Author Topic: "Capturing Avatar"  (Read 2283 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline wm.annis

  • Olo'eyktan Anawm
  • Palulukan Makto
  • *****
  • *
  • Posts: 3074
  • Karma: 143
  • Translate the meaning, not the words!
"Capturing Avatar"
« on: November 25, 2010, 08:15:46 pm »
Yet another bit of Na'vi from the documentary stuff.  This time, from the "Capturing Avatar" stuff on the 3rd DVD.  28 minutes in, we get another screen shot of some Na'vi dialog on a page.

 Fayvrrtep fìtsenge lu kxanì.  Fìpoti oel tspìyang, fte tìkenong liyevu aylaru.
 These demons are forbidden here.  I will kill this one as a lesson to the others.

The translation is what's on the page.  Literally it's a bit different.  Nothing new really here, though we've not seen fìpo much used.
« Last Edit: November 25, 2010, 08:42:24 pm by wm.annis »
'Awa lì'fya ke tam kawkrr.
A Na'vi Reference Grammar

Offline Txonä Unil Stä'nìyu Rolyusì

  • Palulukan Makto
  • *****
  • *
  • *
  • Posts: 2190
  • Karma: 23
  • Mowana tsamsiyu aean alu Tsyeyk <3
    • Facebook
Re: "Capturing Avatar"
« Reply #1 on: November 25, 2010, 08:32:04 pm »
Wouldn't that be "aylaru" and "lìyevu" (with the grave ì?") Just curious.

-Txonä Rolyu




AvatarMeet was fantastic. Thanks to all who attended :D

Avatar Nation Karyu :D

Na'vi Kintrrä #70° :D

Keyeyluke ke tsun livu kea tìnusume

Oeri Uniltìrantokxìl txe'lanit nì'aw takeiuk nì'ul txa' fralo

Fpìl na Na'vi. Plltxe na Na'vi. Tìran na Na'vi. Kame na Na'vi

Offline Kemaweyan

  • Eywatsyìp
  • ******
  • *
  • Posts: 14675
  • ua Ukraine
  • Karma: 240
  • Swirä letxon
Re: "Capturing Avatar"
« Reply #2 on: November 25, 2010, 08:36:57 pm »
Wouldn't that be "aylaru"

Maybe it's just a typo?

"lìyevu" (with the grave ì?")

There is no difference :)
Nìrangal frapo tsirvun pivlltxe nìNa'vi :D

Offline wm.annis

  • Olo'eyktan Anawm
  • Palulukan Makto
  • *****
  • *
  • Posts: 3074
  • Karma: 143
  • Translate the meaning, not the words!
Re: "Capturing Avatar"
« Reply #3 on: November 25, 2010, 08:44:08 pm »
Wouldn't that be "aylaru" and "lìyevu" (with the grave ì?") Just curious.

D'oh!   Aylaru fixed.

It's hard for me to see in liyevu what the iyev/ìyev choice is.  The fake English-ese phonetics make me think it's liyevu.  But as Kemaweyan says, it's not a huge question.
'Awa lì'fya ke tam kawkrr.
A Na'vi Reference Grammar

Offline Tirea Aean

  • The Blue One
  • Olo'eyktan Anawm
  • Palulukan Makto
  • *****
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • Posts: 9944
  • nv Eywa'eveng
  • Karma: 243
  • Oeri ran lu srung
    • Tirea Aean
Re: "Capturing Avatar"
« Reply #4 on: November 25, 2010, 10:50:08 pm »
Wouldn't that be "aylaru" and "lìyevu" (with the grave ì?") Just curious.

D'oh!   Aylaru fixed.

