Author Topic: Noob question...  (Read 1025 times)

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Offline Oeyä Nantang

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Noob question...
« on: July 23, 2010, 08:43:18 am »
Where exactly do the verbal tense fit into a word. It doesnt really say in the crash course and I am having trouble understanding it with NIAN. I feel seriously noobish right now  :(

Tsamsiyu92

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Re: Noob question...
« Reply #1 on: July 23, 2010, 08:53:37 am »
It is not really hard at all. A verb has two infix position, in most (all?) non-compound verbs it is the last and second to last sylliable. They are right before the sylliable's first vowel.

Examples
L<1><2>u - lu (to be)
T<1>ar<2>on - taron (to hunt)
Tsw<1>ay<2>on - tswayon (to fly)
<1>om<2>um - omum (to know)

There are tree kinds of infixes, pre-first (e.g. eyk and äp)
tense/aspect infixes, goes where I marked <1> (e.g. am, ìm, ìy, ay)
Mood infixes, goes where it's marked <2> (e.g. ei, äng and ats)

Understand a bit of it now?

<ol> and infixes like <alm>, <ìlm>, <ìly and <aly> are to express that you have finished an action. Ofen like "have verbed"/"will have verbed" in English

Oe talmaron trram. I have hunted yesterday.

<er> and infixes like <arm>, <ìrm>, <ìry and <ary> are to express that you will be doing the verb or was doing it.

Oe tìryaron (I will soon be hunting)

Trram krr a oel tarmaron yerikit, palulukanìl tsalme'änga oet, ulte tafral oe tamul
Yesterday the time that i was hunting yerik, a palulukan saw me (ugh), and therefore I ran.

the <äng> is to express that the speaker is not happy about it.

If you still have questions, feel free to ask. :)
« Last Edit: July 23, 2010, 09:03:07 am by Tsamsiyu92 »

Offline Payä Tìrol

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Re: Noob question...
« Reply #2 on: July 23, 2010, 04:40:29 pm »
There are a few exceptions:
noun si verbs have all of the infixes in the si.
Compound verbs like yomtìng have all of the infixes in the verb part of the compound. If a verb/verb compound, refer to the dictionary.
Oeyä atanìl mì sìvawm, mipa tìreyä tìsìlpeyur yat terìng

Offline Pxia Säsngap

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Re: Noob question...
« Reply #3 on: July 23, 2010, 05:08:23 pm »
There are a few exceptions:
noun si verbs have all of the infixes in the si.
Compound verbs like yomtìng have all of the infixes in the verb part of the compound. If a verb/verb compound, refer to the dictionary.

As I understand it, it's in verb/verb-compound verbs in the <1>position of the "more important" verb. In yomtìng(as it was in an example before): yom=eat+tìng=give   Feeding is the action of giving food to another creature, so the give-part is more important. That's why you have to put all infixes into tìng.
So: yomterìng, yomtolìng, yomtolängìng, etc.

<0>is for special other infixes (marked in NiaN e.g.)
<1> is for tense infixes
<2> is for mood infixes

yomtìng --> yomt<0><1><2>ìng

In tsamsiyu92's examples there aren't <0>positions marked. You just put these special infixes(that are put into <0>) in <1>(in the examples) but before every other infix. As far as I know there isn't a rule in which order the <0>infixes are put into the words, but the order of the three types of infixes is set(like I've explained above).
Eywa ayngahu
Ma oeyä eylan aynga oeru yawne lu <3 ;D :D ;D

Offline Payä Tìrol

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Re: Noob question...
« Reply #4 on: July 23, 2010, 05:35:42 pm »
Yes, but in any case, Taronyu's dictionary will mark infix locations, the <0> infixes always appear before the <1>s. There should never be a situation where something appears between a <0> and a <1> infix.
So if you see one infix marker, it will be something like s<0><1><2>i.
Oeyä atanìl mì sìvawm, mipa tìreyä tìsìlpeyur yat terìng

Offline Pxia Säsngap

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Re: Noob question...
« Reply #5 on: July 24, 2010, 06:28:23 am »
Yes, but in any case, Taronyu's dictionary will mark infix locations, the <0> infixes always appear before the <1>s. There should never be a situation where something appears between a <0> and a <1> infix.
So if you see one infix marker, it will be something like s<0><1><2>i.

Has awngeyä tsmukan already changed the dictionary btw? Which signs do mark the infix positions now? D'you know that ma Payä Tìrol?
Eywa ayngahu
Ma oeyä eylan aynga oeru yawne lu <3 ;D :D ;D

Offline Payä Tìrol

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Re: Noob question...
« Reply #6 on: July 24, 2010, 07:30:39 am »
I believe he changed it recently so they're shown as dots halfway down the line, above where the periods used to mark syllables are, although I don't update my copy nearly as often as he seems to update the version.
Oeyä atanìl mì sìvawm, mipa tìreyä tìsìlpeyur yat terìng

Offline Taronyu

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Re: Noob question...
« Reply #7 on: July 24, 2010, 07:52:13 am »
Yes. In the IPA section, that's the [...], the periods now mark syllables (which is standard IPA), and the mid dot now marks where the infixes go. For the most part they are normal - look at the compound word verbs in particular to find issues.

Offline Pxia Säsngap

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Re: Noob question...
« Reply #8 on: July 24, 2010, 09:05:55 am »
I believe he changed it recently so they're shown as dots halfway down the line, above where the periods used to mark syllables are, although I don't update my copy nearly as often as he seems to update the version.

I copied mine in May. So this is also an old version. I knew that Taronyu wanted to change some things, but didn't know that he's already done it. :P  :D


Irayo ma Taronyu for the answer how they are marked now. ;D
Eywa ayngahu
Ma oeyä eylan aynga oeru yawne lu <3 ;D :D ;D

Offline Taronyu

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Re: Noob question...
« Reply #9 on: July 24, 2010, 12:22:06 pm »
May? Seriously?

I would suggest checking once a week.

 

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