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Paul Frommer's
Language Workbook

[Tirea Aean]

That's the plan 

Now, back in subject: I'd very much like someone to explain what was/is wrong with the way I translated the last sentence (the welcome to stay/feeling lonely one)

I understand. You are welcome to stay, I was starting to feel alone

"Oe tslam. Ngal lu nìprrte’ van ‘ì’awn, oel sngarmä’i ‘efu nì’awtu"

"Oe tslam. 'ivì'awn nìprrte', oe sngarmä'i 'ivefu nì'awtu"

I understand. Remain pleasurably, I was beginning to feel alone.

[Luciancanad]

So my use of van as "you are welcome to keep staying" is incorrect?

[Tirea Aean]

So my use of van as "you are welcome to keep staying" is incorrect?

van is not a word (yet).

var is a verb to continue. e.g.

var nivume!
continue to learn! / Keep learning!

well I suppose if you really want to say it as "keep staying"... but I thought that "you are welcome to stay" even while the person is already staying would be basically the same thing. if you use var, you would just have to put <iv> in the 'ì'awn anyway. so var 'ivì'awn is continue to stay / keep staying. Nothing wrong with that really. I suppose it's preference.

[Blue Elf]

I understand. You are welcome to stay, I was starting to feel alone

I'd translate it as:
Oe tslam. Zola'u nìprrte' fte 'ivì'awn (fìtsenge), oe sngarmä'i 'ivefu nì'awtu
I understand. Welcome (in order) to stay (here). I was starting to feel alone.

[Tirea Aean]

That's good too. There is almost always more than one way to say something

[Luciancanad]

So my use of van as "you are welcome to keep staying" is incorrect?

van is not a word (yet).

var is a verb to continue. e.g.

var nivume!
continue to learn! / Keep learning!

well I suppose if you really want to say it as "keep staying"... but I thought that "you are welcome to stay" even while the person is already staying would be basically the same thing. if you use var, you would just have to put <iv> in the 'ì'awn anyway. so var 'ivì'awn is continue to stay / keep staying. Nothing wrong with that really. I suppose it's preference.

Can't say it's a "preference". It was just the first way that sounded coherent to me. And wow... it really is var, not van... *pulls out my eyes and dips them in cleaning solution* 

And, really... is there any place you DON'T have to put this <iv> infix?  Gotta be the single rule that was most repeated on this post

[Ithisa Kíranem]

You need that <iv> infix whenever that verb is verbed by some other verb. I know that is confusing, so here are examples:

Oel yom teyluti. I eat teylu. No infix in there, since the verb "yom" is independent of another verb.
Oe new yivom teyluti. I want to eat teylu. <iv> infix there, since the verb "yom" is verbed by the verb "new." Note also that in these "double-verb" situations, the subject doesn't take -l.

[Tirea Aean]

modal syntax. check NiaN for more info on requiring iv in modal structures. modal verbs are marked as vm., vtrm., or vim. in the Na'vi-English dictionary.

[Carborundum]

modal syntax. check NiaN for more info on requiring iv in modal structures. modal verbs are marked as vm., vtrm., or vim. in the Na'vi-English dictionary.

This. Not all verbs that are modal in English are modal in Na'vi, and vice versa.

[Luciancanad]

I see. Pretty important then. I still have a couple more phrases translated, but I think i'm having a second look through now that I'm a bit smarter 

[Blue Elf]

modal syntax. check NiaN for more info on requiring iv in modal structures. modal verbs are marked as vm., vtrm., or vim. in the Na'vi-English dictionary.

there is also good post about modals on Naviteri, check it too

[Luciancanad]

Goddamit! Oh! I mean... ahn... Eywa-dammit...

I am suffering to make anything out of NiaN. Only things I was able to understand was what was explained to me here  x_x

Anyway, I made a few changes on the phrases, using whatever I could decypher. You will be the judges 

1: "Sran?" (I'm posting this one just to know which is the right "yes" to use, this or Srane. The character was called and answered "Yes?")

2: "Pe lu tsa'u?" (Questions, questions, woe to me. I haven't got a clue if this is right, couldn't make the question "What is/was that?" work)

3: "Ngey nemfanari" (Another one I don't know the correct format. It's supposed to be "In your eye", as in, "Inside your eye". I looked up this nemfa-, which I assumed to be a preffix, so I stuck it there)

4: "Oeyä nari?" (If this is wrong, I'm giving up on Na'vi...)

