Avatar MMORPG?

Started by Swok Txon, January 06, 2010, 11:35:49 PM

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Aperture

Quote from: Ayzìsìt Alenantang on January 15, 2010, 03:08:31 PM
nah... you just can'y let online gamers be na'vi.

"this big tree is stupid lol"

"omfg i'm blue that so dumb"

"you're human, right?"

"I know na'vi. oaejrnhgagn! that's "hello""

"u killz human lol"



It would need a server where you have to prove that you're not one of these people to play on it.
And some good mods!

Swok Txon

Yeah

one way would be having to pay for it but then lots of people wouldn't be able to pay for it (like myself)

maybe a test of somekind...? i dunno something like that lol

Kretän

No, all they need to do is run it like WoW, have standard servers and roleplaying servers. On roleplaying servers ayskxawng and non-roleplayers can be issued warnings if they break their character rules too much and eventually be banned. Also, people like that will likely get bored of playing if everyone around them is roleplaying all the time anyway.

Reav

Yea.

RP and non RP servers seems the best way to do it these days.

Most ''elite people'' (aka tards) stay away from RP servers anyway.
Others join and try to be as much of a hindrance as possible but in many cases they come worse off in the end.
If you have a hard skin and can take the fire from those tards and get a good group of people together the whole RP aspect gets really nice.


mynameisHufwe

if an avatar mmorpg was made i wouldnt want it to be that complex you guys realy want it to be a game i hate when people give me too much to do i feel as if there shouldnt be a story already made but you make a story i feel as if they should have to sides RDA and Na'vi The RDA have there initial goal im not sure what maybe more than tan the gray rock lolz but something and the na'vi wanting to protect what is theres just give people the tools to explore make a setting that is just as beautiful and immersive make a place that you feel at home at... and roleplay will just happen so many people love the movie so many are depressed because in truth being humans kind of blahh... so to be able to live as the na'vi live and do as the na'vi  do would be just amazing enough... james cameron wouldnt wan tanother guild wars, or a Wow with quest and BS thats not what pandora is about... besides people we dont know anything about that galaxy at all there are 3 gas giants there...there are like 20 moons per gas giant how many other races..how many other indigenous people is cameron going to make us fall in love with  ???  lolz i feel as if we could just live life as the na'vi do go through there way of life and get our own ikran and our own pa'li that would be bad ass OH AND WHO TOOK MY NAME HUF'WE I TMed that name i drew several pieces of my character huf'we so  :P lolz

Eltusiyu

I knew that is in production Avatar MMOPRG but it is for cartoon "Avatar: The Last Airbender"
James Cameron's Avatar MMORPG- maybe wouldbe created  :)
We must be patient- Avatar is very popular movie  ;D

Kxangangang! - Oeyä Pìlok leNa'vi

Previously called Kxrekorikus

DrizztDoUrden

I know a man who is making a strategy MMO playing game,like Ogame or Imperion,but the porject is beginning,so we must,wait...if you are interested I can write there something when it's finished
There is no emotion, there is peace.
There is no ignorance, there is knowledge.
There is no passion, there is serenity.
There is no chaos, there is harmony.
There is no death, there is the Force.

Skxe Eywaftu

I wouldnt expect a full 3D MMORPG at first, maybe a mod/expansion for something like maplestory or one of those 2D MMORPGs'.
the background images would be very detailed, and maybe give some people here to try out their art skills.
Im not sure how easy it would be, but if we have some programers here, we should be able to make it ourselves.

Any thoughts on this?
"There are many dangers on Pandora, and one of the subtlest is that you may come to love it too much"- Dr. Grace Augustine

Kretän

Although I personally don't have sufficient programming skills to help with this, I think the idea is perfectly plausable, and I imagine would be lots of fun to do! :D

I pass my vote for this idea!

Kezlyr

I'm glad I'm not the only one who thinks this idea has great potential as an MMORPG. Here are my thoughts:

Instead of just picking humans vs Na'vi, think about this. You pick a native Na'vi, who begins as a child (in a sort of 'tutorial zone') and begin learning the ways of the people. After finishing the zone, you become an adult (or adolescent). The zone can (and probably should) consist of going all over the zone, which would probably be their Home Tree (I think that's what it's called). The zone they go into immediately afterwords would look more or less the same, with the NPCs now somewhat older (as a few years have passed for you to mature).

