related grammar questions

Started by Kì'eyawn, March 25, 2010, 07:39:24 PM

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Kì'eyawn

Kaltxì nìmun, ma smuk.  I have several questions which, at least in my mind, are related.

First, i was sitting in class earlier this evening, and i thought of a sentence that i wasn't sure how to translate:

"This is my brother, with whom i hunt."

Would that be Fìpo lu oeyä tsmukan a tutehu taron oe?

And then, from there, i went on to, "This is my brother, to whose home i am going."  And... i didn't know what to do.  A little help, rutxe?

Second, i was thinking about how many different ways the word "that" gets used in English, and i came up with one that (i think) we don't know how to say yet in Na'vi:

"Wow, you've grown so big that i can hardly recognize you!"

If you rephrase into the more cumbersome-sounding "You've grown to the extent/point that...", i'm pretty sure we don't know how to say this yet.  But i wanted to check in case i missed something.

Irayo, ma smuk, ulte Eywa ayngahu.
eo Eywa oe 'ia

Fra'uri tìyawnur oe täpivìng nìwotx...

omängum fra'uti

The second you can say as "I can hardly recognize you because you've grown so big!".  In English we can phrase this either way but it's a different word.  In Na'vi we can use taweyka or aweykta (a weykta) depending on the order of the clause.

For the first, that looks pretty good, though I'm not sure if I'd use the demonstrative form of po there (fìpo) or not.  Perhaps fìtute instead, but then that seems like it would say "This person that I hunt with is my brother" which is close but not quite the same.  However the structure on the whole looks fine to me.
Ftxey lu nga tokx ftxey lu nga tirea? Lu oe tìkeftxo.
Listen to my Na'vi Lessons podcast!

NeotrekkerZ

Do we have confirmation about aweykta?  I remember a while ago there was a similar issue with talun/alunta (I actually don't know if that one got resolved either).
Rìk oe lu hufwemì, nìn fya'ot a oe tswayon!

wm.annis

Quote from: tigermind on March 25, 2010, 07:39:24 PM"This is my brother, with whom i hunt."

Would that be Fìpo lu oeyä tsmukan a tutehu taron oe?

I think I'd just use po inside the attributive clause to refer back to the antecedent (tsmukan), so fìpo lu oeyä tsmukan a pohu taron oel.  I base this choice of po on the fact that Frommer uses just tsa- forms when the antecedent is inanimate, not fì'u or anything like that.

QuoteAnd then, from there, i went on to, "This is my brother, to whose home i am going."  And... i didn't know what to do.  A little help, rutxe?

Fìpo lu oeyä tsmukan a kerä oe kelkune peyä.

QuoteSecond, i was thinking about how many different ways the word "that" gets used in English, and i came up with one that (i think) we don't know how to say yet in Na'vi:

"Wow, you've grown so big that i can hardly recognize you!"

This is called a result clause.  "You've grown (so) large, with the result that..."  We haven't seen these yet.  It should probably go on the list of things to ask Karyu Pawl.

Kì'eyawn

Quote from: wm.annis on March 25, 2010, 08:04:22 PM
Quote from: tigermind on March 25, 2010, 07:39:24 PM"This is my brother, with whom i hunt."

Would that be Fìpo lu oeyä tsmukan a tutehu taron oe?

I think I'd just use po inside the attributive clause to refer back to the antecedent (tsmukan), so fìpo lu oeyä tsmukan a pohu taron oel.  I base this choice of po on the fact that Frommer uses just tsa- forms when the antecedent is inanimate, not fì'u or anything like that.

I...think i understand what you mean, but do you know of any examples you could point me to, ma tsmukan?

Quote
QuoteAnd then, from there, i went on to, "This is my brother, to whose home i am going."  And... i didn't know what to do.  A little help, rutxe?

Fìpo lu oeyä tsmukan a kerä oe kelkune peyä.

See, you're so clever...  That's why i hang out with you guys =)

Quote
QuoteSecond, i was thinking about how many different ways the word "that" gets used in English, and i came up with one that (i think) we don't know how to say yet in Na'vi:

"Wow, you've grown so big that i can hardly recognize you!"

This is called a result clause.  "You've grown (so) large, with the result that..."  We haven't seen these yet.  It should probably go on the list of things to ask Karyu Pawl.

Okay, good to know.  I'll be patient, then.

Irayo ma smuk; i appreciate all your help.

Eywa ayngahu
eo Eywa oe 'ia

Fra'uri tìyawnur oe täpivìng nìwotx...

wm.annis

Quote from: tigermind on March 25, 2010, 08:42:29 PMI...think i understand what you mean, but do you know of any examples you could point me to, ma tsmukan?

See how Frommer uses tsa- in this Canon entry.

Kì'eyawn

Quote from: wm.annis on March 25, 2010, 08:48:31 PM
Quote from: tigermind on March 25, 2010, 08:42:29 PMI...think i understand what you mean, but do you know of any examples you could point me to, ma tsmukan?

See how Frommer uses tsa- in this Canon entry.

Txantsan.  Irayo nìmun, ma tsmukan.
eo Eywa oe 'ia

Fra'uri tìyawnur oe täpivìng nìwotx...