Author Topic: Na'vi Reference Grammar  (Read 14486 times)

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Offline Plumps

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Re: Na'vi Reference Grammar
« Reply #80 on: February 07, 2011, 06:17:43 pm »
What are you getting at? ;) D’you want somebody to start the translation project of the Grammar? :P

Actually, I've been asked for it a few times.  Just this week one of our Polish tsmuktu was thrilled to learn the LaTeX sources were available. :)

I’m all for it! :)
After the dictionary in various languages it’s only logical to have the Grammar translated as well.

It’s a bit tricky because of the linguistic terminology and will take time but I could try it for the German version…

Offline zineketaye

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Re: Na'vi Reference Grammar
« Reply #81 on: February 08, 2011, 05:32:08 am »
Quote from: Plumps

It’s a bit tricky because of the linguistic terminology and will take time but I could try it for the German version…


You have my full mental support on that  ;)... please do it!

If you prefer more substantial support, like cross-reading or something else, please feel free to ask.
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Offline 'Oma Tirea

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Re: Na'vi Reference Grammar
« Reply #82 on: February 08, 2011, 11:48:49 pm »
Quote
          5.2. Reduplication
5.2.1. Iteration. Can letrrtrr and krro krro be generalized?

To confuse things more: tam tam.  I strongly suspect there's no regular pattern to this....

[img]http://swokaikran.skxawng.lu/sigbar/nwotd.php?p=2b[/img]

ÌTXTSTXRR!!

Srake serar le'Ìnglìsìa lì'fyayä aylì'ut?  Nari si älofoniru rutxe!!

Offline Plumps

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Re: Na'vi Reference Grammar
« Reply #83 on: February 10, 2011, 11:38:17 am »
Minor error on page 46, § 6.17.5. – shouldn’t it be  Oe ke tsun stivawm fayfnelì’ut(i) luke fwa sngä’i tsngivawvìk. ??

Offline wm.annis

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Re: Na'vi Reference Grammar
« Reply #84 on: February 10, 2011, 04:29:03 pm »
Minor error on page 46, § 6.17.5. – shouldn’t it be  Oe ke tsun stivawm fayfnelì’ut(i) luke fwa sngä’i tsngivawvìk. ??

It should.  It will be in the next release.  Irayo.
'Awa lì'fya ke tam kawkrr.
A Na'vi Reference Grammar

Offline Eltu Lefngap Makto

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Re: Na'vi Reference Grammar
« Reply #85 on: February 17, 2011, 07:09:13 am »
It seems that people are using fura as a contraction of fì'ur a.  I gather K. Pawl hasn't used it yet, but do you want to list it under 3.4.2?
'Ivong, Na'vi!

Offline wm.annis

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Re: Na'vi Reference Grammar
« Reply #86 on: February 17, 2011, 08:09:44 am »
It seems that people are using fura as a contraction of fì'ur a.  I gather K. Pawl hasn't used it yet, but do you want to list it under 3.4.2?

Nope.  :)

Nothing goes into the grammar unless Paul uses or endorses it.  At best, it would be in maroon, but I'd need to see a defensible use of the form first.
'Awa lì'fya ke tam kawkrr.
A Na'vi Reference Grammar

Offline Eltu Lefngap Makto

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Re: Na'vi Reference Grammar
« Reply #87 on: February 17, 2011, 09:23:38 am »
How about this imaginary proverb:

fkol payti rä'ä tìng fura tolaron fkotì.
Do not give water to that which is hunting you.

 ;)
'Ivong, Na'vi!

Offline Kemaweyan

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Re: Na'vi Reference Grammar
« Reply #88 on: February 17, 2011, 10:37:25 am »
I think you don't need fkol here, just rä'ä tìng payti. And I think, "hunting you" - it's an animate object, so use fìporu a instead of fura. And "is hunting" - that's imperfective aspect. So I think the sentence "Do not give water to that which is hunting you." in Na'vi should be

  Payti rä'ä tìng fìporu a teraron ngati.
Nìrangal frapo tsirvun pivlltxe nìNa'vi :D

Offline Eltu Lefngap Makto

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Re: Na'vi Reference Grammar
« Reply #89 on: February 17, 2011, 11:15:29 am »
I think you don't need fkol here, just rä'ä tìng payti. And I think, "hunting you" - it's an animate object, so use fìporu a instead of fura. And "is hunting" - that's imperfective aspect. So I think the sentence "Do not give water to that which is hunting you." in Na'vi should be

  Payti rä'ä tìng fìporu a teraron ngati.
Irayo ... oooo that makes me think of a possible sentence:
Irayo si fura hawnu oet.
(I) thank what shelters me. (as in a house, a tree, etc.)
'Ivong, Na'vi!