The other option at the start could be to pick a human (maybe pick a class such as researcher, marine, something else..) and you have been chosen to be put into the position similar to Jake Sully or Norm, having an 'avatar' and living among the Na'vi. After 'logging in' to your 'avatar,' you will be put into the training ground area that Jake ran by in the movie. After going through this 'tutorial' one how to get used to your new body, the player can make a choice (this next part is just my idea, incorporation of it may or may not be a good idea) as to how 'real' they want their experience. When they log out from the game completely, they can chose to either have their avatar 'fall asleep' right where you log out, leaving you vulnerable to the world around you, but allowing you to get bonuses after you spent so much time logged out (ie, rested experience, allure of the flora/fauna, whispers of the ancestors (from Eywa) or something) or they can chose to simply play it like a game and let their character log out anywhere and their body disappears from the world (like in all other MMOs) and when they log back in they are simply where they logged out at. The only possible problem I can think of (I'm sure there are more) is that while running through the world, you'll just see bodies lying all over the place. Kind of detracts from the whole experience a bit.. Maybe just pull a dnd and roll a d100 or something every hour the person is logged (instead of leaving their body in the zone) and apply different bonuses/penalties based off of where they logged out and chance. Just my idea.

Give it a level progression system, as most conventional MMOs have, and allow people to get the mounts early. That can't be stressed enough. Let people ride a horse at level 10, and make the quest a challenge at first. Have a key set to 'bind' (to interact with nature, animals, and the entire world) and give the player a 1 second interval to press it after first getting on the horse, and make the ride training somewhat difficult at first. Obviously once the quest has been completed, the horse may be summoned as needed and will obey, unless there is some reason not to (scared of a human drop ship?). As for the 'summoning,' my idea is that, since the animals are in tune with their masters (the horses less than the ikrons, but still to an extent) when you push the key to summon your horse, have him run from within the forest to you and make a cool animation for the player simultaneously jumping on the beast and binding himself to it.

At level 20, let the player do the ikron quest. The difficulty for this one is hard to pin down. While getting and controlling the bird seems, in the movies, an extremely difficult maneuver, and the defining factor in whether or not one is considered a warrior among the Na'vi, it can't be a simple 'go climb some trail over there, walk toward the birds, find one that tries to kill you, jump on it, bind, fly away, good job.' But then if you make it too difficult, players will complain and be unable to enjoy a huge part of the game (make the entire world flyable. None of the WoW crap where only one region is flight-enabled.)

As far as the level cap, I have no idea. I'm thinking 60 based off the two numbers I gave, and maybe introduce some other options for rideable/interactable creatures, such as the ferocious cat or rhino-like creature that tries to kill Jake in the beginning. Also, let the Na'vi all have 'pets' or companions. Such as the little dog-like creatures that almost killed Jake. The Na'vi may be a peaceful people, but from what I gathered: they have warriors and they value them greatly (meaning combat and possibly war are both respected and understood); they hunt in order to survive (don't recall any scene in which someone ate a plant) and as such, while they do not kill for sport, they do not shy away from killing when necessary. This means that it is completely understandable for the Na'vi (the player) to go out and engage in quests to kill certain beast to provide for the people (tribe, village, not sure what they would be called). Since the Na'vi are so in-tune with nature, it would make sense for them to have a companion that would fight along side them too.

Ikron combat (simply combat in the air) is a must, as well. Give the ikron some cool maneuvers (grabbing and gun ship and tossing it into the mountain) that make it fun and interesting.

