Author Topic: NeuraltNätverk's basic crap thread  (Read 5266 times)

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Offline wm.annis

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Re: NeuraltNätverk's basic crap thread
« Reply #60 on: July 07, 2010, 11:00:20 am »
"Fpole' ayngal oer fìtxan nìftxavang a 'upxare-t stolawm oel."

Ugh left branching!!!

How common is this kind of monstrosity?

Monstrosity?  What on earth is wrong with left branching?

It's not uncommon, though I suspect most people learning Na'vi more naturally fall into right branching habits.
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Offline NeuraltNätverk

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Re: NeuraltNätverk's basic crap thread
« Reply #61 on: July 07, 2010, 11:09:11 am »
"Fpole' ayngal oer fìtxan nìftxavang a 'upxare-t stolawm oel."

Ugh left branching!!!

How common is this kind of monstrosity?

Monstrosity?  What on earth is wrong with left branching?

I've never been a fan of it.

The more right branching a language is, other beings equal, the more I like it.

Also how can I say "I like X"? I'm thinking: "X mowan oeru lu."

More specifically, I'm jerking someone's chain on facebook: "Mipa uniltìrantokx oeyä mowan ngaru lu srak?" He said he liked my new ... profile pic.
« Last Edit: July 07, 2010, 11:13:46 am by NeuraltNätverk »
"Uhh ... we should put it out something that it likes and then when it comes to get it we can kill it."
"Oh yeah heh heh ... cool ... um heh ... what do flies like?"
"Uhh ... they like garbage and crap."
"Oh yeah yeah heh heh ... flies are pretty cool sometimes, yeah eh heh heh."

Offline kewnya txamew'itan

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Re: NeuraltNätverk's basic crap thread
« Reply #62 on: July 07, 2010, 12:12:09 pm »
So are you saying there wouldn't be a serious issue with rewriting the passage in NiaN 5.9 with simple past tense in every instance of present tense perfect aspect

If one's preferred I'll try to hold myself to it, but if the distinction is small enough I'll just use whatever seems good from my Anglophone perspective

Perfective not perfect, they're different aspects. The perfect draws attention to the consequences of an action as well as implying a perfective aspect.

As for "X likes Y" we don't have a good translation but "mowan lu Y Xru" (or some variant on the word order) would work, if an action is liked though, I'd use "Y prrte' lu Xru" following Frommer's example in the "tsun oe pivängkxo..." quote.
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Offline NeuraltNätverk

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Re: NeuraltNätverk's basic crap thread
« Reply #63 on: July 07, 2010, 12:23:09 pm »
Oh ok so my troll comment from above is correct

No actually I like that mowan + dative idiom. It's nice. It's like "Es gefällt mir"
"Uhh ... we should put it out something that it likes and then when it comes to get it we can kill it."
"Oh yeah heh heh ... cool ... um heh ... what do flies like?"
"Uhh ... they like garbage and crap."
"Oh yeah yeah heh heh ... flies are pretty cool sometimes, yeah eh heh heh."

Offline kewnya txamew'itan

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Re: NeuraltNätverk's basic crap thread
« Reply #64 on: July 07, 2010, 12:32:30 pm »
It's also a similar construction to the Spanish gustarle.

That said, it is interesting that there seems to be distinction for liking nouns and verbs (apparently prrte' is for actions only so the phrase "to like" would presumably reflect that) although it makes sense that there might be one.
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Offline Kì'eyawn

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Re: NeuraltNätverk's basic crap thread
« Reply #65 on: July 07, 2010, 04:48:10 pm »
"Fpole' ayngal oer fìtxan nìftxavang a 'upxare-t stolawm oel."

Ugh left branching!!!

How common is this kind of monstrosity?

Kaltxì, ma tsmuk.  The left branching thing is still hard for me to wrap my head around.

Quote
Also how can I say "I like X"? Something along the lines of "X mowan oeru lu"?

Specifically, I'm trolling someone on facebook who said he likes my new avatar (profile pic), and said: "Mipa uniltìrantokx oeyä mowan ngaru lu srak?"

