", but we know officially only that inscription on the ring which is written in this language. And that inscription is part of the ring poem.

But the black language uses an elvish script?

Yawey ngahu!
pamrel si ro [email protected]

Tìtstewan

The inscription on the ring use elvish letters but it is in the black language. ;)

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Prrton


The tengwar can be used to write almost any language. That's part of its design. The mapping to a specific language is referred to in English as a "mode."


Herwìna

Quote from: Tìtstewan on January 27, 2014, 05:18:20 PM
Here the text in that language, but it have no official source. Maybe we can go with this to be close to Na'vi?
Gakh Nazgi Golug durub-ûri lata-nût,
Udu takob-ishiz gund-ob Gazat-shakh-ûri,
Krith Shara-ûri matûrz matat dûmpuga,
Ash tug Shakhbûrz-ûr Ulîma-tab-ishi za,
Uzg-Mordor-ishi amal fauthut burgûli.
Ash nazg durbatulûk, ash nazg gimbatul,
Ash nazg thrakatulûk, agh burzum-ishi krimpatul
Uzg-Mordor-ishi amal fauthut burgûli.


I suspect this is either Shadowlandian or Svartiska. They're both fan-made conlangs based on what little Black Speech and Orkish can be found in LotR. Shadowlandian is infinitely better btw... Svartiska has several words which are near-direct loans from Swedish... But none of this is really relevant for the topic at hand. :P
Siyevop nga nìzawnong ayukmì, vaykrr oengeyä mefya'o ultxaräpun fìtsap nìmun.

Oe zawng
nga zawng
nìwotx awnga zawng
fte oeti zeykivawng

Ngal yamom fì'ut srak?!

`Eylan Ayfalulukanä

I got quite an education this evening researching the black speech. I also found the extensive dictionary of Shadowlandian. Without what I have learned from studying Naʼvi, much of what I read would have been much harder to understand.

Yawey ngahu!
pamrel si ro [email protected]

Blue Elf

Very nice multi-constructed-language thread :) ;D

As for ontsang - it is nose ring, which probably can't be worn(?) on finger.

My attempt (I haven't read previous attempt in detail to not be influenced.... and using unofficial words I like)



Pxeya pxawzekwä pxeyktanur elfìyä a tawäo
Kinäa pum suteru ahì'i a slärmì a ta tskxe
Volawa pum foanur atsukterkup / Volawa pum foanur a tayerkup trro
'Awa pum eyktanur Tìvawmä (a heyn mì vawma tseng)
Mì atxkxe alu Mortor, tsatseng ayuk lìng
'Awa pxawzekwäl eyk sat nìwotx, 'aw tsun rivun fra'ut
'aw pumìl fra'ut zamunge, yìm sat mì sìvawm
Mì atxkxe alu Mortor, tsatseng ayuk lìng
Three rings to three kings of elves under sky
Seven to small people in the stone cave
Nine to mortal men / Nine to men which die one day
One to the Dark Lord (which sits on dark place)
In the Mordor land, there shadows hover
One ring leads them all, one can find them all
One brings them all, bind them in the dark
In the Mordor land, there shadows hover

Some explanations: translation is quite literal - where verbs aren't used in original, aren't used in translation too.
In first line I used trial twice on purpose - otherwise it look like all three ring goes to the only king (although now it appears like every king receives three rings :) maybe plural is better here as in other lines?)
For "dwarf" I used tute ahì'i (do not confuse with hobbits :)) I think all other is clear enough.
Pitty it doesn't rhyme...
Oe lu skxawng skxakep. Slä oe nerume mi.
"Oe tasyätxaw ulte koren za'u oehu" (Limonádový Joe)


`Eylan Ayfalulukanä

Tsukngop nìtxan, ma Blue Elf!

Yawey ngahu!
pamrel si ro [email protected]