Author Topic: Worksheets  (Read 18344 times)

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Offline Kiliyä

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Re: Worksheets
« Reply #100 on: January 19, 2010, 05:51:14 pm »
#4. Oe-ri tswayon kelku-ti
      I(TOP) fly home(ERG)
      Given translation: I flew home.

Again, I think you might want an ergative marker on 'oe' rather than the topical. Also, the sentence should probably have perfective aspect to show that it is finished.

Same with tswon. This form actually makes it: I will fly home. -ti is not *ERG but ACC

Hope that helps :)

Actually, technically, that says "I will fly the home," like "I will drive the car."  You'd want a ne in there, to show home as the destination... Oe-ri tswayon ne kelku.
Peu sa'nokyä ayoengyä?  Pefya ayoeng poeru kìte'e sayi?
Pefya ayoengìl poeti hayawnu, na poel ayoengit hawnu?

What of our mother?  How shall we serve her?  How shall we protect her as she protects us?

Offline Plumps

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Re: Worksheets
« Reply #101 on: January 19, 2010, 05:57:03 pm »
Same with tswon. This form actually makes it: I will fly home. -ti is not *ERG but ACC
Actually, technically, that says "I will fly the home," like "I will drive the car."  You'd want a ne in there, to show home as the destination... Oe-ri tswayon ne kelku.

Yes, that's true. I came up with that a few minutes ago in another thread ... don't know why I didn't think of that then :P

Offline Carborundum

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Re: Worksheets
« Reply #102 on: January 20, 2010, 10:40:17 am »
Show me love via karma  :P  glad I helped :D
Oh I will, but I don't think I have worked up enough posts for that yet. Either that, or I'm just blind and can't find the right button. In any case, you'll get yours as soon as I find it  :D
We learn from our mistakes only if we are made aware of them.
If I make a mistake, please bring it to my attention for karma.

Offline Malkollm Eanmenari

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Re: Worksheets
« Reply #103 on: January 20, 2010, 04:13:01 pm »
I am green with jealousy over you guys that seem to roll with this stuff so easily!  Ask me about astrophysics, or VASIMR magnetoplasma propulsion systems, or pyrotechnic special effects and I can talk like an adult. I start diddling in languages and the wheels come off my brain and I overheat.

I haven't had this much fun learning something new since the stone age when I was in college.   ;D

Great, then we can exchange the info the other needs.  Aerospace engineering is my major.  But I picked up this in 8 days.

Offline Malkollm Eanmenari

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Re: Worksheets
« Reply #104 on: January 20, 2010, 05:15:45 pm »
so on wrksht. 1.1: question 5:

_____-ri _____-tsmukan lu txur

With the given translation as:
"My brothers are strong"

The answer in the back is:

oeri aytsmukan lu txur

shouldn't it be:
oeyäri aytsmukan lu txur

??? "my" is the genitive of "I", or so I thought after 4 years of Latin.  Then again, Na'vi is a totally different language (<3 ejectives)...

Offline Plumps

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Re: Worksheets
« Reply #105 on: January 20, 2010, 05:38:12 pm »
so on wrksht. 1.1: question 5:

_____-ri _____-tsmukan lu txur

With the given translation as:
"My brothers are strong"

The answer in the back is:

oeri aytsmukan lu txur

shouldn't it be:
oeyäri aytsmukan lu txur

??? "my" is the genitive of "I", or so I thought after 4 years of Latin.  Then again, Na'vi is a totally different language (<3 ejectives)...

I don't like the topic-marker but whenever there is one, all other markers the (pro)noun should have taken, disappear. The theory is, since there is no other marke in the sentence that would suggest a transitive meaning the understanding of oeri as "my" (but emphazised) would be clear.
I have more problem with *aytsmukan ... ay- lenites the word following, tsmukan is such a noun that allows that. So it should be aysmukan (brothers)

Hope that helped :)

Offline Malkollm Eanmenari

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Re: Worksheets
« Reply #106 on: January 21, 2010, 01:37:05 am »
I don't like the topic-marker but whenever there is one, all other markers the (pro)noun should have taken, disappear. The theory is, since there is no other marke in the sentence that would suggest a transitive meaning the understanding of oeri as "my" (but emphazised) would be clear.
I have more problem with *aytsmukan ... ay- lenites the word following, tsmukan is such a noun that allows that. So it should be aysmukan (brothers)

Hope that helped :)

It did.  Thanks!!

Offline Hawnuyu atxen

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Re: Worksheets
« Reply #107 on: January 22, 2010, 10:21:37 am »
Kaltxì!

Inthe same worksheet:
me+nga-ri lu ay+taronyu (you two are hunters)

sorry, but i can't understand, why is it aytaronyu since it's just two hunters... it should be metaronyu (or something with the dual adpositional affix), so why???
"Hrrap rä'ä si olo'ur smuktuä." ; "Ke'u ke lu ngay. Frakemit tung." (Assassin's Creed)

Nikre tsa'usìn!