Well, there's nothing grammatically wrong with that as far as i can see, but typically you'll see X oeru prrte' lu.
eo Eywa oe 'ia

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Offline kewnya txamew'itan

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Re: NeuraltNätverk's basic crap thread
« Reply #66 on: July 07, 2010, 05:22:46 pm »
Looking at the dictionary there's a note (I presume it;s Frommerian) that says that prrte' is for actions so "to like (a noun)" couldn't use it and would probably use mowan instead.
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Offline Kì'eyawn

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Re: NeuraltNätverk's basic crap thread
« Reply #67 on: July 07, 2010, 05:25:53 pm »
Looking at the dictionary there's a note (I presume it;s Frommerian) that says that prrte' is for actions so "to like (a noun)" couldn't use it and would probably use mowan instead.

Good point, ma kemeoauniaea.  Ngaru tìyawr latsu.
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Offline Taronyu

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Re: NeuraltNätverk's basic crap thread
« Reply #68 on: July 07, 2010, 06:17:46 pm »
Looking at the dictionary there's a note (I presume it;s Frommerian) that says that prrte' is for actions so "to like (a noun)" couldn't use it and would probably use mowan instead.

It is certainly Frommerian.

Offline wm.annis

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Re: NeuraltNätverk's basic crap thread
« Reply #69 on: July 07, 2010, 09:23:45 pm »
So are you saying there wouldn't be a serious issue with rewriting the passage in NiaN 5.9 with simple past tense in every instance of present tense perfect aspect

If one's preferred I'll try to hold myself to it, but if the distinction is small enough I'll just use whatever seems good from my Anglophone perspective

The best instruction for this is when you're a bit more comfortable with Na'vi to stare carefully at Frommer's larger Na'vi productions.  Pure aspect is marked much more regularly than tense or the tense+aspect combined infixes.  Once a temporal context has been established, there's no need to keep banging on the tense until a relevant change occurs.
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Offline NeuraltNätverk

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Re: NeuraltNätverk's basic crap thread
« Reply #70 on: July 08, 2010, 01:01:04 pm »
Right, will do

How's this

"Ke vawm seykivi sawsìp Yu E Seyä keyru Eywa’evengyä kawkrr"

I'm trolling a thread somewhere about whether nationalism is a good thing and I want it to say "May American sky-ships never again darken the face of Pandora" lolololol
"Uhh ... we should put it out something that it likes and then when it comes to get it we can kill it."
"Oh yeah heh heh ... cool ... um heh ... what do flies like?"
"Uhh ... they like garbage and crap."
"Oh yeah yeah heh heh ... flies are pretty cool sometimes, yeah eh heh heh."

Offline Payä Tìrol

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Re: NeuraltNätverk's basic crap thread
« Reply #71 on: July 08, 2010, 01:39:46 pm »
How about:
Ke kunsìp Amerìkan-ä taw-ru atxkxe-yä Eywa-yä kawkrr tì-vawm s<eyk><ìyev>i.
May an American gunship never darken the skies of the land of Eywa in the future.

-I think the future tense is necessary, I'm not sure if it's acceptable to express a wish against something that's already happened.
-"Face of planet" feels pretty idiomatic to me, I'd think something like the skies of a planet would probably work better.
-I think vawm would need to be noun-ized before it be attached to si to make darken

I'm not sure how I would go about saying American or Pandora, lemme see if I can come up with something...

Ok, I *just* figured out that you were trying to say USAyä with that, it was bugging me for a while.
« Last Edit: July 08, 2010, 02:51:47 pm by Payä Tìrol »
Oeyä atanìl mì sìvawm, mipa tìreyä tìsìlpeyur yat terìng

Offline NeuraltNätverk

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Re: NeuraltNätverk's basic crap thread
« Reply #72 on: July 08, 2010, 01:51:27 pm »
iyev is right.

tìvawm is right.

I'm not sure about the others

Ke has to go immediately before the verb it modifies

Eywa'eveng means "child of Gaia" (word for Pandora in the dictionary) so it makes especial sense to use "face" with it metaphorically, I think. I'm sticking to it

"Ke tìvawm seykiyevi sawsìp Yu E Seyä keyru Eywa’evengyä kawkrr"
"Uhh ... we should put it out something that it likes and then when it comes to get it we can kill it."
"Oh yeah heh heh ... cool ... um heh ... what do flies like?"
"Uhh ... they like garbage and crap."
"Oh yeah yeah heh heh ... flies are pretty cool sometimes, yeah eh heh heh."