PvP combat: This can be a major part of the game. Similar to LOTRO's 'monster play,' once the player has reached some arbitrary level (let's say 10) they are able to create a pure human (level capped) that can go to a special PvP zone (maybe do something like WoW and create a queue for the PvP zone(s). If it is a popular feature, this can ensure the battles start even on both sides and that the battles are large-scale) to attempt to destroy the Na'vi. Perhaps create two zones: one in which the humans try to destroy Home Tree, and one in which they try to explode the Tree of Souls (if I call anything the wrong name, I apologize. Trying to keep it all straight as best I can.) In my opinion, the zones should be 100v100, but unless you give the humans some cool stuff (all players should be a pilot, gunner (in the ship), or a mech. Leave the ground troops as NPCs, if they're in at all) you'll never get 100 humans. Another idea I had for this was, after the 200 (100v100) people have signed up for the PvP, but before it starts, let people nominate themselves as leaders for both sides. After a quick (20-30 seconds) self-nomination process, people can vote for candidates on their side to be the leader. The leader, human general or Tarak Mak'to, has some special abilities (calling in reinforcements, tarak mak'to can call Eywa to send in the creatures of the forest) and can rally the people together in the fight. This let's people experience what it's like to be the Rider of the Last Shadow, or the (crazed) military general hell-bent on destroying everything.

I apologize for the long post, but as an avid gamer, all I could think of during the movie was how great it was and the huge potential it has as a game (MMORPG). Thank you for reading all of it. Any other ideas, opinions, or anything are welcome. Let's get some real attention for the idea and get someone to pick up the rights to the title and create a real MMO.

Kretän

Kezlyr, fantastic post!

Everything I read, I thought to myself "Awesome idea!", I really think your image of the MMO would make a great game!

Although, again, I still feel that if this was to be a game, it should try to break from the traditional "kill 1000 monster, and you level up!". Also, one thing I truly dislike about WoW, is how Gear-based it is. I think Avatar should be a MMO that puts alot of emphasis on PVP, and I also believe it shouldn't be about players with better gear, but rather about who is the better warrior (of course, gear should still come into it, it is needed to keep the game addictive, I just don't feel it should be over-emphasised.)
And of course, the leaders inb pvp battle, Toruk Makto and the crazed war leader, should be somewhat stronger.

Maybe players should be able to lvl through means of pvp, aswell as PvE?

These are just my little thoughts and additions to your ideas, Kezlyr. I really do think you have got most of this down already, and I would love to see your words put into action!

Kezlyr

Thanks Kretan :)

That's actually a good idea, the leveling through PvP. My only concern with a large emphasis on PvP, outside of the whole 100v100 PvP battles (maybe making the PvP zones scaled (like WoW) so it's level based and allowing the humans to pick their level at their character creation so that, if the game is to have an emphasis on PvP, they don't have to wait until they level cap to get some great battles going on) is that the Na'vi are, in essence, a peaceful people. This is difficult to translate into an MMO, but I think by saying 'go kill as many humans as you can' you're kind of missing the point of the people's beliefs.

Maybe give a third option at the start (in addition to native Na'vi and researcher sent in to Pandora) to be a pure human and go out and try to mine and clear some areas to extract resources. The Na'vi will obviously start attacking you once they notice this, and by, say, level 10 or 15 you can have PvP going on all the time. Additionally, you could just make those NPCs. Have groups of troopers 'randomly' come in every hour or so at different locations across Pandora, not just at their main tribes location (forget their name.. :'() but at all 15 clans, as well as any areas of Pandora that are inhabited. (As a sidenote, maybe instead of the native Na'vi players picking a class, they pick a clan to start out in. This decision gives them a different set of bonuses and also maybe a skill or two. Maybe a 'class' specialization around level 30 (hunter, warrior, spirit leader, etc.) to give the characters some more uniqueness.) But give the humans some actual AI. They are trained soldiers, some probably even in mechs expecting danger. Let them use tactics and be smart about getting into combat. They aren't just going to stand in a line and fire. They might send in a scout that reports in real-time about what they see as Alpha and Bravo go around the sides and try to flank the player (or players). That way it's an actual challenge, and will even feel like PvP, without someone being like 'screw humans, I want to be big and blue and ride Last Shadow.'

