Author Topic: NeuraltNätverk's basic crap thread  (Read 5267 times)

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Offline kewnya txamew'itan

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Re: NeuraltNätverk's basic crap thread
« Reply #100 on: July 12, 2010, 08:24:31 am »
I wouldn't know, I've never watched futurama much.
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Offline NeuraltNätverk

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Re: NeuraltNätverk's basic crap thread
« Reply #101 on: July 12, 2010, 10:44:00 am »
Lastly, using frapol would be wrong (even assuming you dropped the adposition to keep the direct object) because they are in different clauses. -l is only used if the clause that noun is in has a direct object, a introduces a new clause which has the direct object, but that doesn't affect the noun outside that relative clause.

Right that's what I meant.

I really don't think <ei> is an appropriate translation here, for one thing the f***ing is an attribute of the magnet not a property of the verb, and secondly, it's pejorative whereas <ei> is the opposite.

Have you seen the ICP - Miracles video though lololol?
"Uhh ... we should put it out something that it likes and then when it comes to get it we can kill it."
"Oh yeah heh heh ... cool ... um heh ... what do flies like?"
"Uhh ... they like garbage and crap."
"Oh yeah yeah heh heh ... flies are pretty cool sometimes, yeah eh heh heh."

Offline Kì'eyawn

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Re: NeuraltNätverk's basic crap thread
« Reply #102 on: July 12, 2010, 12:38:57 pm »
I wouldn't know, I've never watched futurama much.

Heeheehee.  You should find the "snu-snu" episode.  It would add important info to your knowledge ;)
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Re: NeuraltNätverk's basic crap thread
« Reply #103 on: July 12, 2010, 06:57:19 pm »
I couldn't find "snu" in the dictionary, what's it's definition?

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Re: NeuraltNätverk's basic crap thread
« Reply #104 on: July 13, 2010, 03:20:37 am »
I couldn't find "snu" in the dictionary, what's it's definition?

Of course you couldn't. :P

Quote from: K.
That said, we tentatively have a verb roughly equivalent to f*** in terms of use and offence courtesy of some of the other mods (mainly skxawng I think) which is snu, the noun form being snusnu not tìsnu, to make it an adjective you'd use <us> to get sn<us>u and then use an attributive -a-.[/quote

Offline kewnya txamew'itan

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Re: NeuraltNätverk's basic crap thread
« Reply #105 on: July 13, 2010, 03:22:37 am »
I couldn't find "snu" in the dictionary, what's it's definition?

It's an unofficial dirty word, pretty much equivalent to f***, although given na'vi mating practices I imagine it more as being "to mate without bonding" (as the bonding would secure the lifelong emotional bond that seems to be a positive thing).

Edit: ninja'd (I propose a new word, nintsya meaning "to kill-steal (in hunting)" adapted from the tawtute use on forums such as these.
« Last Edit: July 13, 2010, 03:24:16 am by kemeoauniaea »
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Offline Taronyu

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Re: NeuraltNätverk's basic crap thread
« Reply #106 on: July 13, 2010, 03:24:06 am »
I couldn't find "snu" in the dictionary, what's it's definition?

It's an unofficial dirty word, pretty much equivalent to f***, although given na'vi mating practices I imagine it more as being "to mate without bonding" (as the bonding would secure the lifelong emotional bond that seems to be a positive thing).

Edit: ninja'd

And you're saying that mating without lifelong emotional bonding is a bad thing? What planet are you from? Because it's not 'Rrta.

Got to love biological imperatives. SNU!

Offline kewnya txamew'itan

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Re: NeuraltNätverk's basic crap thread
« Reply #107 on: July 13, 2010, 03:42:34 am »
I meant that, given how prevalent monogamy is amongst the na'vi, it would almost certainly be perceived as such, biological imperatives or no. Anyway, if the only way the na'vi can bond sufficiently to be able to ensure the wellbeing of a child is tsaheylu and monogamy then that trait could be evolutionarily preferable to everyone sneru. Anyway, if we continue like this one of us'll have to split this wit half going in to customs and culture.
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Offline NeuraltNätverk

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Re: NeuraltNätverk's basic crap thread
« Reply #108 on: July 14, 2010, 12:12:48 am »
Alright I made a blue coolface with yellow eyes and hair

Now I want it to say "Problem, colonel?"

