Adjective out of a noun out of an adjective?

[Muzer]

Say I want to say the word "truthful" or something similar. In English it's not problem because "truth" is a word in its own right, but in Na'vi it's not so simple because "truth", tìngay, is already the nominalised version of "true", ngay. Would you use le- to turn it back into an adjective that actually means "truthful" (letìngay), or would you turn true directly into truthful even though it doesn't really make much sense to turn an adjective into an adjective (lengay), or would you do something else, or do we not have a way of expressing "truthful" yet? Or heck, would you just use "ngay"?

[Feiane]

What's the difference between "true" and "truthful" ? Aren't they synonyms?

[Muzer]

Hmm - "Being true" might possibly translate as "being correct" (I don't know). In English, when you refer to a person, you can also mean legitimate, genuine or faithful (being true to oneself). I don't know which of these apply to Na'vi, but it's reasonably probable that for a person to be true doesn't mean for them to be truthful.

[kewnya txamew'itan]

Say I want to say the word "truthful" or something similar. In English it's not problem because "truth" is a word in its own right, but in Na'vi it's not so simple because "truth", tìngay, is already the nominalised version of "true", ngay. Would you use le- to turn it back into an adjective that actually means "truthful" (letìngay), or would you turn true directly into truthful even though it doesn't really make much sense to turn an adjective into an adjective (lengay), or would you do something else, or do we not have a way of expressing "truthful" yet? Or heck, would you just use "ngay"?

There is no way that we know of.

[`Eylan Ayfalulukanä]

This is a very good question, as this is the kind of thing that trips me up more than anything else in trying to translate. 'truth' and 'truthful' are excellent examples of related words with similar but notably disparate meanings and feelings. There are many others.

[Feiane]

I keep running into similar things as well. An example from earlier this week is communicative vs. contagious. Both words would be used interchangeably by an average person to describe a disease that's easy to catch, but when describing other things such as "Her laughter was communicative" you just sound bizarre and convey a different meaning compared to "Her laughter was contagious."

[Nìwotxkrr Tìyawn]

It doesn't sound all that bizarre to me actually, don't know about anyone else.

[kewnya txamew'itan]

It doesn't sound all that bizarre to me actually, don't know about anyone else.

It sounds strange to me (south east England), whereabouts are you from (in case it's a regional variation)?

[Nìwotxkrr Tìyawn]

Wisconsin in the US, it's probably just me though, I like to use words people don't hear often.

[Muzer]

Sounds odd to me - my instinct would be that it means laughter that gets a message across (that communicates), whatever on Earth (or indeed Pandora) that message would be, other than that you find something funny

(And yes, I did know the word communicative as far as diseases go - it's just I wouldn't associate that word with laughter)

(South England)

[`Eylan Ayfalulukanä]

I keep running into similar things as well. An example from earlier this week is communicative vs. contagious. Both words would be used interchangeably by an average person to describe a disease that's easy to catch, but when describing other things such as "Her laughter was communicative" you just sound bizarre and convey a different meaning compared to "Her laughter was contagious."

This is a particularly interesting pair of words. I have usually seen 'communicative' as 'communicable', and about the only place this term is used is in medical circles. 'Contagious', as you point out, can have very different feelings, but when you get down to it, they are really the same meaning.

To have a word for both 'communicable' and 'contagious' would probably not be a good use of 'word resources'. It would be like me throwing out word suggestions for physics or astronomy or biology terms that describe everyday events.

Another possibility for a confusing set of words would be 'danger' and 'endangered'. hrrap s<am>i?

[Feiane]

My point was, the language doesn't need distinctive words for true and truthful just like how we don't need distinctive words for communicative and contagious. They mean the same thing, we're just used to seeing the words used for separate situations.

[kewnya txamew'itan]

What about nouns from adjective from nouns like deadliness?

Surely deadliness doesn't equal death?

[omängum fra'uti]

It seems to me the words you're asking about in this thread share roots with other words, but have become their own lexical definition.

For true/truthful, there are some cases where they aren't synonyms.  Truthful is specifically saying one who speaks truly.  It has the root in the word true, but it is more to it than just an adjective form.  It is its own lexical identity.  Within the context of conversation or discourse, it can be taken to be a synonym of course.

Communicable is another word that has it's own lexical identity.  (Though -able words in general I don't think we have a way to form.)  Literally, it's something able to be communicated, and that is one definition.  But the sense of a communicable disease is something completely different.  (Incidentally, for "Contageous laughter" it would probably be something like "tìhusangham avusirä".)

Endangered has two meanings.  Probably the more common these days doesn't necessarily have to do with actual danger, and that would be an endangered species.  The other meaning is something threatened with danger.  Again not something I could say how it would be said in Na'vi off the top of my head, but it's possible it would be said in some way that is conceptually different.  Rather than "I was endangered", perhaps, "Danger was close to me".  Hrrap lolok.