Breathy holes on Toruk

Sezetirea216 · November 04, 2011, 06:19:52 PM

Toruk has these holes on his chest which r presumably for breathingg and r always open, what if hes flying and a leaf gets in his breathing hole thing? It seems kinda exposed for a creature as indestructable as Toruk

archaic · November 04, 2011, 06:45:43 PM

Most creatures on Pandora have them.

I that must happen sometimes, I guess they sneeze?

'Oma Tirea · November 04, 2011, 10:16:25 PM

Those "holes" you speak of are most likely evolutionary. Now for another question: how did the Na'vi evolve to not have them?

Seze Mune · November 04, 2011, 11:10:13 PM

Quote from: 'Oma Tirea on November 04, 2011, 10:16:25 PM
Those "holes" you speak of are most likely evolutionary. Now for another question: how did the Na'vi evolve to not have them?

I believe the Na'vi do have holes for breathing, but they are located on the face and not in the neck/chest. That is the difference between nostrils and spiracles.

On earth, spiracles are associated with some arthropods and some fish. I think the ASG speculates that ikran and toruks are evolved from fish.

'Oma Tirea · November 05, 2011, 01:44:45 AM

True, but how about some of the other species, such as Prolemuris? They have Spiracles as well. Could the Na'vi really have evolved from Prolemuris? Or could it be some other creature we have not yet seen?

Syuve fpi aysäfpìl

Seze Mune · November 05, 2011, 09:56:06 AM

Quote from: 'Oma Tirea on November 05, 2011, 01:44:45 AM
True, but how about some of the other species, such as Prolemuris? They have Spiracles as well. Could the Na'vi really have evolved from Prolemuris? Or could it be some other creature we have not yet seen?

Syuve fpi aysäfpìl

Interesting.

According to Avatar Wiki:

"The prolemuris can reach up to one meter in height. It has large eyes with binocular vision, an apelike skull with a short snout, small nostrils and jaw, and needle-sharp teeth that are adapted to cut through tough Pandoran flora...Unlike other pandoran animals, prolemuris have only a single neural queue and a small amount of hair on their head. This indicates that prolemuris could be a "link" between the Na'vi and other pandoran animals. "

Unfortunately, I didn't see anything about 'spiracles in the prolemuris'. If that's in the ASG, then I don't know what to do with that because there are so many other 'mistakes' in the ASG. It definitely needs an update!

Kamean · November 05, 2011, 10:25:52 AM

Nìngay! That Prolemuris have spiracles, I had noticed approximately year ago. Interesting compilation.

Sezetirea216 · November 05, 2011, 11:14:26 AM

Anther question on evolution, how didi the na'vi develop to only have four limbs while all the other fauna on pandora have six? Btw where r the ikrans fifth and sixth limbs?

Seze Mune · November 05, 2011, 11:20:49 AM

Quote from: Sezetirea216 on November 05, 2011, 11:14:26 AM
Anther question on evolution, how didi the na'vi develop to only have four limbs while all the other fauna on pandora have six? Btw where r the ikrans fifth and sixth limbs?

Are we sure that ALL the other animal forms have six?

And for all we know, the Na'vi and the ikrans could have developed on the other moon that I understand Cameron will be referencing in his next sequel. Who knows how they might have traveled from there to Pandora?

Sezetirea216 · November 05, 2011, 02:12:32 PM

Knowing james cameron that could be possible, but i doubt ikran can travel through space. And yeah, there r probly other fauna who dont have six appendages that we have yet to discover, but for the time being im perplexed

Seze Mune · November 05, 2011, 02:30:14 PM

Quote from: Sezetirea216 on November 05, 2011, 02:12:32 PM
Knowing james cameron that could be possible, but i doubt ikran can travel through space. And yeah, there r probly other fauna who dont have six appendages that we have yet to discover, but for the time being im perplexed

Add that to the question of feathers, fur/hair and a few others.

archaic · November 05, 2011, 06:24:28 PM

I only ever noticed the nostrils on Prolemuris, never the spiracles (I checked, of course they are there).
Prolemuris have two fingers on each hand, surgesting that the Y shaped fore limb is a partial split single limb rather than two partially fused limbs, so it's a four limbed evolving into a six limbed creature?

