Poem translation

[Sanhìyä Tirea]

I've translated another well-know poem ("What is this life if full of care"). I did post it on the end of my other thread in the beginner forum that had a different poem in but that was several days ago so I think I've been ignored.
Please could someone correct my attempt?

Peu fìtìrey lu, txo, teya tìyawneyä,
What is this life if, full of care,
Awngaru kea krr a kivllkxem sì nivìn? —
We have no time to stand and stare?—

Kea krr a kivllkxem äo ayvul,
No time to stand beneath the boughs,
Ulte nivìn na txana krr na (aysyip) sì (ayhaw):
And stare as long as sheep and cows:

Kea krr a tsive'a, krr a ayna'ringit awngal ftem,
No time to see, when woods we pass,
Tseng a (ayskuìrìlil)  yem foyä ayrina't mì ewll:
Where squirrels hide their nuts in grass:

Ke-a krr a tsive'a, mì txana atan,
No time to see, in broad daylight,
Ayfayfyat a teya sanhìyä lu, na aysaw mì txon:
Streams full of stars, like skies at night:

Kea krr a mivìn taweyka tìnìn Tìlorä,
No time to turn at Beauty's glance,
Ulte nivìn poeyä ayvenu ulte fya'o tsnì fo tsun srivew:
And watch her feet, how they can dance:

Kea krr a pivey vaykrr poeyä kxa tsun
No time to wait till her mouth can
Tsa lrrtok sìltsan sivi, a poeyä menari sngìmä'i?
Enrich that smile her eyes began?

Kawng fìtìrey lu, txo, teya tìyawneyä,
A poor life this if, full of care,
Awngaru kea krr a kivllkxem sì nivìn.
We have no time to stand and stare.



Irayo ma smuk!

[Lance R. Casey]

Peu fìtìrey lu, txo, teya tìyawneyä,
What is this life if, full of care,

The literal translation of "full of" by way of an adjective and the genitive does not make much, if any, sense, and I don't think the ellipsis in the English carries over to Na'vi. I'd suggest tengkrr awngaru teya seri tìyawn while love fills us (if "love" is indeed what you want).

Awngaru kea krr a kivllkxem sì nivìn? —
We have no time to stand and stare?—

First, you're missing a lu to complete the possessive construct, and the negative concord requires the use of ke with it. Second, since the use of krr a X is established as the method of saying "at the time that X", using an attributive clause with krr in a non-adverbial context might cause some confusion -- but I don't really see anything wrong with it as such. Perhaps X fte Y for "X for the purpose of Y", where X is a noun, is allowed? Third, the first element of kllkxem is nominal, so it's kllkxivem.

Kea krr a kivllkxem äo ayvul,
No time to stand beneath the boughs,

See above.

Ulte nivìn na txana krr na (aysyip) sì (ayhaw):
And stare as long as sheep and cows:

I don't think we have an approved way of saying "for [stretch of time]", but na isn't it. Perhaps something simple like nivìn nìtxan tengfya *aysyip sì *ayhaw could work.

Kea krr a tsive'a, krr a ayna'ringit awngal ftem,
No time to see, when woods we pass,

Missing accent in na'rìng.

Tseng a (ayskuìrìlil)  yem foyä ayrina't mì ewll:
Where squirrels hide their nuts in grass:

Here I'd expect mì seng a (or tsengmì a), and the longer ergative ending is -ìl. Furthermore, the genitive inflection causes vowel shift in the pronouns, which means that fo + -yä comes out as feyä, and the glottal stop is a consonant, so it should be ayrina'it. Also, perhaps ayrìk (or ewll lerìk) could be used.

Ke-a krr a tsive'a, mì txana atan,
No time to see, in broad daylight,

Remove the hyphen, and since atan has the secondary definition "source of illumination" I'm not sure it can be used in the broad, abstract sense you want here. Also, I don't think we've ever come across a case where a leniting adposition appears before an attributive adjective, so we don't know if said adjective resists said lenition or not, but the issue is easily avoided by placing it on the other side of the noun. All in all, a "safer" route might be mì srr leatan in the light day.

