I Need a Translation

[bilimkurguhaber]

Hello there;

I started a blog about science fiction news and I want to add a Na'vi translation of its "About Us" section. My blog has already some real world language translations of that section but I want to add some of the constructed languages of it, like Na'vi, Klingon, Vulcan and Elf.

I found a web translator on the net belonged to here (http://www.navilator.com/) but it could not find even the translation for science and fiction in Na'vi. How can I get a Na'vi translation of my blog's "About Us" text? Can anybody help me?

I do not know if I add the text here, will that violate the forum rule of not making promotion of other website?

"Hello! I am HAL. I work as the AI interface of Bilimkurgu Haber.

Bilimkurgu Haber (which stands for "Science Fiction News" in Turkish), is the news platform that brings people who are interested in science fiction and create written or visual science fiction art products together in Turkey.

You can read the texts in English and in other languages via International Category.

3000 humans, androids and extra-terrestrial intelligence visited this portal since 16th August 2012.

On this web site, science fiction-like popular news, announcements and promotions of the science fiction books, films, TV serials, computer games, portraits of the people who created science fiction art products, videos about science fiction and stories sent by the followers of the site are published.

We love science fiction, because we do believe that "imagination is more important than knowledge". We say that "Another world is possible!" thus try to get introduce those other worlds on our web site.

If you want to join the work team of Bilimkurgu Haber to provide active support and content, please contact via ... (here comes the e-mail address)

Follow Bilimkurgu Haber in Facebook & Twitter:

(I also need the Na'vi translations for the words "editor in chief" and "Work Team")"
I am not sure whether Na'vi language is yet complex for the above words and structure, therefore maybe I can publish a summarized version of it?

Thank you for your help and suggestions.

[Vawmataw]

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOT Navilator, it is the worst translator ever! It is, vulgrarily, s***.

[Nyx]

Moved to intermediate due to longer text. I hope that's ok with everyone.

Also: na'vilator won't help you because it can't take grammar into account, and some of your words don't exist in Na'vi (yet), but I hope you'll find the help you seek. Oh and welcome

[Yawne Zize’ite]

To add more detail to Naʼvi a Kepekmì's sentiments, machine translation is not very reliable. The more different the two languages are in structure, the worse the results. For example, Google Translate relies on a machine-learning algorithm and huge amounts of bilingual texts and corrections, and it still gets occasional phrases absurdly wrong and its Korean->English translations are word soup. (The workaround? Have it translate from Korean to structurally similar Japanese, which I can read at a low level.)

Navilator aims to translate between two structurally dissimilar languages, one of which has a known vocabulary smaller than many dead languages of antiquity. The site itself warns "Navilator does not understand grammar (yet)!" It's a dictionary with ambitions, and you know perfectly well that you can't just string words together out of a bilingual dictionary and produce comprehensible text.

This text has some highly technical vocabulary ("science fiction", "platform [computing]", "editor in chief", etc.) which will be quite difficult to translate into a constructed language; you'll have to settle for some interesting paraphrases. For example, I'm pretty sure there is no native Naʼvi word for "science fiction", because Naʼvi culture doesn't have a tradition of introspective prose narratives, or the conflation of science with technology, or a tradition of narratives imagining how a new technology would affect society. There is a word for "science" in the dictionary, tìftia kifkeyä, but I don't think vur tìftiayä kifkeyä would automatically mean the same thing as our "science fiction" unless it came about as a calque (translation of a foreign word by using equivalent native elements, e.g. "long time no see"). Since I couldn't find a word for "technology" or "craft", I'd try something like vur zusawkrrä or vur kifkeyä alusatem.

BTW, which Elf language are you going for? I've run across six, although my guess is that you want Quenya (the most developed famous "Elf" language).

[Alyara Arati]

Just a few thoughts:

science fiction = (ay)vur kifkeyä leronsrel

editor in chief = eyktan ayleykatemyuä

work team = pongu a tìkangkem si

[Blue Elf]

I'm afraid it is too hard to translate your text, probably it is not possible. Na'vi has no concept of technology and science, these special terms can be only described by other words, what can produce less understandable statements. IMHO language of Na'vi is not good for your intention.

[bilimkurguhaber]

Thank you all for your suggestions. Then I think I have to simplify my text. Anyway, my intention is only to include an exciting and fun welcome feature for my site. Thefore I do not need to put a long one but only a simple welcome message will be OK then. I am new at constructed languages but maybe if I improve myself in Na'vi, I can present a longer and more sophisticated welcome message in Na'vi soon.

I also use a robot avatar in my page that speaks that "About Us" text in other foreign languages. If I add a Na'vi welcome message, I also have to add a voice of the text. I use the "text to speech" feature of the software of my avatar, so whatever I write will be spoken by my robot avatar. How can I make that possible in Na'vi? Another option is to add the audio file to the avatar, so can anyone help me to pronounce when I finish my Na'vi welcome message?