"Oe tsun ngaru srung sivi srak, ma Quaritch?"

idk
"Uhh ... we should put it out something that it likes and then when it comes to get it we can kill it."
"Oh yeah heh heh ... cool ... um heh ... what do flies like?"
"Uhh ... they like garbage and crap."
"Oh yeah yeah heh heh ... flies are pretty cool sometimes, yeah eh heh heh."

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Re: NeuraltNätverk's basic crap thread
« Reply #109 on: July 14, 2010, 06:20:32 am »
Sounds good, but wouldn't this work to, try to shorten it down maybe

"Kin ngal srungìt srak, ma Quatrich?"
"Do you need help, quatrich?"

Offline NeuraltNätverk

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Re: NeuraltNätverk's basic crap thread
« Reply #110 on: July 15, 2010, 02:14:12 am »
Autodidacticism

How about

"Oel käperar lì'fyati leNa'vi."

I don't want to put "nerume" here. I mean to emphasize the autodidacticism. Granted, it's almost a given for such a language but assume I might want to swap out French or something there.

Also: "passably" - "nìletam" ?
« Last Edit: July 15, 2010, 02:28:51 am by NeuraltNätverk »
"Uhh ... we should put it out something that it likes and then when it comes to get it we can kill it."
"Oh yeah heh heh ... cool ... um heh ... what do flies like?"
"Uhh ... they like garbage and crap."
"Oh yeah yeah heh heh ... flies are pretty cool sometimes, yeah eh heh heh."

Offline Payä Tìrol

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Re: NeuraltNätverk's basic crap thread
« Reply #111 on: July 15, 2010, 07:09:25 am »
Does adding a direct object like that force the subject of a reflexive verb to take the ergative? The examples in NiaN all take the abs/nom, but they're all simpler sentences.

Also, sufficiently looks great for that meaning.
« Last Edit: July 15, 2010, 07:13:32 am by Payä Tìrol »
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Re: NeuraltNätverk's basic crap thread
« Reply #112 on: July 15, 2010, 11:05:06 am »
Autodidacticism

How about

"Oel käperar lì'fyati leNa'vi."

I don't want to put "nerume" here. I mean to emphasize the autodidacticism. Granted, it's almost a given for such a language but assume I might want to swap out French or something there.

I'm not sure about <äp>, I think it needs to be clarified as to when it is used, whether it is only used if the accusative is the same as the subject or whether it depends on whether any object is the same as the subject. I believe that only the former is attested in which case you'd need to drop the <äp> and stick the oeru back in again. If the latter option is the case then your sentence would be correct.

Does adding a direct object like that force the subject of a reflexive verb to take the ergative? The examples in NiaN all take the abs/nom, but they're all simpler sentences.

I believe the accusative would still force the ergative, the question is whether the <äp> is correct, the -l almost certainly is.
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Offline Payä Tìrol

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Re: NeuraltNätverk's basic crap thread
« Reply #113 on: July 15, 2010, 11:37:46 am »
So, if <äp> isn't appropriate, I guess it would be Oe-l k<er>ar oe-ru lì'fya-ti leNa'vi.? That sounds a bit awkward, personally >_>

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Offline NeuraltNätverk

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Re: NeuraltNätverk's basic crap thread
« Reply #114 on: July 15, 2010, 02:14:12 pm »
So, if <äp> isn't appropriate, I guess it would be Oe-l k<er>ar oe-ru lì'fya-ti leNa'vi.? That sounds a bit awkward, personally >_>

Not really.

Jag lär mig Na'vi.

Same thing basically.

I'm going to leave -äp- until I know for sure though.
"Uhh ... we should put it out something that it likes and then when it comes to get it we can kill it."
"Oh yeah heh heh ... cool ... um heh ... what do flies like?"
"Uhh ... they like garbage and crap."
"Oh yeah yeah heh heh ... flies are pretty cool sometimes, yeah eh heh heh."

Offline `Eylan Ayfalulukanä

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Re: NeuraltNätverk's basic crap thread
« Reply #115 on: July 16, 2010, 02:48:59 pm »
Doesn't the <äp> infix render the verb intransitive? Since the verb acts on the 'verber', there can be no direct object. Therefore, the case of the subject of such a phrase would not be case-marked at all.