5: "Nga teykem swizawit krr a…" (First real alteration, added the <eyk> and the -it, as per what I saw on NiaN)

6: "Ngal plltxe fi’ut?" (Regular issues here. Presence or no of the agentive suffix, and whether the -t is right)

7: "Oel ngati peyang. Oe tsun livawk ’u na’ìnglìsì?" (Agentive suffixes again, plus my first attempt at placing the <iv>. Then there's the 'u, supposed to be "it", not sure if it's right, and the na- to mean "say in English"

Oe srefey ngeyä aysì'eyng 

[Tirea Aean]

I am suffering to make anything out of NiaN. Only things I was able to understand was what was explained to me here  x_x

Anyway, I made a few changes on the phrases, using whatever I could decypher. You will be the judges 

1: "Sran?" (I'm posting this one just to know which is the right "yes" to use, this or Srane. The character was called and answered "Yes?")

2: "Peu lu tsa'u?" (Questions, questions, woe to me. I haven't got a clue if this is right, couldn't make the question "What is/was that?" work)

3: "Ngey narimì / mì ngeyä nari" (Another one I don't know the correct format. It's supposed to be "In your eye", as in, "Inside your eye". I looked up this nemfa-, which I assumed to be a preffix, so I stuck it there)

4: "Oeyä nari srak?" (If this is wrong, I'm giving up on Na'vi...)

5: "Ngal teykem swizawit krr a…" (First real alteration, added the <eyk> and the -it, as per what I saw on NiaN)

6: "Ngal plltxe fi’ut srak?" (Regular issues here. Presence or no of the agentive suffix, and whether the -t is right)

7: "Oel ngati payeng. Oe tsun livawk tsat nì'Ìnglìsì srak?" (Agentive suffixes again, plus my first attempt at placing the <iv>. Then there's the 'u, supposed to be "it", not sure if it's right, and the na- to mean "say in English"

Oel srefey ngeyä aysì'eyngit 

Please include your English translations on ALL sentences , with your little notes and explanations, so I can more easily tell what you are trying to say.

also, Do NOT give up as a result of #4 being not totally correct.

use srak when asking a yes/no question:

• Srake .... ?

OR

• ........ srak?

[Luciancanad]

I shall. And please include explanations on your corrections. I wish to learn.  

And no, I don't intend on giving up. One because it wasn't such a big mistake after all. Two because I'm a stubborn person 

The first three originals are mentioned, fourth I believe to be unnecessary

5: "When you shot the arrow"

6: "You speak of this?"

7: "I will tell you. Can I say it in English?"

Correction questions:

1: Srak is what you use to ask a question without using Pe derivates?

2: How would I use the nemfa- then?

3: I have to place -it whenever the word's an object?

Sorry about the payeng. Something must have short-circuited in here  

[Tirea Aean]

Will do.

I interpreted correctly.

5. in this case, you should have said "Ngal teykem swizawit a krr…" the way you had it, it said "You shoot the arrow when..."

--

1: Srak is what you use to ask a question without using Pe derivates?

srak is for when you ask a yes/no question. it is impossible for a pe+ derivative to be a yes/no question. Use pe+ questions to ask "who, what, which, where, why, when, how" questions. use srak to ask questions for which "srane" or "kehe" is the expected answer.

2: How would I use the nemfa- then?

oh. actually, you could have used nemfa, if you specifically wanted to say inside something, not just in. So really you were right to say either "nemfa ngeyä nari / ngeyä narinemfa" (inside your eye)

3: I have to place -it whenever the word's an object?

yes, that's the whole point of using -it. when the word is a direct object of a transitive verb. but beware, transitivity is not the same across all languages. transitive verbs are marked as vtr. or vtrm. in the Na'vi-English dictionary. also beware mixing up -ru and -ti on some verbs, most notably kar (to teach.)

teach me: kar oeru, not kar oeti.

and then "___ si" verbs, whose english translations are transitive:

help me: srung si oeru, not srung si oeti. (si verbs can never be used with -l and -t)