Just for presenting what I mean by speaking robot avatar, here is the link of my blog:

http://www.bilimkurguhaber.com/2012/08/16/about-bilimkurgu-haber/

(Sometimes it crashes so if a robot avatar is not seen, you have to refresh the page)

[bilimkurguhaber]

BTW, which Elf language are you going for? I've run across six, although my guess is that you want Quenya (the most developed famous "Elf" language).

In fact I have no idea and knowledge about the variations of them. I want the version in the movie of Lord of the Rings.

[Alyara Arati]

"Hello! I am HAL. I work as the AI interface of Bilimkurgu Haber.

Bilimkurgu Haber (which stands for "Science Fiction News" in Turkish), is the news platform that brings people who are interested in science fiction and create written or visual science fiction art products together in Turkey.

You can read the texts in English and in other languages via International Category.

3000 humans, androids and extra-terrestrial intelligence visited this portal since 16th August 2012.

On this web site, science fiction-like popular news, announcements and promotions of the science fiction books, films, TV serials, computer games, portraits of the people who created science fiction art products, videos about science fiction and stories sent by the followers of the site are published.

We love science fiction, because we do believe that "imagination is more important than knowledge". We say that "Another world is possible!" thus try to get introduce those other worlds on our web site.

If you want to join the work team of Bilimkurgu Haber to provide active support and content, please contact via ... (here comes the e-mail address)

Follow Bilimkurgu Haber in Facebook & Twitter:

I have to agree that this is a little too complex.  Without translating the whole thing and showing you the "holes", it would read something like this, or possibly worse.

[Yawne Zize’ite]

The text-to-speech software probably can't handle Naʼvi. The language uses a set of uncommon sounds called "ejectives", spelled 'kx', 'tx', and 'px', that sound like a normal consonant followed by a click. Ejectives are very common in languages of the Caucasus and languages of the Americas, but I can't think of any language widely spoken in wealthy countries that has them. If the text-to-speech software can use IPA (International Phonetic Alphabet) input, it might be able to handle Naʼvi.
For that matter, the software is likely to have trouble with Klingon too. Klingon has a lateral affricate spelled 'tlh' and an uvular affricate spelled 'Q'. 'Tlh' is rare outside the Americas and southern Africa, and 'Q' is found in the Caucasus.

In other words, you'll need an audio file for both.

There are two Elf languages in Lord of the Rings!
This is a sample of Quenya (Tolkien reciting the poem "Namárië"): J.R.R. Tolkien reciting "Namárië"
This is a sample of Sindarin (Tolkien reciting the poem "A Elbereth Gilthoniel"): Tolkien - A Hymn to Elbereth

Quenya is better-known as a language, but in Middle-earth at the time of the Lord of the Rings it was only used for solemn ceremonies and old scholarly books, not entirely unlike Arabic. Sindarin is less developed as a language, but in Middle-earth it was the language of educated, polite people and what the Elves spoke to one another, not entirely unlike Persian. (The common people spoke the Common Speech.)
Either one is a defensible choice for your project, but, again, translation will require a mass of circumlocutions. The Elves didn't have science fiction, artificial intelligences, androids, films, videos, etc. Although Neo-Elvish enthusiasts are more aggressive than Naʼvi speakers about coining words for modern things, they're still new coinages and often aren't understood.

Klingon will be something else again; I don't know it well enough to even start a translation, but its vocabulary is heavily skewed towards Treknology to the exclusion of everyday objects. It might be easier, it might be harder, but you'll have to simplify the introduction differently than you will for Naʼvi and Elvish.

[bilimkurguhaber]

Thank you very much for the detailed explanation. I will study the topics for a few days and return with an alternative suggestion for the welcome message of my site. I will read the dictionary and take notes about the existing words in Na'vi that I can use.

[Plumps]

fpeio asìltsan yawne lu oer
I love a good challenge

Kaltxì, oeru fko syaw HAL. Oe tìkangkem si sko ralpengyu alu AI interface Bilimkurgu-ä Habar.

B.H. (a slu fmawn ayvurä kifkeyä leronsrel nìTerkì) lu tsenge fmawnä a 'awsiteng starsìm sutet a txeleri ayvurä kifkeyä leronsrel eltur (feyä) tìtxen si sì ngop reltseot fu pamrel-sawnia ayut a mì Serkì.

Tsun (ay)nga ivinan tsaylì'ut nì'Ìnglìsì sì nìlì'fya alahe ìlä "international category"

°5670a tutel, ngawnopa tokxìl lefngap sì lahea tutel akanu (li) folrrfen fìtsenget mevolvea trrta vospxìyä avolve, zìsìt 'Rrtayä alu 3734°.

