Author Topic: ayoeru mipa aylì'u nì'ul lu, tewti!  (Read 2568 times)

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Offline Skxawng

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ayoeru mipa aylì'u nì'ul lu, tewti!
« on: April 16, 2010, 08:07:20 am »
I didn't have time to make a cool bit of sentences like keyl, but here they are anyway.

kavuk - n. - treachery
fpìlfya - n. - thought pattern, way of thinking
hawng - n. - overabundance
skxom - n. - chance, opportunity
syay - n. - fate
fnu - n. - quiet, silence
ngop - n. - creation     
pe’un - n. - decision
tsaheylu - n. - bond (neural connection)  ... duh ...
kxitx - n. - death

enjoy!

Edit: Added correct stress to fpìlfya. -Taronyu
« Last Edit: April 18, 2010, 04:30:06 am by Taronyu »


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Offline Plumps

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Re: ayoeru mipa aylì'u nì'ul lu, tewti!
« Reply #1 on: April 16, 2010, 08:20:21 am »
TEWTI!

Thanks so much for sharing :)

Okay, kxitx  is a surprise … and there we thought it would be a nominalisation of kerusey or something … Does that mean that there can be two possible words for »dead« now? kerusey and lekxitx?

Swoka Swizaw

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Re: ayoeru mipa aylì'u nì'ul lu, tewti!
« Reply #2 on: April 16, 2010, 08:22:10 am »
Kxitx...

...wow. So much for "tìterkup."

By the way, did Frommer EMAIL these to you? Did you ask him for words?

Offline Plumps

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Re: ayoeru mipa aylì'u nì'ul lu, tewti!
« Reply #3 on: April 16, 2010, 08:36:44 am »
Kxitx...

...wow. So much for "tìterkup."

Well, it’s not out of the lexicon all together – it still means »the (process of) dying«

Yes, I was wondering (and have been asked about that by the members of my subforum) about the process of how these words find the way to you all, as well…


Any information on the stress for fpìlfya?
« Last Edit: April 16, 2010, 08:38:16 am by Plumps »

Offline Skxawng

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Re: ayoeru mipa aylì'u nì'ul lu, tewti!
« Reply #4 on: April 16, 2010, 09:04:40 am »
All I can say for now that these are indeed from Frommer.


No idea on stress for fpìlfya, I put stress makers on where stress was given.


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Offline Kemaweyan

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Re: ayoeru mipa aylì'u nì'ul lu, tewti!
« Reply #5 on: April 16, 2010, 09:10:51 am »
By the way, did Frommer EMAIL these to you? Did you ask him for words?

Oe kop nivew ivomum fì'ut ::) Perey oel krrit a livu poru krr ::)


Aylì'uri amip irayo ;)
Nìrangal frapo tsirvun pivlltxe nìNa'vi :D

Swoka Swizaw

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Re: ayoeru mipa aylì'u nì'ul lu, tewti!
« Reply #6 on: April 16, 2010, 09:42:57 am »
All I can say for now that these are indeed from Frommer.

::antsy sigh:: I've never been so irritated and giddy at the same time.

Some people here know things that they aren't telling us. I can respect that, FOR NOW. 8) ;D

Well, it’s not out of the lexicon all together – it still means »the (process of) dying«

Ngay leiu.
« Last Edit: April 16, 2010, 10:03:39 am by Swoka Swizaw »

Offline Ftiafpi

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Re: ayoeru mipa aylì'u nì'ul lu, tewti!
« Reply #7 on: April 16, 2010, 10:55:37 am »
All I can say for now that these are indeed from Frommer.

::antsy sigh:: I've never been so irritated and giddy at the same time.

Some people here know things that they aren't telling us. I can respect that, FOR NOW. 8) ;D

Well, it’s not out of the lexicon all together – it still means »the (process of) dying«

Ngay leiu.

Well, suffice it to say that there are good reasons we're not telling you everything and I bet you can probably guess most of them. We're not just keeping secrets to be cool/mysterious/better than/other-laudative-adjectives-here.

Quote
No idea on stress for fpìlfya, I put stress makers on where stress was given.
Just as a total guess I'd say stress on fpìlfya. But I have no basis for this other than "what sounds better" to me.

