Author Topic: The Markers...  (Read 884 times)

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Offline Oeyä Nantang

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The Markers...
« on: July 21, 2010, 04:05:04 pm »
Both the Topic and Attributive markers are confusing me. I somewhat understand the Attributive, Where to place it. Though I dont know when exactly to use it. With every Adjective? As for the Topic Marker I`m down right lost. I dont understand a thing about it.  ???

Irayo,  oeyä tsmukan ulte tsmuke... (did i say it right lol)

Offline wm.annis

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Re: The Markers...
« Reply #1 on: July 21, 2010, 04:27:32 pm »
Both the Topic and Attributive markers are confusing me. I somewhat understand the Attributive, Where to place it. Though I dont know when exactly to use it. With every Adjective? As for the Topic Marker I`m down right lost. I dont understand a thing about it.

Well, for now you can safely ignore the topic marker except for a few simple idioms.  There aren't too many examples of it, so pretty much everyone but Frommer is potentially on shaky ground with the topical case.

The attributive affix ("affix" is just a general term for prefixes and suffixes — very useful when a language has some grammar that shifts around) is used when the adjective is an attribute of the noun.  Now, you might say that always applies.  If I say, oeyä ikran lu tsawl my ikran is big, clearly bigness is an attribute of the ikran.  But grammatically speaking, an attributive adjective (or attributive phrase, something Na'vi allows), is when the adjective is part of the noun phrase, it gives us more info about the noun, possibly describing a specific item.  So, which ikran is sleeping?  Tsawla ikran hahaw the big ikran sleeps.

Quote
Irayo,  oeyä tsmukan ulte tsmuke... (did i say it right lol)

When you are addressing people directly, you use the word ma in front of them — their name or relationship — sort of like how people use "@" on Twitter or some forums.  Next, ulte joins clauses.  You want for listing things or people.  So, irayo, ma oeyä smukan sì smuke (note: smukan is the short plural of tsmukan, smuke the short plural of tsumke).
« Last Edit: July 21, 2010, 04:30:00 pm by wm.annis »
'Awa lì'fya ke tam kawkrr.
A Na'vi Reference Grammar

Offline Oeyä Nantang

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Re: The Markers...
« Reply #2 on: July 21, 2010, 05:17:08 pm »
I thought 'mas' was only used when specificly naming a person, not a group of people. I cant beleive I forgot to pluralize borthers and sisters. *Face palm*

Offline wm.annis

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Re: The Markers...
« Reply #3 on: July 21, 2010, 05:31:25 pm »
I thought 'mas' was only used when specificly naming a person, not a group of people.

It doesn't matter how many people you are addressing — "Friends, Romans, countrymen!" — you need merely be addressing them.
'Awa lì'fya ke tam kawkrr.
A Na'vi Reference Grammar

Offline Muzer

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Re: The Markers...
« Reply #4 on: July 21, 2010, 06:19:16 pm »
Of course, if the word is a collective noun (not to be confused with plurals - the only true collective nouns in Na'vi, off the top of my head, are Na'vi itself, olo' (clan), and pongu (party/group)), you can use the -ya suffix to the same effect (see Neytiri's line "Mawey, Na'viya, mawey").
[21:42:56] <@Muzer> Apple products used to be good, if expensive
[21:42:59] <@Muzer> now they are just expensive

Offline Payä Tìrol

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Re: The Markers...
« Reply #5 on: July 21, 2010, 06:42:37 pm »
Hrm, I've been wondering for some time what that -ya was there for :P
Oeyä atanìl mì sìvawm, mipa tìreyä tìsìlpeyur yat terìng

Offline Muzer

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Re: The Markers...
« Reply #6 on: July 21, 2010, 07:52:46 pm »
In fact, it was something Zoë Saldaña (the actress who plays Neytiri) put in by accident, and Frommer retrospectively created a rule for. Which isn't the first time something like that has happened. But retrospectively creating a rule is better than leaving it unexplained. And I think I'm using full stops much too often at the moment.
[21:42:56] <@Muzer> Apple products used to be good, if expensive
[21:42:59] <@Muzer> now they are just expensive

 

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