Adpositions

Started by Pxia Säsngap, June 01, 2010, 09:11:33 AM

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Pxia Säsngap

Kaltxì

Learning about the adpositions (topic 7.1 Nutshell Guide) I came across some word that aren't clear to me. As I'm not a native speaker, the translations don't help.  :(
Could you please "translate" the following adpositions for me? When/in which cases do I have to use them?
"fkip"
"tafkip"

Is "uo" concerning a location?

What is the difference between "na" and "pxel"?

In which case do I have to use "fpi+"?

Thank you very much in advance. =)
Eywa ayngahu
Ma oeyä eylan aynga oeru yawne lu <3 ;D :D ;D

kewnya txamew'itan

I'm not sure about fkip and tafkip, the translations aren't very clear to me either and we don't have any examples that I know of.

Anyway, I think they might be used in the following context:

sa'nok: ma 'itan! pesenge tok ma 'itan! za'u ne oe pxìset!
*'ite pähem*
sa'nok: kolame ngeyä tsmukan srak? ngal omum tsengit a pol tok srak?
'ite: sran, pol tok kxayla ayvulfkip kelutralä.
sa'nok: txo po ke ziva'u tafkip sa'u oe sti nìtxan!

As I say, I'm not sure, but I think that's roughly how you could use them.

uo is indeed referring to location.

I don't think we have a difference between na and pxel at the moment, we used to think pxel was a conjunction but we now know that that's wrong so I think that the answer is that we don't know.

Again with fpi+, we're not really sure when you could use it. The only thing I'm pretty much sure of is that for god's sake would be fpi eywa, other than that, it's a bit fuzzy. I think that a lot of uses of the topical can be avoided using it, such as the sentence "fìskawngìri oe tsap'alute si" which I think could be put as "fìskxawngfpi oe tsap'alute si" likewise thanking phases like "fìsrungìri irayo seiyi oe" could be reworded "fìsrungfpi irayo seiyi oe" in my opinion. I'm not sure how solid these are linguistically but they seem reasonable to me.
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Pxia Säsngap

Ma Kemeoauniaea(I always copy and paste your name because I can't remember  ;D )
Thank you for your answer. =)
Na and pxel are synonyms, then? Or might that be changed soon?
Oe irayo seiyi ngaru tìkenongìri teri "fkip" sì "tafkip". (is that correct?  :D )

Frapoya:
Has anyone additional information?
Eywa ayngahu
Ma oeyä eylan aynga oeru yawne lu <3 ;D :D ;D

kewnya txamew'itan

#3
If it's easier you can shorten my name to kewnya.

For now yes they are. It might change, it might not, I don't know.

And yes that was corect.
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Tsamsiyu92

I think somebody translated fpi as "for the sake/benefit of"

Pxia Säsngap

Well, ma tsamsiyu92, that's the problem:
I've read the translation as well, and I even understand it, but as in my mother tongue there isn't a good translation for it(at least I can't find one), I hoped that you could give me an example for the situations in which I have to use it. Kawnya gave some example which is very helpful, I think, but he said that this is a bit fuzzy still and so I asked for someone else who maybe knows better(if possible) to shed some light on this topic and also the other ones, which couldn't be answered yet(just like if kawnya's example about fkip and tafkip was correct or if anybody has heard something different about the difference between na and pxel,...)  :)

As you can already see ma Kawnya, I could fix the short form of your name in my memory much better.  :D
Eywa ayngahu
Ma oeyä eylan aynga oeru yawne lu <3 ;D :D ;D

kewnya txamew'itan

I've just looked at the stresses in meoauniaea, kewnya might be a bit better, otherwise I've dropped the stressed syllable.  :P
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Tsamsiyu92

One of the quoteworthly Na'vi thread quotes are a great example of fpi

"Fpi fra'u asiltsan, fpi fra'u atxur, ..."
"For the sake of everything good, for the sake of everything strong..."



I think it is also use when you do something for the benefit of others like:

"Oel taron fpi Na'vi."
"I hunt for the benefit of the people".

omängum fra'uti

Oe fìkem seri fpi nga
I am doing this for you
Ftxey lu nga tokx ftxey lu nga tirea? Lu oe tìkeftxo.
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Pxia Säsngap

Thank you so very much. These were helpful answers. =)
So I can use it:
-avoiding the topical
-"for Eywa's sake"
-verb sth for sb('s benefit)

Quote from: Tsamsiyu92 on June 01, 2010, 03:17:04 PM
"Fpi fra'u asiltsan, fpi fra'u atxur, ..."
"For the sake of everything good, for the sake of everything strong..."

I like that quote.  :) That's a good example. Irayo. =)
Eywa ayngahu
Ma oeyä eylan aynga oeru yawne lu <3 ;D :D ;D

Pxia Säsngap

Quote from: kemeoauniaea on June 01, 2010, 03:15:13 PM
I've just looked at the stresses in meoauniaea, kewnya might be a bit better, otherwise I've dropped the stressed syllable.  :P

Well, ok, then Kewnya.  :) That's also easier to remember than (wait a moment, so I can copy it  hrh) kemeoauniaea.  ;D
Eywa ayngahu
Ma oeyä eylan aynga oeru yawne lu <3 ;D :D ;D

Stars

Quote from: kewnya txamew'itan on June 01, 2010, 09:51:49 AM
I don't think we have a difference between na and pxel at the moment, we used to think pxel was a conjunction but we now know that that's wrong so I think that the answer is that we don't know.

Kaltxì!  :D
I know this is an old post, but I wanted to ask if we now know the difference (if there is one) between "na" and "pxel".

wm.annis

Quote from: Stars on October 29, 2010, 08:46:17 PMI know this is an old post, but I wanted to ask if we now know the difference (if there is one) between "na" and "pxel".

From the workshop: they are synonyms, though na is more common.

Stars

Ooh, that was fast.  ;D
Thank you very much!