Author Topic: 'änsyema 2 John ... pivey ... pxasìk!  (Read 2981 times)

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Offline Eltu Lefngap Makto

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'änsyema 2 John ... pivey ... pxasìk!
« on: December 19, 2011, 11:05:51 pm »
OK, I thought I'd go for a whole book, but then I actually tried!  >:(

Ὁ πρεσβύτερος
ἐκλεκτῇ κυρίᾳ καὶ τοῖς τέκνοις αὐτῆς,
οὓς ἐγὼ ἀγαπῶ ἐν ἀληθείᾳ,
καὶ οὐκ ἐγὼ μόνος ἀλλὰ καὶ πάντες οἱ ἐγνωκότες τὴν ἀλήθειαν,
Ta Koaktan
Sa'nokur aftxawney sì peyä evengur.
Tìngayri yawne lu aynga oheru, ulte ke le'aw ohe ki frapo a smon
From the Elder
To the Chosen Mother and her children
Y'all are beloved to me, and not only me but all who are familiar with the truth
διὰ τὴν ἀλήθειαν τὴν μένουσαν ἐν ἡμῖν, καὶ μεθ' ἡμῶν ἔσται εἰς τὸν αἰῶνα.
taluna 'ì'awn awngamì sì layu awngahu frakrro.
because the truth remains in us and will be with us for always.
ἔσται μεθ' ἡμῶν χάρις ἔλεος εἰρήνη
παρὰ Θεοῦ πατρός, καὶ παρὰ Ἰησοῦ Χριστοῦ τοῦ υἱοῦ τοῦ πατρός,
ἐν ἀληθείᾳ καὶ ἀγάπῃ.
Liyevu awngaru zongtseng sì tìtstunwi sì fpom, nìyawn sì nìngay
ta Nawna Sempul sì ta Yeysu Metsiakx alu 'Itan Sempulä
There will ought to be with us refuge and kindness and peace, lovely and truly
from Great Father and from Jesus Messiah, that is Son of Father.

I better get feedback before imagining I can proceed.  The rest has got to be easier than the first three verses!!! :-\
'Ivong, Na'vi!

Offline Tirea Aean

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Re: 'änsyema 2 John ... pivey ... pxasìk!
« Reply #1 on: December 20, 2011, 12:03:08 am »
I don't know Greek, so I'll take your word for it in the desctags.

I'll be back to look at this in greater detail later. Just posting for notify and to express my interest until then.

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Re: 'änsyema 2 John ... pivey ... pxasìk!
« Reply #2 on: December 20, 2011, 06:22:06 am »
nìpxay seiyi irayo oe ngaru
'Ivong, Na'vi!

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Re: 'änsyema 2 John ... pivey ... pxasìk!
« Reply #3 on: December 20, 2011, 08:51:04 am »
nìtxan ;) *rushes out the door*

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Re: 'änsyema 2 John ... pivey ... pxasìk!
« Reply #4 on: December 21, 2011, 07:54:44 am »
Sorry this is so late. I just had a little bit of time to look at this and write some thoughts down.

Ὁ πρεσβύτερος
ἐκλεκτῇ κυρίᾳ καὶ τοῖς τέκνοις αὐτῆς,
οὓς ἐγὼ ἀγαπῶ ἐν ἀληθείᾳ,
καὶ οὐκ ἐγὼ μόνος ἀλλὰ καὶ πάντες οἱ ἐγνωκότες τὴν ἀλήθειαν,
Ta Koaktan
Sa'nokur aftxawney sì peyä evengur.
Tìngayri yawne lu aynga oheru, ulte ke nì'aw oheru ki frapor a smon
From the Elder
To the Chosen Mother and her children
Y'all are beloved to me, and not only me but all who are familiar with the truth
διὰ τὴν ἀλήθειαν τὴν μένουσαν ἐν ἡμῖν, καὶ μεθ' ἡμῶν ἔσται εἰς τὸν αἰῶνα.
taluna 'ì'awn awngamì sì layu awngahu frakrro.
because the truth remains in us and will be with us for always.
ἔσται μεθ' ἡμῶν χάρις ἔλεος εἰρήνη
παρὰ Θεοῦ πατρός, καὶ παρὰ Ἰησοῦ Χριστοῦ τοῦ υἱοῦ τοῦ πατρός,
ἐν ἀληθείᾳ καὶ ἀγάπῃ.
Liyevu awngaru zongtseng sì tìtstunwi sì fpom, nìyawne sì nìngay
ta Nawma Sempul sì ta Yeysu Metsiakx alu 'Itan Sempulä
There will ought to be with us refuge and kindness and peace, lovely and truly
from Great Father and from Jesus Messiah, that is Son of Father.