It's hard for me to see in liyevu what the iyev/ìyev choice is.  The fake English-ese phonetics make me think it's liyevu.  But as Kemaweyan says, it's not a huge question.

to me, it always makes sense to not use the grave i, since AFIK it is really the i from iv:

iv gets split open to put in ìy. but sometimes it is more apparently natural to pronounce the i as a ì. so really, whichever is more natural to pronounce should be the answer to which to use. they are canonized to be eqivalent.

kelku ikranä a hawnventi yom podcast (na'vi-only): https://open.spotify.com/show/2wphPUbaeR6srA05Rh0t3O
Learn Na'vi Discord Chat: https://discord.gg/WF6qcmv

Offline 'Oma Tirea

  • Palulukan Makto
  • *****
  • *
  • Posts: 3874
  • Karma: 50
  • Na'vi... sleru... rusti...
Re: "Capturing Avatar"
« Reply #5 on: November 25, 2010, 10:52:07 pm »
Wouldn't that be "aylaru" and "lìyevu" (with the grave ì?") Just curious.

D'oh!   Aylaru fixed.

It's hard for me to see in liyevu what the iyev/ìyev choice is.  The fake English-ese phonetics make me think it's liyevu.  But as Kemaweyan says, it's not a huge question.

to me, it always makes sense to not use the grave i, since AFIK it is really the i from iv:

iv gets split open to put in ìy. but sometimes it is more apparently natural to pronounce the i as a ì. so really, whichever is more natural to pronounce should be the answer to which to use. they are canonized to be eqivalent.

It could also be possible that "ìyev" is a mere "i" laxing beofre the "y" in "iyev" for ease of pronounciation.

[img]http://swokaikran.skxawng.lu/sigbar/nwotd.php?p=2b[/img]

ÌTXTSTXRR!!

Srake serar le'Ìnglìsìa lì'fyayä aylì'ut?  Nari si älofoniru rutxe!!

Offline Tirea Aean

  • The Blue One
  • Olo'eyktan Anawm
  • Palulukan Makto
  • *****
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • Posts: 9944
  • nv Eywa'eveng
  • Karma: 243
  • Oeri ran lu srung
    • Tirea Aean
Re: "Capturing Avatar"
« Reply #6 on: November 25, 2010, 11:13:59 pm »
Wouldn't that be "aylaru" and "lìyevu" (with the grave ì?") Just curious.

D'oh!   Aylaru fixed.

It's hard for me to see in liyevu what the iyev/ìyev choice is.  The fake English-ese phonetics make me think it's liyevu.  But as Kemaweyan says, it's not a huge question.

to me, it always makes sense to not use the grave i, since AFIK it is really the i from iv:

iv gets split open to put in ìy. but sometimes it is more apparently natural to pronounce the i as a ì. so really, whichever is more natural to pronounce should be the answer to which to use. they are canonized to be eqivalent.

It could also be possible that "ìyev" is a mere "i" laxing beofre the "y" in "iyev" for ease of pronounciation.



it is...but i think its actually easier to say iyev sometimes. that laxing only happens when it is natural to do so. i feel sometimes getting the ì in that correctly takes too much work where the i would be easier. just me, i guess.

kelku ikranä a hawnventi yom podcast (na'vi-only): https://open.spotify.com/show/2wphPUbaeR6srA05Rh0t3O
Learn Na'vi Discord Chat: https://discord.gg/WF6qcmv

Offline Ikran Ahiyìk

  • Ikran Makto
  • *****
  • *
  • Posts: 800
  • Karma: 30
  • Key aronsrelngawnop. Key aswey.
Re: "Capturing Avatar"
« Reply #7 on: November 26, 2010, 04:37:49 am »
imv is from iv and am/ìm, so weather this is from iv and ay.. or ìy, iyev make more sense. And i is much more faster than ì in typing. But the problem is, we always use ìyev, and there is a word kìyevame... :P
Plltxe nìhiyìk na ikran... oe fmeri sìltsan nì'ul slivu, ngaytxoa...


See the new version with fingerings!
Avatar credits to O-l-i-v-i.