I like the idea of not focusing on gear. To me, this means that from the very beginning players should be given a skill-based system of improvement. This can take many different forms. The simplest would be similar to WoW's 'talent' system. Give the player a number of different skill trees to choose from and let them advance however they see fit. They can go pure into one aspect of their development, or be balanced across all fields. This would be challenging, however, as there would likely need to be at least 10 different trees to really get into the different aspects of what the Na'vi are capable of. One way to reduce this is to have each clan only 'specialize' (support and train) certain parts of the builds. So someone starting in Clan A (really forgot the main clan's name, I sincerely apologize) can only have skill trees relating to, say, hunting, gathering (foraging, if that will be in the game), and warriors, while clan B could have hunting, warriors, and spirit leaders. This would reduce the trees to about 6 (give at least 2 different sets for each 'class'), although doesn't do much for how many skill trees there are over all. Just an idea. Also, when it comes time to really 'pick a class,' don't make it restrictive. The Na'vi are all about balance (ask Eywa). I can be a hunter and a care-taker (or forager or warrior or scout). Make classes that support this idea. Instead of simply 'warriors,' for example, I should be able to be a 'combat expert' (or something to that affect) that both hunts and goes to war. And beyond that, allow players to specialize in an aspect of their class. Yes they can hunt and engage in battles, but they obviously (usually) have one area of expertise. Make that come out. Some warriors prefer hiding in trees with their bow and picking the enemy off. Others want to ride horses and spear their opponents. Others still want to fly around on ikron and snipe their enemies from the sky or drop rocks on gun ships. (Specialization = bonuses, perhaps special 'war' mounts available to those specializing in mounted combat, as well as bonus skills.)

Just some more thoughts. I've been a gamer since I was a kid and have played many, many MMOs so I may be thinking too conventionally for the game. However, I still think it has great potential simply as I have (very briefly) outlined it. As others respond, I'll give more ideas and comment on theirs.

Again, thank you Kretan for the feedback. Much appreciated.

Kretän

Quote from: Kezlyr on February 14, 2010, 10:35:40 AM
My only concern with a large emphasis on PvP, outside of the whole 100v100 PvP battles is that the Na'vi are, in essence, a peaceful people. This is difficult to translate into an MMO, but I think by saying 'go kill as many humans as you can' you're kind of missing the point of the people's beliefs.

Well, there could be some kind of restrictive rule that maybe only allows a Na'vi to attack a human if they come within a certain range of hometree. Maybe even something where, outside of this range, Na'vi can't attack unarmed or lower level players? Thats the only real way I think can be achieved to portray a peaceful side to the race.

As for everything you said, I am LOVING the idea of multi-class characters. Perhaps it could work like proffessions in WoW, but instead of seperate skills, it could be sub-classes. A warrior (frontal combat) player could take the sub-class of a hunter (stealthy class) and mix-and-match certain abilities. Or a hunter could take the sub-class of a Scout support class (maybe the Scout class is poor in solo combat, but can mark enemies for others to see and support other players effectively in battle. The informative abilities could be nicely mixed with stealth).

Maybe mount-bonus can be a sub-class choice instead of choosing an actual class. This would give players the edge over others in mounted combat, but when unmounted would leave them more vulnerable due to only having their main class to fall back on.

My one critique on your idea (or rather, wha you have and haven't addressed), however, would be that you seem to be thinking only of the Na'vi. Any MMO needs to support both sides efficiently, and have both sides being equally fun to play. Although I think the exact same ideas could apply to both sides. Na'vi can also have AI. The classes, however, in my oppinon, should be totally seperate. Human classes could include demolition, marksman, scientist (support?) and such. Even if a class is only a counter-equivalent, I still believe both factions should have unique classes, and unique abilities.

But overall I am loving this image of a game you are creating. Its getting me hyped up and making me really want to see this happen! You, by the way, should be leading the project if any company ever takes it on!  ;D

nicktheh

as great as I think this will be; they'll probably make a single player morpg before a multiplayer morpg =/ kind've like Demon's souls (for those of you who watch yahtzee's reviews ;D)

Kezlyr

Quote from: Kretän on February 14, 2010, 03:29:42 PM
You, by the way, should be leading the project if any company ever takes it on!  ;D

Haha, thanks Kretan. :)

The restrictive live-world PvP actually sounds like a good idea. But instead of level restrictions, maybe just restrict it based off of the human's actions. For example, if it is a simple researcher wondering through the forest to learn (although I doubt they would go out. Probably simply go out in their avatar) they would be in no danger, although they would likely be watched. However, if someone is going through (say, in a mech) stepping on everything they can and scattering the native creatures, they pose a threat to Pandora and home tree. However, I am currently unsure how to give the humans quests to advance through the game without them venturing into Na'vi territory with somewhat 'violent' means.