Frakrro. Being literal, this word for word would mean "for always". something about frakrro seems sketchy, but I can't call it wrong. What is the differenc between "for always" , "forever", and "until the end of time"?
« Last Edit: December 21, 2011, 07:58:11 am by Tirea Aean »

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Offline Eltu Lefngap Makto

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Re: 'änsyema 2 John ... pivey ... pxasìk!
« Reply #5 on: December 21, 2011, 10:13:57 am »
Sorry this is so late. I just had a little bit of time to look at this and write some thoughts down.

Oe ngaru seiyi irayo taluna srung soli!

Frakrro. Being literal, this word for word would mean "for always". something about frakrro seems sketchy, but I can't call it wrong. What is the differenc between "for always" , "forever", and "until the end of time"?

Now you're asking me what I think about the nature of time (which is what I'm studying in grad school)!  Eternity is the something that occurs after the end of time.  The preposition here is 'into', so the truth is in us now and will remain with us as we enter into eternity.  So it's not simply until the end of time, but for now and always.  This is a distinction that most Bible translators never consider.

Ta Koaktan
Sa'nokur aftxawney sì peyä evengur.
Tìngayri yawne lu aynga oheru, ulte ke nì'aw oheru ki frapor a smon
From the Elder
To the Chosen Mother and her children
Y'all are beloved to me, and not only me but all who are familiar with the truth
taluna 'ì'awn awngamì sì layu awngahu frakrro.
because the truth remains in us and will be with us for always.
Liyevu awngaru zongtseng sì tìtstunwi sì fpom, nìyawne sì nìngay
ta Nawma Sempul sì ta Yeysu Metsiakx
There will ought to be with us refuge and kindness and peace, lovely and truly
from Great Father and from Jesus Messiah, that is Son of Father.

why not "Kìristo", conforming to "Χριστοῦ"?
It has always been a mystery to me why English Bible translate 'messiah' in the OT as 'anointed' and 'christos' in the NT as 'Christ', especially when the NT clearly says one is a translation of the other (John 1:41, 4:25).  We certainly don't want to have both Metsiakx and Kìristo in the same Bible (cp Ps 2:2 vs. Acts 4:27).
Ideally, we should be able to decide on something for 'to anoint'.  tsamopin is close, but we to know specificly how the Na'vi 'mark' the man becoming olo'eyktan.  Until then, Metsiyakx or such is just more fun to say!  ;D

Onto more verses!
'Ivong, Na'vi!

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Re: 'änsyema 2 John ... pivey ... pxasìk!
« Reply #6 on: December 21, 2011, 01:56:55 pm »
I see. frakrro then. :)

So the reason "Metsiakx" ends with a kx is because it would otherwise be boring to say. ::) (I see. It occurs often that people transliterate with ejectives on purpose because they are "fun") ;D

But of course. Have fun with it. Maybe one day we will get vtr. anoint and adj. anointed. ;)

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Re: 'änsyema 2 John ... pivey ... pxasìk!
« Reply #7 on: December 21, 2011, 02:16:46 pm »
So the reason "Metsiakx" ends with a kx is because it would otherwise be boring to say.

No, I picked Metsiyakx over Kìrìsto because it was more fun!  It's almost an ejective in Hebrew מָשִׁיחַ.  The last letter is the traditional Hebrew throat hack!

http://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/lexicon/lexicon.cfm?Strongs=H4899 (find the play button)
'Ivong, Na'vi!

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Re: 'änsyema 2 John ... pivey ... pxasìk!
« Reply #8 on: December 21, 2011, 02:51:27 pm »
I'm skipping the Greek.  Nobody cares!  ::) 

Verse 4
Nìprrte' sunu fwa ohe ralmun ngeyä evengoti fte tivìran mì sìngay keng korenit awngal tolel ta Sempul.
It is pleasurably enjoyable that I have found some of your children walking in the truth, even as we-all received a rule from the Father.
'Ivong, Na'vi!

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Re: 'änsyema 2 John ... pivey ... pxasìk!
« Reply #9 on: December 21, 2011, 05:18:27 pm »
So the reason "Metsiakx" ends with a kx is because it would otherwise be boring to say.

No, I picked Metsiyakx over Kìrìsto because it was more fun!  It's almost an ejective in Hebrew מָשִׁיחַ.  The last letter is the traditional Hebrew throat hack!

http://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/lexicon/lexicon.cfm?Strongs=H4899 (find the play button)

not nearly [kʼ] but since [x] (what that is) is not in na'vi, close enough, plus, kx ups the fun factor. :P

so. new verse.


[4-KJV]I rejoiced greatly that I found of thy children walking in truth, as we have received a commandment from the Father.
Nìprrte' sunu fwa ohel ralmun ngeyä evengoti a tìran mì sìngay, keng na fwa korenit awngal tolel ta Sempul.
It is pleasurably enjoyable that I have found some of your children walking in the truth, even as we-all received a rule from the Father.
« Last Edit: December 21, 2011, 05:20:19 pm by Tirea Aean »

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Re: 'änsyema 2 John ... pivey ... pxasìk!
« Reply #10 on: December 21, 2011, 06:06:08 pm »
Two dumb mistakes  :(

But WITW is na fwa?!??!  ???
'Ivong, Na'vi!