Quote from: Sezetirea216 on November 05, 2011, 11:14:26 AM
Btw where r the ikrans fifth and sixth limbs?

Ikran only have four, but toruk has six.

Reykoveyzä te Werufalä Haflak'ite · November 06, 2011, 06:48:49 AM

the na'vi have their braids, which is a more evolved organ than the other animals, and they also have tails, but i suppose the other animals do to. so techically, the na'vi do have at least 5 limbs, six if you count the braid. and dont forget, ikran and toruk have 2 pairs of wings. another 4 limbed animal is that little lizard thing that reminds me of a helicopter (it roates and flies/glides?) which only has 4 legs.
anyone know what the possible reasons for the ikrans and toroks retractable teeth could be?

Seze Mune · November 06, 2011, 09:04:05 AM

Maybe I am not seeing something, but it looks to me like the toruk, the forest banshee and the mountain banshee are all similar in the number of wings and legs.

As for retractable teeth, I've yet to find any reference for that. Can you tell me where you heard that? I think Toothless in How to Train Your Dragon had retractable teeth, but s/he was not a Pandoran animal.

And technically, limbs are used for locomotion so tails and braids couldn't be called limbs. They could be called appendages, as in 'any member of the body diverging from the axial trunk', but that would also have to include external sexual organs as well. Do we really want to start counting those too?

Sezetirea216 · November 06, 2011, 09:34:52 AM

The toruk does have six appendages, four wings and powerful legs. The feet of the ikran r fused with their back wings so i just count both the back wings and the feet as one. And the spiral fan lizards have six legs, their second front legs are placed behind their first front legs like a direhorse

archaic · November 06, 2011, 09:35:21 AM

Huh? Legs, Toruk has them Ikran do not. Look closely those pics show it nicely!

Watch the scene where Jake captures his Ikran and it extends it's teeth threateningly at him.

EDIT:- Ninja-ed!

Seze Mune · November 06, 2011, 10:12:17 AM

Quote from: Sezetirea216 on November 06, 2011, 09:34:52 AM
The toruk does have six appendages, four wings and powerful legs. The feet of the ikran r fused with their back wings so i just count both the back wings and the feet as one. And the spiral fan lizards have six legs, their second front legs are placed behind their first front legs like a direhorse

Don't know anything about the fan lizards. But if the ikran feet are fused with the back wings, then how can Seze stand on the branch when Neytiri introduces her to Jake? She's not standing on her wings like a walrus would stand on its flippers, imo. And what about when Seze lands on the ledge near the rookery when Jake is doing Iknimaya? Very hard to balance on flippers/wings, it would seem to me. And too much chance of damage to delicate and necessary wing membranes if they were used that way.

Seze Mune · November 06, 2011, 10:22:30 AM

This probably shows it a little more clearly. Hmm. I see what you mean. But do you call them legs or wings because they function as both.
If we use the taxology of the flying squirrel as a possible template, then they would probably be classified as legs with a patagium.

Found this, which probably pertains:

'In the extinct flying pterosaurs, also the skin forming the surface of the wing. In these creatures the skin was extended to the tip of the very long fourth finger of each hand.

The patagium of a pterosaur had three distinct parts:

Propatagium: the patagium present from the shoulder to the wrist.
Brachiopatagium: the portion stretching from the fourth finger to the hindlimbs.
Uropatagium or cruropatagium: the anterior portion between the two hindlimbs, depending on whether it did or did not include the tail.'

archaic · November 06, 2011, 10:33:10 AM

Well, OK, but still only four limbs on ikran.

Seze Mune · November 06, 2011, 10:37:52 AM

Quote from: archaic on November 06, 2011, 10:33:10 AM
Well, OK, but still only four limbs on ikran.

Yeah, I wouldn't include the neural whips as limbs, but they could be called appendages. So could the tail, although it's definitely used for flight: "It can also make subtle adjustments to its flight altitude and speed with an articulated tail tip that can flare or remain tucked to decrease aerodynamic resistance."