I like your take on the classes, as well. Maybe every ten levels allow them to advance in a general area. However, with every advancement in any direction they want, they gain corresponding skills. For example, a hunter may be able to track the creatures of Pandora and kill them as needed. A hunter/warrior would be able to track humans (warrior = combatting other 'clans,' including humans). Just a thought. I also think that giving each and every advancement a cool name would aid this process. Give the first tier in every class a basic name, but the combination of the classes is where the cool names come out. For example, call a first tier warrior/scout(rogue?)/hunter (maybe even 2nd tier) an assassin. Obviously a basic idea (assassins are in pretty much every game to some extent) but encouraging none the less. Giving a player a true title (Spirit Warrior of Eywa) to aim for can really make them want to go through the game to get it. Especially when you get some cool bonuses for it, too.

Two comments on what I just said: Personally, I hadn't thought about this until I wrote it, but tiering classes doesn't seem like a bad idea. Every class has a number of tiers (I'd say let the max tiers per class be the amount that a player can choose from level 1 until the level cap, giving huge bonuses to very specific areas by the last tier or two for those who may not be balanced, but are specialized for certain tasks) which can be chosen as the player levels up. However, my other point, the most crucial part here is balance. Yes, some builds may be better than others, but make them better only at certain things. I expect someone specced for mounted combat (specialized) to kick my ass on an ikron, especially if their whole build is designed for that. But make sure there is something internal, ie a Na'vi build that has the advantage on such a warrior, as well as a human version (expert gun ship pilot perhaps? I think a wide variety of aerial vehicles (wide = 4-7) usable by the humans could do a good deal to balance them and attract players to their side). At launch it won't be a huge problem because people will honestly go for what they think is the coolest, which is awesome. After that, people will try to bastardize it and abuse the system until they find the most powerful one. Expect this. The easiest fix is simple (in theory, not practice): make every build the best.

I focus on the Na'vi for a couple reasons. As I noted in my first post, I saw it as a human creating an avatar to explore Pandora with (earning their trust, maybe even having their human form transformed into their avatar form as Jake did at the end) or a native Na'vi growing up in the world with the threat of humans (damn sky-people..) My main reason for this was simple: who wants to be a human? I mean, that's why I incorporated the 100v100 battles. People can create a human who is already level-capped (or they simply pick what level he starts at so you can engage in giant battles with your friends and see if a gun and mech is really better than a bow and horse). The Na'vi are mysterious, interesting, peaceful, powerful, but most of all, foreign. We want to explore their culture, learn their ways, and ultimately, be on their side. Having a solely human-based adventure, even if they are in Pandora (with their little breath mask) is just boring. People won't want to play it, and the sides would be horribly unbalanced. If, however, (since this is 2154) the humans are really independent from all other games and interesting, powerful, and unique in and of themselves, then it is not a bad idea. But, at least at the start, no one is going to want to be a simple human.

My idea for both sides, while the human/Na'vi PvP is an important part, was possibly giving the human-avatars a chance to stay with the humans. Create a reputation/faction system in which, as you begin your Na'vi life (on the human side more than native side) you must earn the trust of the clan(s). As you progress, you later get the option to truly become one of the Na'vi, or continue propagating the lie and reporting to the general. This could make some interesting PvP, as you don't know which Na'vi you can trust. Maybe the spirit leaders will have an ability that let's them know, and consequently every native near them, who is truly 'with' Eywa, and who is not. This aspect, I think, would eventually balance itself out (the amount of trusted vs trusted-but-lying Na'vi). The natives would have a similar reputation system, but instead allow them to earn favor with each clan (assuming the clans are all large enough. I know in the movie it mentioned about 15 clans amassing 2,000+ warriors, but let's just say that not every Na'vi is a warrior, and that even most of the people aren't warriors. Not to downplay the combat, but to give the clans all some more population. This gives different people troubles that can be expressed through quests, as well as a nice inhabitance to the world of Pandora) and with the Na'vi people in general. Or even, instead of a simple reputation system (you did something for my clan, we all trust you a little more) use a renown system. Basically, doing things across Pandora let's everyone know who you are, not just one clan. (This is a good idea if you want every player to feel like a 'hero' rather than a simple 'participant.') Ie, capturing an ikron gets you some renown because people will learn who you are, see you flying in the sky, and talk about you as a warrior. Using both systems, I think, could create interesting possibilities, as well.

