pfv and ipfv in English

[roger]

Hey, just came across an English example of perfective and imperfective (or more precisely progressive, a subtype of imperfective) in Comrie: after verbs of perception.

I saw them kiss - pfv. "kiss" is presented as a whole, an undivided event: = I saw the kiss
I saw them kissing - ipfv (prog). the "kissing" is an internal segment of the event. I can't say 'I saw the kiss'

or

I saw the accused stab the victim. (I witnessed the crime; I can describe it)
I saw the accused stabbing the victim. (as I passed by. I can attest to it, but can't give a full account)

I saw him sit for an hour. (I know he served the full "time out")
I saw him sitting for an hour. (god knows how long he was there)

etc.

So we do have s.t. very close to a pfv/ipfv distinction, just in a restricted environment.

[Kì'eyawn]

Sìkenongìri ngaru irayo seiyi oe, ma roger!  Fì'u law lu oeru nì'ul.

[Ftiafpi]

Excellent, I've posted a link to this from the beginners tense vs aspect thread. These are really useful.

[Teyl Maktoyu Ayfìwopxä]

Argh, more English linguistics, but I'll have to live with them to learn Na'VI properly 

[roger]

Argh, more English linguistics, but I'll have to live with them to learn Na'VI properly 

Well, Mìhìl, how good is your French? French has perfective in its passé simple and imperfective in its imparfait. (Or at least *had*; do you read French lit?) They're both past tense as well, so are equivalent to <alm> and <arm> in Na'vi. But if you understand the diff in French in the past, you can extend it to other tenses. It's just difficult to explain in English, and AFAIK Dutch isn't much help either.

[Teyl Maktoyu Ayfìwopxä]

Well I'm used to Passé composé, passe recent, futur simple, futur proche, ìmperatif, ìmparfait. But passé simple?
Guess I'll have to ask my teacher after Easter.

[okrìsti]

Well I'm used to Passé composé, passe recent, futur simple, futur proche, ìmperatif, ìmparfait. But passé simple?
Guess I'll have to ask my teacher after Easter.

Check out this listing.
So for aller your passé simple would be for example j'allai, nous allâmes, etc.