Offline Ftiafpi

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Re: Worksheets
« Reply #108 on: January 22, 2010, 11:00:00 am »
Kaltxì!

Inthe same worksheet:
me+nga-ri lu ay+taronyu (you two are hunters)

sorry, but i can't understand, why is it aytaronyu since it's just two hunters... it should be metaronyu (or something with the dual adpositional affix), so why???

Well, I'm going onto a limb that I'm not too familiar with but it's my understanding that either way would technically be correct. You can say "you two are part of the group of (many) hunters" using the plural ay- affix or you could say "you two are two hunters" using the me- affix and either way is correct.

Offline Hawnuyu atxen

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Re: Worksheets
« Reply #109 on: January 22, 2010, 11:08:40 am »
Yeah, i understand that, but... oh, my, at least it should be unambiguous (first time i even heard this word... after 7 and a half year of learning english)
"Hrrap rä'ä si olo'ur smuktuä." ; "Ke'u ke lu ngay. Frakemit tung." (Assassin's Creed)

Nikre tsa'usìn!

Offline Ftiafpi

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Re: Worksheets
« Reply #110 on: January 22, 2010, 11:30:52 am »
Yeah, i understand that, but... oh, my, at least it should be unambiguous (first time i even heard this word... after 7 and a half year of learning english)

Yeah, I'd say the worksheet is correct but the English translation doesn't easily translate into Na'vi because the English translation is ambiguous as to wither you're saying "those two are hunters" or "those two are part of the group of hunters".

P.S. Yea, it is an interesting word.

Offline Plumps

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Re: Worksheets
« Reply #111 on: January 22, 2010, 03:41:04 pm »
"those two are part of the group of hunters".

But wouldn't that then be:

mengari lu hapxì aysaronyuyä ???

Offline Ftiafpi

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Re: Worksheets
« Reply #112 on: January 22, 2010, 03:52:53 pm »
"those two are part of the group of hunters".

But wouldn't that then be:

mengari lu hapxì aysaronyuyä ???


Well, yes, but (unless I'm mistaken) the literal translation of me+nga-ri lu me+taronyu is "you two be hunters" and the literal translation of me+nga-ri lu ay+taronyu is "you two are hunters (referring to a group of more than 3 hunters)"

Offline Plumps

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Re: Worksheets
« Reply #113 on: January 22, 2010, 03:58:53 pm »
I understand it more like

You two are two hunters (both me+) vs. You two are part of a group of hunders (me+ & ay+) (as you already said)

Offline Ftiafpi

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Re: Worksheets
« Reply #114 on: January 22, 2010, 07:01:40 pm »
I understand it more like

You two are two hunters (both me+) vs. You two are part of a group of hunders (me+ & ay+) (as you already said)


yeah, that works.

Offline NeotrekkerZ

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Re: Worksheets
« Reply #115 on: January 24, 2010, 01:15:10 am »
Hello all,

I thought I'd create a worksheet on clauses for everyone.  I hope to have it up in a day or two, so please keep an eye out and let me know of any mistakes you find.  Also, to all the linguists out there I did my best to define everything properly, but if you see anything that you think needs tweaking I welcome your input.
Rìk oe lu hufwemì, nìn fya’ot a oe tswayon!

Offline NeotrekkerZ

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Re: Worksheets
« Reply #116 on: January 25, 2010, 12:19:02 am »
The Na'vi Clauses worksheet is attached.  All comments appreciated.
Rìk oe lu hufwemì, nìn fya’ot a oe tswayon!

Offline Ftiafpi

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Re: Worksheets
« Reply #117 on: January 25, 2010, 10:07:45 am »
The Na'vi Clauses worksheet is attached.  All comments appreciated.

Looks good. I'd put the definition of what a clause is at the very start though. Also, I'd provide room for the person doing the worksheet to write in their answers by hand. As for everything else it looks great, using Frommer's letter for examples was a very good idea.

One other thing I might do would be to match Skxawng's formatting of his worksheets for uniformity but it's not necessary by any means.

Offline Skxawng

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Re: Worksheets
« Reply #118 on: January 25, 2010, 12:15:45 pm »
Fixed 1.2,

as far as lenition goes, Richard and I agreed that until lenition was covered it might be best to leave the words as base so that new learners could use the dictionary to figure out the sentences.   And -ri  ... well, might as well nix it for -yä to make things simpler.

I'll get to those fixes soon, and hopefully this weekend I'll have some time to sit down and make another worksheet on some of the other affixes.


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Offline NeotrekkerZ

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Re: Worksheets
« Reply #119 on: January 26, 2010, 05:04:57 pm »
Thanks for the suggestions ma Ftiafpi.  Version 1.1 is attached.  Ma Skxawng, if you would like to put a link to this document with the rest of your great worksheets, please feel free. 
Rìk oe lu hufwemì, nìn fya’ot a oe tswayon!

 

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