I apologize if that one was a bit more difficult to read, kind of jammed ideas into other ideas. If you have any questions, feel free to ask. Even Kretan's short posts inspire page-long responses, and I like posting some thoughts about it anyway.

Also, thank you for reading it all, to anyone who does. I know it's a lot of information and ideas and everything, but the more people that think about it, especially in detail, then the more people that will be dying to see this come to life. Spread the word.

nicktheh

another great post kezlyr;

you've got some great ideas in you ;D every try any programming?

anyway; I think that everyone should be playing na'vi; either as an avatar or a true na'vi, but as a human you could have different incentives if you're playing as an avatar na'vi instead of a true na'vi. perhaps if you're playing an avatar you will want to turn on the na'vi people if raids are being conducted on home tree or something of the like,

just my 2 cents ^_^

Kezlyr

Thanks Nicktheh.

I know a little (very little) CPP, but I've been teaching myself. Within a year or two I'll know a lot more. I'm majoring in cyber-defense and information security, with a minor in computer information technology (but I don't start taking any computer classes until next semester.. Honors program screwed my schedule on that one.) But I'd be more than glad to help in any project devoted to the cause as much as I can.

I think most people should be playing Na'vi, as well (outside the large-scale PvP battles.) I hadn't put too much thought into the different reasons why the human might turn on the Na'vi, though. Maybe advancing through the military ranks provides you access to different mechs/vehicles/planes to use in Pandora as you wish.

Just a quick response to something a couple people have said on this post (I didn't actually read through this whole thing until a couple hours ago. Originally posted my comments on another website for the same topic, but it seems that one does not have as much activity as this one.): I agree that releasing an Avatar MMORPG right now would be a bad idea. Why? It's too soon, of course. However, saying that nothing should happen until the 2nd or 3rd movie is foolish. Begin the development as early as possible. Start creating models, rendering the world and its creatures, and getting the basis of Pandora down now, and testing everything as soon as you can. That way, when everyone is completely waiting and expecting the game to release after the second or third movie, only a few minor tweaks are needed before the release instead of a year or two of development for a poor game. People will be blasting their opinions for years, starting a month ago, to get this idea on the ball. All a developer has to do is code everything (yeah.. just code..) instead of thinking of the ideas and coding them. The sooner you start, the better it is at launch. Champions Online and Aion got rushed, and they suffered because of it. (Lack of good ideas + bad ideas also hurt them.)

Get it started, throw testers in, get feedback, update, review, update, hype, release. Just my opinion. I'm a gamer, not a marketer, but it seems that by doing it like that you have the best chance of attracting and retaining players, which seems to be the main goal of businesses.

nicktheh

Great advice :)
unfortunately I don't have the phone number of the Development team for the AVATAR mmorpg team XD
but you've got some great Ideas going on :D and looks like you're going to get a good degree to back your opinions as well.
I'd rep you if I could XD

Kezlyr

Quote from: nicktheh on February 14, 2010, 08:06:31 PM
Great advice :)
unfortunately I don't have the phone number of the Development team for the AVATAR mmorpg team XD
but you've got some great Ideas going on :D and looks like you're going to get a good degree to back your opinions as well.
I'd rep you if I could XD

Haha, thanks. :) I was wondering if this forum had any kind of rep system, but I hadn't cared enough to actually look for it. I'll take that as a no though.. oh well. :) Hopefully any team that goes into developing the game takes a look at some forums for ideas.. Would be kind of foolish not to, in my opinion. But that's just me.

Swizaw Nguway

TBH, an avatar MMO would be absolutely amazing. Im guessing it would even rival WoW. Well, maybe not, but oh well, would still be amazing.