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Re: 'änsyema 2 John ... pivey ... pxasìk!
« Reply #11 on: December 21, 2011, 11:28:30 pm »
Two dumb mistakes  :(

But WITW is na fwa?!??!  ???

chill bro. ;D

assuming WITW == what in the world:

na means as(or like)
fwa means fì'u a.

na is used for nouns. whatever the first noun after na is, is the noun that na describes. therefore, na cannot be used on an entire phrase. and thus, fwa solves this problem. fwa being a dummy noun(fì'u with attributive a) allowing the packaging of an entire phrase into a noun.


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Re: 'änsyema 2 John ... pivey ... pxasìk!
« Reply #12 on: December 22, 2011, 07:08:14 am »
Sorry to have freaked out.  I never would've thought of adp. + pronoun!  So cool!  Can you also do fwana?
'Ivong, Na'vi!

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Re: 'änsyema 2 John ... pivey ... pxasìk!
« Reply #13 on: December 22, 2011, 01:43:36 pm »
Sorry to have freaked out.  I never would've thought of adp. + pronoun!  So cool!  Can you also do fwana?

No, fwana is not possible.

I actually really dont like the definitions for fwa, futa, etc in the dictionary. fwa isnt a pronoun, and it doesnt even mean 'that'.

fwa literally means fì'u a. it is a contraction. fwa is a generic demonstrative noun with right-branching attribution.

fì'u on its own, yeah, I can see how it would mean pn. this

fì'u is just as much candidate for adpositions (eg na) as any other noun. in such a case of "na fwa", if you want na to be enclitic, you would have to decompress fwa back into fì'u a and attach na to fì'u:
fì'una a

i dont like the definition pn. that for fwa also because it implies that fwa is a standalone or like a regular pn.

as I used it, fwa is a generic blank noun to which the following phrase attributes and gives definition

does that make sense?
« Last Edit: December 22, 2011, 01:50:07 pm by Tirea Aean »

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Re: 'änsyema 2 John ... pivey ... pxasìk!
« Reply #14 on: December 22, 2011, 02:55:25 pm »
does that make sense?
Nìwtox.

Ta Koaktan
Sa'nokur aftxawney sì peyä evengur.
Tìngayri yawne lu aynga oheru, ulte ke nì'aw oheru ki frapor a smon
From the Elder
To the Chosen Mother and her children
Y'all are beloved to me, and not only me but all who are familiar with the truth
taluna 'ì'awn awngamì sì layu awngahu frakrro.
because the truth remains in us and will be with us for always.
Liyevu awngaru zongtseng sì tìtstunwi sì fpom, nìyawne sì nìngay
ta Nawma Sempul sì ta Yeysu Metsiakx
There will ought to be with us refuge and kindness and peace, lovely and truly
from Great Father and from Jesus Messiah, that is Son of Father.
Nìprrte' sunu fwa ohel ralmun ngeyä evengoti a tìran mì sìngay, na fwa korenit awngal tolel ta Sempul.
It is pleasurably enjoyable that I have found some of your children walking in the truth, even as we-all received a rule from the Father.

and verse 5
Pxiset vin ohel futa awnga yawne läpivu snoru.  Ma Sa'nok, pamrel si ke mipa korenit ki futa awngaru lolu sngä'ikrrmì.
Right now I request that we-all may be beloved to each other.  O Mother, I write not a new rule but rather what we-all had from the beginning.
'Ivong, Na'vi!

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Re: 'änsyema 2 John ... pivey ... pxasìk!
« Reply #15 on: December 22, 2011, 03:46:12 pm »
ah ok good. Well, `Eylan made a topic on fwa etc in /intermediate

1-4 looks good, Ill be back for v.5
« Last Edit: December 22, 2011, 03:48:32 pm by Tirea Aean »

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Re: 'änsyema 2 John ... pivey ... pxasìk!
« Reply #16 on: December 31, 2011, 10:23:19 pm »
*bump*
'Ivong, Na'vi!

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Re: 'änsyema 2 John ... pivey ... pxasìk!
« Reply #17 on: December 31, 2011, 10:39:38 pm »
*bump*

Oh thank you. I forgot about this. I'm on it

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Re: 'änsyema 2 John ... pivey ... pxasìk!
« Reply #18 on: December 31, 2011, 10:50:22 pm »
Oh I remember why I put this off now...

We all love each other is a structure we don't know about yet. I don't think what you put is right and I mailed Paul about it, he mailed back saying he will post about it on his blog soon... this occurred about 4 days ago

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Re: 'änsyema 2 John ... pivey ... pxasìk!
« Reply #19 on: January 01, 2012, 09:38:20 am »
http://naviteri.org/2011/12/one-more-for-2011/

Good job eliciting a post from KP!
'Ivong, Na'vi!

 

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