Ro fìtsenge, fkol wìntxu (ayngar) fmawnit teri ayvur kifkeyä leronsrel a lu letsranten, sì sämuwìntxut teri ayfuk, ayrel arusikx, aysäwìntxu reltsyìpä arusikx, ayuvan eltuä lefngap, tìmuwusìntxu suteyä a ngolop reltseot ayvurä kifkeyä leronsrel. (Nìsung) Reltsyìpit teri ayvur kifkeyä leronsrel sì ayvurit a aynongyul fìtsengeyä fpole'.

Ayvur kifkeyä leronsrel yawne lu awngar taluna awngal spaw futa ronsrel to tìomum lu letsranten. Awnga plltxe san lahea kifkey tsunslu! sìk tafral fmi awnga muwivìntxu tsayhifkeyti alahe fìtseng.

Txo (ay)nga new 'awstengyivem pongut tìkangkemä B.H.ä fte tivìng walaka tìslanit sì ralit/wawet, rutxe syaw fu pamrel si ne {imeyl}

Nong B.H.-it ìlä Feyspuk sì Tìwìtrr

For a translation into Vulcan you should probably contact Prrton of this forum. He has a website dedicated to Vulcan

[Blue Elf]

great - nothing is impossible for our Plumps!
I wanted to try translate some words, but now it is not necessary, I can do something useful.
Applause for you, ma Plumps!

[Plumps]

I wanted to try translate some words, but now it is not necessary, I can do something useful.

Of course you can! What I did was just a suggestion ... it's not perfect and other people may come to other solutions for certain expressions
It's up for discussion!

What I like about these rather difficult texts is that if you get the meaning across then that means that we can say a lot in Na'vi already and that is proof!

[Alyara Arati]

You can indeed.  Seykxel sì nitram, ma Plumps!

one thing:
...sì lahea ketuwongìl akanu...

[`Eylan Ayfalulukanä]

Translating stuff like this on a regular basis is probably the best way there is to get a working knowledge of Na'vi....I just wish I had more time myself to do it. 

[bilimkurguhaber]

I think the following is a more simple text to be translated into Na'vi:

-----------------------------------------------------------------
Hello! My name is HAL. Welcome to "Bilimkurgu Haber".

Bilimkurgu Haber presents science fiction news, stories, films, books and people.

We love "science fiction". Because we believe that "Imagination is more important than knowledge".

-----------------------------------------------------------------

[Alyara Arati]

I think the following is a more simple text to be translated into Na'vi:

-----------------------------------------------------------------
Hello! My name is HAL. Welcome to "Bilimkurgu Haber".
Kaltxì!  Fko syaw oeru HAL.  Zola'u nìprrte' ne *Bilimkurgu Haber*.
Bilimkurgu Haber presents science fiction news, stories, films, books and people.
Ayvurìri kifkeyä leronsrel, ayoel alu *Bilimkurgu Haber* present fmawnit, ayvurit, ayrelit arusikx, ayfukit sì aysutet.
We love "science fiction". Because we believe that "Imagination is more important than knowledge".
Ayoeru yawne lu ayvur kifkeyä leronsrel, taluna ayoel spaw futa tìronsrel to tìomum tsranten.
-----------------------------------------------------------------

I wanted to give you an idea of what I was actually saying so that you can make an informed decision about what translation to use.

[bilimkurguhaber]

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kaltxì! oeyä tstxo HAL. zola'u nìprrte' ne Bilimkurgu Haber.

Bilimkurgu Haber muwìntxu tìftia kifkeyä kosman (I could not find fiction, so I used fantastic, science fiction became like "fantastic science", e.g. in Russian they use nauchnaya-science- fantastika for science fiction) fmawn, ayvur (stories?), win ayrel (I could not find the word for film, so I used "fast pictures" ), aypuk sì aytawtute.

tìftia kifkeyä kosman yawne Ìlä ayoeng. Taweyka ayoeng spaw tìronsrel nì'ul letsranten to tìomum.

--------------------------------------------

Grammar above is definitely wrong because I put the translated words in order, I think some prefixes or order changed are necessary.

[bilimkurguhaber]

I think the following is a more simple text to be translated into Na'vi:

-----------------------------------------------------------------
Hello! My name is HAL. Welcome to "Bilimkurgu Haber".
Kaltxì!  Fko syaw oeru HAL.  Zola'u nìprrte' ne *Bilimkurgu Haber*.
Bilimkurgu Haber presents science fiction news, stories, films, books and people.
Ayvurìri kifkeyä leronsrel, ayoel alu *Bilimkurgu Haber* present fmawnit, ayvurit, ayrelit arusikx, ayfukit sì aysutet.
We love "science fiction". Because we believe that "Imagination is more important than knowledge".
Ayoeru yawne lu ayvur kifkeyä leronsrel, taluna ayoel spaw futa tìronsrel to tìomum tsranten.
-----------------------------------------------------------------

I wanted to give you an idea of what I was actually saying so that you can make an informed decision about what translation to use.

I am looking at the differences now, thank you.