Ayfayfyat a teya sanhìyä lu, na aysaw mì txon:
Streams full of stars, like skies at night:

Fayfyat a saru teya si sanhì streams(acc.) which are filled by stars, and since mì is ADP+, txon lenits to ton.

Kea krr a mivìn taweyka tìnìn Tìlorä,
No time to turn at Beauty's glance,

Taweyka is a conjunction, and so cannot be used in this way. Is a causal reading intended, or could a spatial one work as well? And, remember that lor is not used for persons; the best we have for that currently is sevin pretty.

Ulte nivìn poeyä ayvenu ulte fya'o tsnì fo tsun srivew:
And watch her feet, how they can dance:

Missing accusative on ayvenu and fya'o, the second ulte should be sì, tsnì should be changed into a, and since feet are not animate, "they" is better translated as (ay)saw/(ay)sa'u.

Kea krr a pivey vaykrr poeyä kxa tsun
No time to wait till her mouth can
Tsa lrrtok sìltsan sivi, a poeyä menari sngìmä'i?
Enrich that smile her eyes began?

Connect tsa- and lrrtok, which should be in the dative if you want to use a (tentative) si compound verb, and in order for the attributive clause to work you need to have the head noun adjacent to the subordinator. Also, sngä'i is intransitive, so you need to employ the causative infix ‹eyk› and use the ergative. All in all:

Sìltsan sivi tsalrrtokur a poeyä menaril sngeykìmä'i

Kawng fìtìrey lu, txo, teya tìyawneyä,
A poor life this if, full of care,
Awngaru kea krr a kivllkxem sì nivìn.
We have no time to stand and stare.

See second comment.


To sum up: a rather good attempt which suffers a bit from some overly literal translations. Keep it up!

[Sanhìyä Tirea]

Irayo! You are very helpful.

Is a causal reading intended, or could a spatial one work as well? And, remember that lor is not used for persons; the best we have for that currently is sevin pretty.

I usually interpret it as a causal relationship when I read it, but I suppose a spatial one could work. I was taking Beauty to be a personification of nature's beauty, and nature's beauty could be described as lor, though I suppose since it is a personification it should be sevin.

Anyway, here is the translation corrected as per Lance's post:

Peu fìtìrey lu, txo, tengkrr awngaru teya seri tìyawn,
What is this life if, full of care,
Awngaru ke lu kea krr a kllkxivem sì nivìn? —
We have no time to stand and stare?—

Ke lu kea krr a kllkxivem äo ayvul,
No time to stand beneath the boughs,
Ulte nivìn nìtxan tengfya *aysyip  sì *ayhaw:
And stare as long as sheep and cows:

Ke lu kea krr a tsive'a, krr a ayna'rìngit awngal ftem,
No time to see, when woods we pass,
Tsengmì a *ayskuìrìlìl  yem feyä ayrina'it mì ewll:
Where squirrels hide their nuts in grass:

Ke lu kea krr a tsive'a, mì srr leatan,
No time to see, in broad daylight,
Fayfyat a saru teya si sanhì, na aysaw mì ton:
Streams full of stars, like skies at night:

Ke lu kea krr a mivìn taluna tìnìn Tìsevinä,
No time to turn at Beauty's glance,
Ulte nivìn poeyä ayvenut sì fya'ot a sa'u tsun srivew:
And watch her feet, how they can dance:

Ke lu kea krr a pivey vaykrr poeyä kxa tsun
No time to wait till her mouth can
Tsalrrtokur sìltsan sivi, a poeyä menaril sngeykìmä'i?
Enrich that smile her eyes began?

