Sì'eyng a ftu Na'rìng #5: txo/tsakrr, sä-, pe+

Started by Kì'eyawn, October 10, 2010, 05:32:13 PM

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Kì'eyawn

Counterfactuals

In English we have if/then statements:

If you hunt, then we will have food.

In English the condition (the "if" part) is in the present tense, and the consequent (the "then" part) is in the future tense.

Na'vi uses txo and tsakrr:

Txo nga tivaron, tsakrr layu moeru syuve.

In Na'vi, the condition is in the subjunctive (<iv>) and the consequent in the future (<ay>) or near future (<ìy>); e.g., pxan livu txo nì'aw oe ngari / Tsakrr nga Na'viru yomtìyìng, from the Hunt Song.  But we also have the example, Txo new nga rivey, oehu! ("[ Come ] with me if you want to live").  So, it's possible the subjunctive is optional.

Just as English sometimes omits "then," Na'vi often omits tsakrr:

If you hunt, we will have food.
Txo nga tivaron, layu moeru syuve.

You can also reverse the clause order:

We will have food if you hunt.
Layu moeru syuve txo nga tivaron.

But some if/then statements are counterfactuals—that is, they reference a state of affairs other than what actually is:

If you hunted, we would have food.
(i.e., but you didn't hunt, so we don't have food)

We do not yet know how to handle these in Na'vi.  But Karyu Pawl is thinking that there will be a new pair of words that function like txo/tsakrr, used exclusively for counterfactual statements.  We also are waiting to see how the verbs will behave in these situations.

sä-

The prefix sä- is not productive—that is, you can't go applying it to any word you want.  But on the words that use it, sä- plays an "instrumental" role:  A säspxin is the instrument by which one becomes spxin; a säfpìl is how a person fpìl; etc.

pe+/-pe

We have question words like pesu/tupe, peseng/tsengpe; we now know that pe+/-pe can be used freely to mean "which/what":

Pa'lipe lu ngaru?
Which direhorse is yours?

Peikranit tsìme'a oel?
Which banshee did i just see?

Note that pe+/-pe does not change the stress of a word (there had been some conflicting information on this earlier)

So, pe+ lì'u > pe'u/'upe

We also now know that pe+ and the plural prefix ay+ can combine and become pay+.

Payswizawit mìyunge ngal?
Which arrows are you going to take?
eo Eywa oe 'ia

Fra'uri tìyawnur oe täpivìng nìwotx...

Kemaweyan

Irayo, ma tsmuke. Just one question:

Quote from: Kì'eyawn on October 10, 2010, 05:32:13 PM
a säfpìl is how a person fpìl; etc.

what about fpìlfya? I think it also means "how a person fpìl"... :-\
Nìrangal frapo tsirvun pivlltxe nìNa'vi :D

wm.annis

Quote from: Kemaweyan on October 10, 2010, 06:28:11 PMwhat about fpìlfya? I think it also means "how a person fpìl"... :-\

"How" is ambiguous in English.  It can refer to means or instrument, or it can refer to manner.  The sä- prefix is for the first; fya words for the second.  :)

'Oma Tirea

Glad to see my query about pe+/-pe is confirmed *is recovering from the shock of how freely this affix can be used*.

Other than that, just about everything here looks quite expected to me.

[img]http://swokaikran.skxawng.lu/sigbar/nwotd.php?p=2b[/img]

ÌTXTSTXRR!!

Srake serar le'Ìnglìsìa lì'fyayä aylì'ut?  Nari si älofoniru rutxe!!