Offline NeotrekkerZ

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Re: ayoeru mipa aylì'u nì'ul lu, tewti!
« Reply #8 on: April 16, 2010, 12:30:15 pm »
Fantastic!  Now I can finally do my favorite line from Terminator:  Ke lu syay ke'u slä fwa awnga ngop.

« Last Edit: April 16, 2010, 04:45:10 pm by NeotrekkerZ »
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Offline wm.annis

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Re: ayoeru mipa aylì'u nì'ul lu, tewti!
« Reply #9 on: April 16, 2010, 12:46:25 pm »
Okay, kxitx  is a surprise … and there we thought it would be a nominalisation of kerusey or something … Does that mean that there can be two possible words for »dead« now? kerusey and lekxitx?

Well, we've been told we cannot use the affixes on our own — the precise meanings are not necessarily predictable.  I'd not expect lekxitx to mean dead in any case, but things more like mortal, deathly, etc.
'Awa lì'fya ke tam kawkrr.
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Offline Kì'eyawn

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Re: ayoeru mipa aylì'u nì'ul lu, tewti!
« Reply #10 on: April 16, 2010, 02:19:33 pm »
Tewti!  Thanks for sharing =)
eo Eywa oe 'ia

Fra'uri tìyawnur oe täpivìng nìwotx...

Swoka Swizaw

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Re: ayoeru mipa aylì'u nì'ul lu, tewti!
« Reply #11 on: April 16, 2010, 02:32:00 pm »
Well, suffice it to say that there are good reasons we're not telling you everything and I bet you can probably guess most of them. We're not just keeping secrets to be cool/mysterious/better than/other-laudative-adjectives-here.

Yes. My apologies if I seemed accusing. I'm a conspiracy buff, as of late in my life. :D

Offline roger

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Re: ayoeru mipa aylì'u nì'ul lu, tewti!
« Reply #12 on: April 16, 2010, 02:57:04 pm »
Quote
No idea on stress for fpìlfya, I put stress makers on where stress was given.
Just as a total guess I'd say stress on fpìlfya. But I have no basis for this other than "what sounds better" to me.

Correct: it's fpìlfya. Updated as such at Wikibooks.
« Last Edit: April 16, 2010, 03:21:02 pm by roger »

Offline roger

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Re: ayoeru mipa aylì'u nì'ul lu, tewti!
« Reply #13 on: April 16, 2010, 03:06:10 pm »
Kxitx...

...wow. So much for "tìterkup."

Who knows, there might also be a distinction between 'death' as a count noun, like 'casualty', and 'death' as an abstract noun, like 'Death'. We seem to have a similar distinction between life/lives and Life. Or maybe it's 'dying' vs. 'death' (and 'living' vs. 'life') as suggested just now.
« Last Edit: April 16, 2010, 03:11:10 pm by roger »

Offline Mithcoriel

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Re: ayoeru mipa aylì'u nì'ul lu, tewti!
« Reply #14 on: April 16, 2010, 03:37:57 pm »
Fantastic!  Now I can finally do my favorite line from Terminator:  Ke lu syay ke'u slä fwa awnga ngäpop.


Are you sure you can do that? In English, the word "but" also means "except for", but there are other languages (like German) where that doesn't work. So I'd be careful with just assuming it works in Na'vi too.
I mean if that doesn't work, your sentence would simply mean "There is no fate, but however, what we create for ourselves..[incomplete]"
Ayoe lu aysamsiyu a plltxe "Ni" !
Aytìhawnu ayli'uyä aswok: "Ni", "Peng", si "Niiiew-wom" !

Offline omängum fra'uti

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Re: ayoeru mipa aylì'u nì'ul lu, tewti!
« Reply #15 on: April 16, 2010, 03:46:14 pm »
Yeah, I'm going to go ahead and agree with Mithcoriel here.  You're using it as a preposition, but in Na'vi it does not work that way.  I think "mungwrr" would fill the role you are trying to use it as.  Also, the reflexive doesn't work there either.  That comes out as "We create us" - as in we are creating ourselves, not creating something for ourselves.
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Offline NeotrekkerZ

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Re: ayoeru mipa aylì'u nì'ul lu, tewti!
« Reply #16 on: April 16, 2010, 04:51:19 pm »
Mungwrr is probably a better substitute for slä there.  I'm not completely happy with it, to be honest, either way.  I also realized what you said about äp just now, so I deleted it.
Rìk oe lu hufwemì, nìn fya’ot a oe tswayon!