Offline Tirea Aean

  • The Blue One
  • Olo'eyktan Anawm
  • Palulukan Makto
  • *****
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • Posts: 9944
  • nv Eywa'eveng
  • Karma: 243
  • Oeri ran lu srung
    • Tirea Aean
Re: "Capturing Avatar"
« Reply #8 on: November 26, 2010, 11:00:52 am »
imv is from iv and am/ìm, so weather this is from iv and ay.. or ìy, iyev make more sense. And i is much more faster than ì in typing. But the problem is, we always use ìyev, and there is a word kìyevame... :P

yeah...but if you have my custom Na'vi kb (cough) then it is equally as fast to type ä, ì, and a and i. ;)

the word may be kìyevame, but very often these days, since I PRONOUNCE it more naturally as kiyevame, i tend to write it that way. and it has been clearly said, even by Paul, ages ago , that kiyevame and kìyevame are equal and interchangable as any word to contain [iyev]=[ìyev]

kelku ikranä a hawnventi yom podcast (na'vi-only): https://open.spotify.com/show/2wphPUbaeR6srA05Rh0t3O
Learn Na'vi Discord Chat: https://discord.gg/WF6qcmv

Offline Txonä Unil Stä'nìyu Rolyusì

  • Palulukan Makto
  • *****
  • *
  • *
  • Posts: 2190
  • Karma: 23
  • Mowana tsamsiyu aean alu Tsyeyk <3
    • Facebook
Re: "Capturing Avatar"
« Reply #9 on: November 26, 2010, 03:10:30 pm »
Cool I didn't know i'd start a whole discussion about this lol. Well now I know that <iyev> and <ìyev> are both equally acceptable :) and I agree that pronunciation is easier with the regular i and that the regular i makes more sense anyway. Thanks all!

-Txonä Rolyu




AvatarMeet was fantastic. Thanks to all who attended :D

Avatar Nation Karyu :D

Na'vi Kintrrä #70° :D

Keyeyluke ke tsun livu kea tìnusume

Oeri Uniltìrantokxìl txe'lanit nì'aw takeiuk nì'ul txa' fralo

Fpìl na Na'vi. Plltxe na Na'vi. Tìran na Na'vi. Kame na Na'vi

Offline Tirea Aean

  • The Blue One
  • Olo'eyktan Anawm
  • Palulukan Makto
  • *****
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • Posts: 9944
  • nv Eywa'eveng
  • Karma: 243
  • Oeri ran lu srung
    • Tirea Aean
Re: "Capturing Avatar"
« Reply #10 on: November 26, 2010, 04:40:28 pm »
Cool I didn't know i'd start a whole discussion about this lol. Well now I know that <iyev> and <ìyev> are both equally acceptable :) and I agree that pronunciation is easier with the regular i and that the regular i makes more sense anyway. Thanks all!

-Txonä Rolyu

I mean there ARE times where it seems more natural to use ìyev over iyev... back on topic perhaps? Srry guys D:

kelku ikranä a hawnventi yom podcast (na'vi-only): https://open.spotify.com/show/2wphPUbaeR6srA05Rh0t3O
Learn Na'vi Discord Chat: https://discord.gg/WF6qcmv

Offline wm.annis

  • Olo'eyktan Anawm
  • Palulukan Makto
  • *****
  • *
  • Posts: 3074
  • Karma: 143
  • Translate the meaning, not the words!
Re: "Capturing Avatar"
« Reply #11 on: November 26, 2010, 06:51:28 pm »
Oy!  This is just an abbreviated version of what's in the BD-Live content.
'Awa lì'fya ke tam kawkrr.
A Na'vi Reference Grammar

Offline Ftiafpi

  • Olo'eyktan
  • Palulukan Makto
  • *****
  • *
  • Posts: 4759
  • Karma: 123
  • Plltxe 'eylan ulte fpxäkìm.
Re: "Capturing Avatar"
« Reply #12 on: November 26, 2010, 07:31:26 pm »
I can't seem to find the email from Frommer, perhaps it's on my laptop, but a paraphrase from him that I remember quite well (it was one of my first emails to him) he mentioned that kìyevame is the preferred or "proper" form of that word. I'm not sure what this means for <iyev> vs <ìyev> but I wonder if it comes down to certain words will take certain forms?

If I can dig up that email I'll post it here.