As far as 'kill-steal' goes, the correct term for that process is 'appropriate'. Example: The lion appropriated the zebra the hyenas had killed.

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Offline NeuraltNätverk

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Re: NeuraltNätverk's basic crap thread
« Reply #116 on: July 16, 2010, 03:31:25 pm »
Doesn't the <äp> infix render the verb intransitive? Since the verb acts on the 'verber', there can be no direct object. Therefore, the case of the subject of such a phrase would not be case-marked at all.

I can't speak for Na'vi but many languages take transitive reflexive verbs for granted.
"Uhh ... we should put it out something that it likes and then when it comes to get it we can kill it."
"Oh yeah heh heh ... cool ... um heh ... what do flies like?"
"Uhh ... they like garbage and crap."
"Oh yeah yeah heh heh ... flies are pretty cool sometimes, yeah eh heh heh."

Offline kewnya txamew'itan

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Re: NeuraltNätverk's basic crap thread
« Reply #117 on: July 16, 2010, 04:42:26 pm »
Doesn't the <äp> infix render the verb intransitive? Since the verb acts on the 'verber', there can be no direct object. Therefore, the case of the subject of such a phrase would not be case-marked at all.

As far as 'kill-steal' goes, the correct term for that process is 'appropriate'. Example: The lion appropriated the zebra the hyenas had killed.

1. Not necessarily. If the reflexive is also taken if the dative is the same person as the subject then it would merge those two arguments and leave the accusative standing thus requiring the ergative not the nominative. If the reflexive is only used when the direct object is the same person as the subject then you are correct that it would render it intransitive.

2. Not really. Kill-stealing is the act of killing something just before someone who did all the hard work was about and thus appropriating the benefits (for a hunter, the food or for a warrior, the honour). For a lion to kill-steal from the hyenas he'd have to let them run the prey down and wear it out before killing it and eating it just as they were about to strike. (Anyway, on a not entirely relevant note, aren't hyenas scavengers?)
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Offline `Eylan Ayfalulukanä

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Re: NeuraltNätverk's basic crap thread
« Reply #118 on: July 17, 2010, 02:14:44 am »
Doesn't the <äp> infix render the verb intransitive? Since the verb acts on the 'verber', there can be no direct object. Therefore, the case of the subject of such a phrase would not be case-marked at all.

As far as 'kill-steal' goes, the correct term for that process is 'appropriate'. Example: The lion appropriated the zebra the hyenas had killed.

1. Not necessarily. If the reflexive is also taken if the dative is the same person as the subject then it would merge those two arguments and leave the accusative standing thus requiring the ergative not the nominative. If the reflexive is only used when the direct object is the same person as the subject then you are correct that it would render it intransitive.

So, if I understand what you are saying here, if the subject receives the action of the reflexive verbing, than the subject takes the ergative. There is still just one noun and one verb. That said, I cannot see how this would differ much from the intransitive case you mentioned second.


Quote from: kemeoauniaea
2. Not really. Kill-stealing is the act of killing something just before someone who did all the hard work was about and thus appropriating the benefits (for a hunter, the food or for a warrior, the honour). For a lion to kill-steal from the hyenas he'd have to let them run the prey down and wear it out before killing it and eating it just as they were about to strike. (Anyway, on a not entirely relevant note, aren't hyenas scavengers?)

I see the difference in the shade of meaning here. In the lion-hyena case, the prey is probably glad for the lion to show up, to rather quickly put it out of its misery vs being eaten to death by hyenas. Hyenas are actually excellent hunters in their own right, and on the grand scheme of things, actually a more significant-to-the-ecosystem predator than the lion. The lion, like toruk and palulukan, is just the apex predator. On Pandora, from what we know, the aynantangs sì ayikran are probably the most important predators.

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Offline kewnya txamew'itan

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Re: NeuraltNätverk's basic crap thread
« Reply #119 on: July 17, 2010, 03:16:37 am »
1. No, if we have a ditransitive verb with 3 arguments, the subject (S), the direct object (O) and the indirect object (D), we know that the reflexive can unify S and O if they are the same person and replace them with a nominative. What we don't know, is whether it can unify S and D, if it could, O would still be there in the accusative, so S would have to be in the ergative.
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