Offline Prrton

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Re: ayoeru mipa aylì'u nì'ul lu, tewti!
« Reply #17 on: April 16, 2010, 06:19:08 pm »
Okay, kxitx  is a surprise … and there we thought it would be a nominalisation of kerusey or something … Does that mean that there can be two possible words for »dead« now? kerusey and lekxitx?

Well, we've been told we cannot use the affixes on our own — the precise meanings are not necessarily predictable.  I'd not expect lekxitx to mean dead in any case, but things more like mortal, deathly, etc.

I am probably the MOST guilty of this of all so this comes with a strong admonition directed at myself as well, but K. Pawl has said very explicitly to me that «tì-» «nì-» are "not infinitely productive". The things that result when they are stuck on where they are allowed grammatically does not mean that those results MEAN what one intends for them to mean. «Le-» seems a bit safer in general than the other two, but there are no assurances, and attaching directly to something like «kxitx» (which can be very abstract to start with) seems especially likely to cause ambiguities... "deadly/mortal (causing death) / "of the beyond" (after death)??" Wm. is totally correct that it could mean LOTS of different things, especially for those who perceive it as an inflection point among many across the continuum of existence.
« Last Edit: April 16, 2010, 07:43:34 pm by Prrton »

Offline Plumps

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Re: ayoeru mipa aylì'u nì'ul lu, tewti!
« Reply #18 on: April 16, 2010, 07:02:02 pm »
Although I very much appreciate you telling and reminding us about that fact (I think it was said someplace else, we just keep forgetting those kind of information ;) ) – it again puts us in a position where I think we are rather constrained in our ability to use the language. Of course, it all gives the language a speciality but it kind of makes it more and more difficult to ›predict‹ (if that is even possible) what certain variations could mean. Ultimately that means that we cannot use certain variations and ›play‹ with the lexicon in a productive way but always waiting for confirmation from above … a bit sad. But we’ll see how that turns out.

Thanks again for reminding us.

Offline Prrton

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Re: ayoeru mipa aylì'u nì'ul lu, tewti!
« Reply #19 on: April 16, 2010, 07:39:38 pm »
Although I very much appreciate you telling and reminding us about that fact (I think it was said someplace else, we just keep forgetting those kind of information ;) ) – it again puts us in a position where I think we are rather constrained in our ability to use the language. Of course, it all gives the language a speciality but it kind of makes it more and more difficult to ›predict‹ (if that is even possible) what certain variations could mean. Ultimately that means that we cannot use certain variations and ›play‹ with the lexicon in a productive way but always waiting for confirmation from above … a bit sad. But we’ll see how that turns out.

Thanks again for reminding us.


Oh, I don't mean that we should have any strict prohibition!!!  :o

I just think that when we're doing that (innovating (be it with tì-, nì-, le- or not)), we need to BE AWARE that the meaning that our mind is seeing is not necessarily the same as the meaning that the reader/listener is perceiving. It might require explanation. And, if something comes up later that locks in a different meaning, in some cases we may need to be willing to let go.

   Rutxe, salew uvan sivi nìfya ngar prrte' livu!!

I'd be shocked to hear that you've ever seen «nìfya» (especially the way I'm using it: nìfya (a) [clause] to mean roughly: "as/however _____") blessed in any way by K. Pawl, but that doesn't stop me from using it. It might turn out to be a good way to do this or it might require «fa fya'o a ______» every time? Or be something completely different (nì'i'a)...??

I wouldn't be surprised however, if many people reading it don't have any trouble at all interpreting what I intended as the meaning. Or with «nì'i'a» for that matter... but I'm not EXACTLY sure what I think that one means either.

K. Pawl invited us to HELP him with the LEP and many of those lexical items come with questions about actual relationships to existing words/grammar and some suggestions.

I'm all for PLAYING AWAY, but at the same time, not assuming that our/my version of OUR/MY game is the only way to play.  ;)
« Last Edit: April 16, 2010, 07:42:26 pm by Prrton »

 

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