Offline zineketaye

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Re: Na'vi Reference Grammar
« Reply #90 on: February 18, 2011, 09:48:05 am »
Bah! Excuse me for quoting myself:

Quote from: zineketaye
Quote from: Plumps

It’s a bit tricky because of the linguistic terminology and will take time but I could try it for the German version…


You have my full mental support on that  ;)... please do it!

If you prefer more substantial support, like cross-reading or something else, please feel free to ask.

In fact it seems to be the other way around ... I have already "played" with the LaTeX-Sources a bit and it will work  ;D

Anyone who wants to help with the German translation please pm me to avoid double efforts on single items ;)

zineketaye
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Offline Kemaweyan

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Re: Na'vi Reference Grammar
« Reply #91 on: February 18, 2011, 09:53:06 am »
Irayo ... oooo that makes me think of a possible sentence:
Irayo si fura hawnu oet.
(I) thank what shelters me. (as in a house, a tree, etc.)

No. Furia ngal hawnu oet, oe ngaru si irayo. With irayo si dative should be used for receiver of thank. But the reason should be in topical case.
Nìrangal frapo tsirvun pivlltxe nìNa'vi :D

Offline Sireayä mokri

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Re: Na'vi Reference Grammar
« Reply #92 on: February 18, 2011, 09:59:35 am »
No. Furia ngal hawnu oet, oe ngaru si irayo. With irayo si dative should be used for receiver of thank. But the reason should be in topical case.

I think, he doesn't thank a person, instead he thanks a thing that shelters him (a roof or something).
When the mirror speaks, the reflection lies.

Offline Eltu Lefngap Makto

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Re: Na'vi Reference Grammar
« Reply #93 on: February 18, 2011, 10:13:53 am »
I think, he doesn't thank a person, instead he thanks a thing that shelters him (a roof or something).
That's what I intended... :)  Also, <eyk> verbs could end up with dative/fura's of inanimate things:
I will make that which I focus on begin.
'Ivong, Na'vi!

Offline Kemaweyan

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Re: Na'vi Reference Grammar
« Reply #94 on: February 18, 2011, 10:21:33 am »
I think, he doesn't thank a person, instead he thanks a thing that shelters him (a roof or something).

Sorry.. yesterday I saw it and did not answer.. But today did not pay attention :-[

That's what I intended... :)  Also, <eyk> verbs could end up with dative/fura's of inanimate things:
I will make that which I focus on begin.

Only transitive verbs with -eyk- :) Intransitive verbs with -eyk- get -ti:

  Pol oeti steyki.
Nìrangal frapo tsirvun pivlltxe nìNa'vi :D

Offline Eltu Lefngap Makto

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Re: Na'vi Reference Grammar
« Reply #95 on: February 18, 2011, 10:34:10 am »
Only transitive verbs with -eyk- :) Intransitive verbs with -eyk- get -ti:

  Pol oeti steyki.

I was thinking of this in the grammar:

Quote
6.4.4.2. The causee for the causative of a transitive verb may be in the dative, oel ngaru tseykìye’a tsat I will make you see it
and 5.7 in the Nutshell.
'Ivong, Na'vi!

Offline Sireayä mokri

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Re: Na'vi Reference Grammar
« Reply #96 on: February 18, 2011, 11:07:38 am »
oel ngaru tseykìye’a tsat I will make you see it

It's because <eyk> here is used with transitive verb (i.e. that verb can have a direct object: tsat in this sentence).
When the mirror speaks, the reflection lies.

Offline Eltu Lefngap Makto

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Re: Na'vi Reference Grammar
« Reply #97 on: February 18, 2011, 11:17:50 am »
It's because <eyk> here is used with transitive verb (i.e. that verb can have a direct object: tsat in this sentence).
Right!  So if you substitute "that which has no eyes" for "you" in that sentence, you'd have an excuse to use fura.
'Ivong, Na'vi!

Offline wm.annis

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Re: Na'vi Reference Grammar
« Reply #98 on: February 24, 2011, 04:41:25 pm »
A new release today, 1.13, with quite a few changes:

  • better indexing and fuller description in the Clause Nominalization syntax section
  • noted some irregular genitives of nouns
  • fixed case error in 6.17.5
  • fraction forms and syntax with genitive
  • li
  • noun declension with titles and proper noun phrases

Sorry, no *fura.
'Awa lì'fya ke tam kawkrr.
A Na'vi Reference Grammar

Offline Carborundum

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Re: Na'vi Reference Grammar
« Reply #99 on: February 24, 2011, 05:00:54 pm »
It seems like tsnì does in fact not cause a verb following it to take the subjunctive, so 6.8.5. and 6.19.7. need updating.
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