Author Topic: Na'vi alphabet in French and Dutch  (Read 398 times)

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Offline Vawmataw

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Na'vi alphabet in French and Dutch
« on: July 21, 2018, 11:35:11 am »
This is a 2018 version of the document "Na'vi Alphabet" created by Eywa Mokriyä and Skxawng in 2009 and available on the main website. I thought it would be nice to translate it into French.

Edit: Thanks Wllìm for the Dutch version!

Suggestion: Maybe add links for the audio
« Last Edit: July 22, 2018, 08:17:42 am by Vawmataw »

Offline Plumps

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Re: Na'vi alphabet in French, Dutch and German
« Reply #1 on: July 22, 2018, 04:39:16 am »
Kaltxì ma Vawmie,

as useful as it might be to have the separate documents translated in other languages, as the ‘warning’ already says, “it’s a very old version”.

This needs to be revisited and edited. I’m surprised to see this kind of material on there. By now we have better sources.

Concerning the English table:

Firs, I don’t understand the ‘informal’ part of the table. It’s confusing, especially when you have signs like k' for the normal k which in IPA stands for the ejective. Also there is a reference to “see ejectives below” … but there is no below :D

Concerning the German version:

At least in standard German our vowels are pure, German’s a i o u are exactly like Na’vi’s. So, again, no need for this „Transkription“ column.

ä: why use an English example when we actually have the letter/sound ä in German? Admittedly, Germans tend to make the ä more to an e. My go-to example is „Stäbe“ or „gäbe“

Totally different with
e: why use an example with ä? The quality of the Na’vi e is the same as in German words like „denn“ or „Ende“ (the first one, mind you, not the last, that one is a shwa)

ey: nobody (except for the Swedish influence or to be hip) spells it hej ;) We use the English spelling of „hey“.

i: the „Bemerkung – kurzes ie“ is wrong. It is the long ie as in „Liebe“ or „Miete“

ll: that I find very interesting and I hadn’t thought of that example before! It’s true – because of the schwa-like nature of the second e in „Nebel“ (fog) it is almost like „nebl“. Love it! I used a similar phenomenon in „Kabel“ (cable) ;)

p, t, k: these examples are wrong, I’m afraid, because, at least in the standard pronunciation German doesn’t have these as unaspirated when they appear at the beginning or end of a word. Popular concent is that ours is a harsh language, remember? ;) So, except for dialect varieties p, t and k are always aspirated.

We only have them as unaspirated in consonant clusters, like „Skizze“, „Sport“ or „Stopp“

r: at least in some regional varieties of German (for example Bavarian) r has the value of Na’vi r. My grandmother comes from the region of former Prussia and she pronounces the r like that. ;D So, to go to Spanish is probably fine.

u: well, we know that Na’vi has two varieties of this. Closed would the the examples you gave. Open u would be „Mut“ (courage)

’: I think most Germans  don’t have a concept that the glottal stop is at the beginning of most of our words with an initial vowel. But they understand the concept when two vowels (that don’t form a diphthong) smash together: „beenden“ [be.'ʔɛn.dɛn]. A fun example I realised only recently is the difference between „Rührei“ ['ryr.ʔei] (scrambled egg) and „Meierei“ [meir.'rei] (dairy farm) – although it’s the same suffix, the first one has the glottal stop, the second doesn’t.

Offline Vawmataw

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Re: Na'vi alphabet in French and Dutch
« Reply #2 on: July 22, 2018, 08:28:11 am »
Ultimately I haven't studied German.  :-\

Quote
ä: why use an English example when we actually have the letter/sound ä in German? Admittedly, Germans tend to make the ä more to an e. My go-to example is „Stäbe“ or „gäbe“
I thought ä was pronounced /ɛː/? ä in Na'vi is pronounced /æ/

Quote
why use an example with ä?
Well I understand that but the list is not exhaustive.
« Last Edit: July 22, 2018, 08:44:29 am by Vawmataw »

Offline Plumps

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Re: Na'vi alphabet in French and Dutch
« Reply #3 on: July 22, 2018, 09:00:35 am »
Quote
ä: why use an English example when we actually have the letter/sound ä in German? Admittedly, Germans tend to make the ä more to an e. My go-to example is „Stäbe“ or „gäbe“
I thought ä was pronounced /ɛː/? ä in Na'vi is pronounced /æ/

That’s what I meant when I said most speakers tend to slur ä to e in pronunciation. A big difference when you speak of Beeren (berries) or Bären (bears) ;D in most cases, context will make it clear.


Offline Vawmataw

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Re: Na'vi alphabet in French and Dutch
« Reply #4 on: July 22, 2018, 09:02:09 am »
Quote
ä: why use an English example when we actually have the letter/sound ä in German? Admittedly, Germans tend to make the ä more to an e. My go-to example is „Stäbe“ or „gäbe“
I thought ä was pronounced /ɛː/? ä in Na'vi is pronounced /æ/

That’s what I meant when I said most speakers tend to slur ä to e in pronunciation. A big difference when you speak of Beeren (berries) or Bären (bears) ;D in most cases, context will make it clear.


ah, fine

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Re: Na'vi alphabet in French and Dutch
« Reply #5 on: July 25, 2018, 08:38:20 am »
So, I've added a german verion.  :)

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