Kawng fìtìrey lu, txo, tengkrr awngaru teya seri tìyawn,
A poor life this if, full of care,
Awngaru ke lu kea krr a kllkxivem sì nivìn.
We have no time to stand and stare.

Irayo nìtxan txan ! Nga nìtxan lesrung lu!

[Lance R. Casey]

Ah, I only meant to include ke lu the first time; the rest are merely repetitions of what we do not have, so claiming poetic licence I view the ellipsis as not only allowed, but preferable.

Ke lu kea krr a tsive'a, krr a ayna'rìngit awngal ftem,
No time to see, when woods we pass,
Tsengmì a *ayskuìrìlìl  yem feyä ayrina'it mì ewll:
Where squirrels hide their nuts in grass:

I seem to have misread this the first time around, or simply not observed the connection between the lines. As it stands, it (to me) refers to forests being passed by in a place where nut-hiding occurs, rather than passing by forests in which nuts are being hidden. For the second meaning:

awngal ftem ayna'rìngit a samì *ayskuìrìlìl yem feyä ayrina'it
we pass by squirrels-hide-their-seeds-in-them forests

Ke lu kea krr a mivìn taluna tìnìn Tìsevinä,
No time to turn at Beauty's glance,
Ulte nivìn poeyä ayvenut sì fya'ot a sa'u tsun srivew:
And watch her feet, how they can dance:

Talun(a) is problematic in the same way as taweyk(a) -- the only difference between them is the word upon which they are based. While not explicitly stated so by Frommer, it seems likely that the nuance is one of subjectivity (lun reason) versus objectivity (oeyk cause). The best way I can think of to retain a causal relationship is ‹eyk›, but perhaps that is a bit too direct...? (This is a case where the -mo' suffix of Klingon would be perfect...)

Ke lu kea krr a pivey vaykrr poeyä kxa tsun
No time to wait till her mouth can
Tsalrrtokur sìltsan sivi, a poeyä menaril sngeykìmä'i?
Enrich that smile her eyes began?

As mentioned above, tsalrrtokur needs to be next to a in order for the attribution to work.

[Sanhìyä Tirea]

Is there any way of changing the sentence so that talun(a) or taweyk(a) would work?

[Lance R. Casey]

Well, you'd need to introduce a full clause, e.g.:

mivìn taweyka nìn awngat Tìsevinìl
may turn because Beauty looks at us

[Sanhìyä Tirea]

Corrected version:

Peu fìtìrey lu, txo, tengkrr awngaru teya seri tìyawn,
What is this life if, full of care,
Awngaru ke lu kea krr a kllkxivem sì nivìn? —
We have no time to stand and stare?—

Kea krr a kllkxivem äo ayvul,
No time to stand beneath the boughs,
Ulte nivìn nìtxan tengfya *aysyip sì *ayhaw:
And stare as long as sheep and cows:

Kea krr a tsive'a, krr a  awngal ftem ayna'rìngit
No time to see, when woods we pass,
a samì *ayskuìrìlìl yem feyä ayrina'it:
Where squirrels hide their nuts in grass:

Kea krr a tsive'a, mì srr leatan,
No time to see, in broad daylight,
Fayfyat a saru teya si sanhì, na aysaw mì ton:
Streams full of stars, like skies at night:

Kea krr a mivìn taweyka nìn awngat Tìsevinìl,
No time to turn at Beauty's glance,
Ulte nivìn poeyä ayvenut sì fya'ot a sa'u tsun srivew:
And watch her feet, how they can dance:

Kea krr a pivey vaykrr poeyä kxa tsun
No time to wait till her mouth can
Tsalrrtokur sìltsan sivi, a poeyä menaril sngeykìmä'i?
Enrich that smile her eyes began?

Kawng fìtìrey lu, txo, tengkrr awngaru teya seri tìyawn,
A poor life this if, full of care,
Awngaru ke lu kea krr a kllkxivem sì nivìn.
We have no time to stand and stare.