Offline Payä Tìrol

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Re: NeuraltNätverk's basic crap thread
« Reply #73 on: July 08, 2010, 01:57:45 pm »
Ah, I must have missed the child of Ewya thing, and you're right about Ke, I forgot about it >.<
Oeyä atanìl mì sìvawm, mipa tìreyä tìsìlpeyur yat terìng

Offline NeuraltNätverk

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Re: NeuraltNätverk's basic crap thread
« Reply #74 on: July 08, 2010, 02:00:29 pm »
But then I just noticed the genitive is buggered (I always get the endings mixed up) so:

"Ke tìvawm seykiyevi sawsìp Yu E Seyä keyru Eywa’evengä kawkrr"

That's my final answer lol
"Uhh ... we should put it out something that it likes and then when it comes to get it we can kill it."
"Oh yeah heh heh ... cool ... um heh ... what do flies like?"
"Uhh ... they like garbage and crap."
"Oh yeah yeah heh heh ... flies are pretty cool sometimes, yeah eh heh heh."

Offline Payä Tìrol

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Re: NeuraltNätverk's basic crap thread
« Reply #75 on: July 08, 2010, 02:01:57 pm »
But then I just noticed the genitive is buggered (I always get the endings mixed up) so:

"Ke tìvawm seykìyevi tawsìp Yu E Seyä keyru Eywa’evengä kawkrr"

That's my final answer lol

Sorry! :P
Oeyä atanìl mì sìvawm, mipa tìreyä tìsìlpeyur yat terìng

Offline NeuraltNätverk

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Re: NeuraltNätverk's basic crap thread
« Reply #76 on: July 08, 2010, 02:03:34 pm »
What do you like it or do you think something should be changed

I'm open for criticism, that's what this thread is here for
"Uhh ... we should put it out something that it likes and then when it comes to get it we can kill it."
"Oh yeah heh heh ... cool ... um heh ... what do flies like?"
"Uhh ... they like garbage and crap."
"Oh yeah yeah heh heh ... flies are pretty cool sometimes, yeah eh heh heh."

Offline Payä Tìrol

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Re: NeuraltNätverk's basic crap thread
« Reply #77 on: July 08, 2010, 02:04:48 pm »
Oh, no I changed seykiyevi to seykìyevi and sawsìp to tawsìp, minor stuff :3
Sorry, if the bolding was hard to see.
I also think we need a better way to say American, but I'm bad at making equivalent sounds for these sort of things, I'd defer to someone else..
Oeyä atanìl mì sìvawm, mipa tìreyä tìsìlpeyur yat terìng

Offline NeuraltNätverk

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Re: NeuraltNätverk's basic crap thread
« Reply #78 on: July 08, 2010, 02:08:27 pm »
Oh, no I changed seykiyevi to seykìyevi and sawsìp to tawsìp, minor stuff :3

There's a choice for the future subjunctive infix, I think

Tawsìp undergoes lenition ... obviously someone saying what I wrote would be concerned about all possible inbound "sky-ships", not just one
"Uhh ... we should put it out something that it likes and then when it comes to get it we can kill it."
"Oh yeah heh heh ... cool ... um heh ... what do flies like?"
"Uhh ... they like garbage and crap."
"Oh yeah yeah heh heh ... flies are pretty cool sometimes, yeah eh heh heh."

Offline Payä Tìrol

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Re: NeuraltNätverk's basic crap thread
« Reply #79 on: July 08, 2010, 02:11:12 pm »
oh, I can't believe I forgot that...
Yeah, I guess I'd be wrong on both then.

And to think I just spent like 10 minutes yesterday looking for keyey in the dictionary before I found kxeyey. That wouldn't be the first time either.

Needless to say, I'm not a huge fan of the short form plurals :(
Oeyä atanìl mì sìvawm, mipa tìreyä tìsìlpeyur yat terìng

 

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