Offline Tirea Aean

  • The Blue One
  • Olo'eyktan Anawm
  • Palulukan Makto
  • *****
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • Posts: 9944
  • nv Eywa'eveng
  • Karma: 243
  • Oeri ran lu srung
    • Tirea Aean
Re: "Capturing Avatar"
« Reply #13 on: November 28, 2010, 01:15:08 pm »
I can't seem to find the email from Frommer, perhaps it's on my laptop, but a paraphrase from him that I remember quite well (it was one of my first emails to him) he mentioned that kìyevame is the preferred or "proper" form of that word. I'm not sure what this means for <iyev> vs <ìyev> but I wonder if it comes down to certain words will take certain forms?

If I can dig up that email I'll post it here.

its cuz kìyevame caught on so quick and spread so wide and didnt give a chance to the iyev version. thats probably not 100% thue tho.

thanks for that!

kelku ikranä a hawnventi yom podcast (na'vi-only): https://open.spotify.com/show/2wphPUbaeR6srA05Rh0t3O
Learn Na'vi Discord Chat: https://discord.gg/WF6qcmv

Offline omängum fra'uti

  • Moderator Emeritus
  • Palulukan Makto
  • *****
  • *
  • Posts: 3804
  • Karma: 127
  • Na'vi's first grammar nazi
    • Pronounced Na'vi words
Re: "Capturing Avatar"
« Reply #14 on: November 28, 2010, 01:52:49 pm »
It "caught on quick" because it is the only form that we have ever had from Frommer.  While he did explain how iyev became ìyev, he has never really given the "kiyevame" form.  And really it's not like it's hard to pronounce it as kìyevame, especially if you take the laxing of i->ì as almost turning into a schwa as I suspect is the intent here.  (Frommer has stated in an email to me that he thinks in unstressed syllables, ì can tend towards a schwa.)  Along with that, I imagine there is perhaps even a weakening of the y so it becomes more of a ì approximate than an i approximate.
Ftxey lu nga tokx ftxey lu nga tirea? Lu oe tìkeftxo.
Listen to my Na'vi Lessons podcast!

Offline Tirea Aean

  • The Blue One
  • Olo'eyktan Anawm
  • Palulukan Makto
  • *****
  • *
  • *
  • *
  • Posts: 9944
  • nv Eywa'eveng
  • Karma: 243
  • Oeri ran lu srung
    • Tirea Aean
Re: "Capturing Avatar"
« Reply #15 on: November 28, 2010, 02:24:46 pm »
It "caught on quick" because it is the only form that we have ever had from Frommer.  While he did explain how iyev became ìyev, he has never really given the "kiyevame" form.  And really it's not like it's hard to pronounce it as kìyevame, especially if you take the laxing of i->ì as almost turning into a schwa as I suspect is the intent here.  (Frommer has stated in an email to me that he thinks in unstressed syllables, ì can tend towards a schwa.)  Along with that, I imagine there is perhaps even a weakening of the y so it becomes more of a ì approximate than an i approximate.

makes sense.

kelku ikranä a hawnventi yom podcast (na'vi-only): https://open.spotify.com/show/2wphPUbaeR6srA05Rh0t3O
Learn Na'vi Discord Chat: https://discord.gg/WF6qcmv

 

Become LearnNavi's friend on Facebook Follow LearnNavi on Twitter! Watch LearnNavi's videos on YouTube

SMF 2.0.17 | SMF © 2017, Simple Machines | XHTML | RSS | WAP2 | Site Rules

LearnNavi is not affiliated with the official Avatar website,
James Cameron, LightStorm Entertainment or The Walt Disney Company.
All trademarks and servicemarks are the properties of their respective owners.
Images in the LearnNavi.org Forums and Gallery may not be used without permission.

LearnNavi Affiliates:
ToS

LearnNavi is the community to learn Na'vi, the Avatar Language
"A place where real friendships are made." -Paul Frommer

AvatarMeet | Learn Na'vi Forum | Learn Na'vi Wiki | Na'viteri

LearnNavi