Author Topic: What's YOUR Na'vi dialect?  (Read 3344 times)

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Offline Irtaviš Ačankif

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Re: What's YOUR Na'vi dialect?
« Reply #20 on: April 17, 2012, 07:38:13 pm »
Actually, I have no problem pronouncing according to the IPA, but I just feel my way is more...beautiful  ;) A distinctive feature of my Na'vi is between tense and lax E. If I say, "Oe 'eko", the e in oe and the e in 'eko are very different, the first lax (eh as in bet) and the second tense (English "ey" minus the y).
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Offline `Eylan Ayfalulukanä

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Re: What's YOUR Na'vi dialect?
« Reply #21 on: August 14, 2012, 03:32:51 pm »
Bring this older thread back to life, because it brings up some important issues-- language is strongly influenced by the language users.

I'm no good at IPA, but I do know the idiosyncrasies I tend to exhibit while speaking Na'vi. I tend to hit flipped r's real hard, so they are almost d's in many cases. This may be the most 'stylistic' thing about my Na'vi pronunciation. I was not aspirating rolled r's, but this was pointed out to me, and I have made considerable improvement in this area. Finally, I hit p, t and k harder than I should, especially when they should be unreleased. In compensation, I have gottem to the point with pronunciation where my ejectives are nice and clean. Oma Tirea worked with me a bit at Avatarmeet on pronunciation, and I am sure I will tap on his shoulder again.

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Offline Tirea Aean

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Re: What's YOUR Na'vi dialect?
« Reply #22 on: August 14, 2012, 04:31:35 pm »
I have everything down perfectly as per standard, but sometimes I notice that my vowels sound a tad Baltimorian ;D I try not to let my native accent creep in too much. I know IPA, and I can help you with that. it's not as bad as you think. almost every single letter in Na'vi is very easy to read the IPA for. such as [m] [n] [f] [h] ... the only ones that are different are [ʔ] [ɛ] [ɪ] [j] [ŋ] [ɾ] and [t͡s]
« Last Edit: August 14, 2012, 04:35:38 pm by Tirea Aean »

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Offline Tsmuktengan

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Re: What's YOUR Na'vi dialect?
« Reply #23 on: August 14, 2012, 04:35:52 pm »
I have no idea what accent I have, certainy not one that is close to eytukan's (that seems to be aong the best accent references for us, his voice is one of an amerindian type, and does not change whatever the language of the film is). I can have a sort of mix of french accent, and an english one from time to time.

One's accent epends both on his usual pronounciations and the hearing he has of the language and general accentuations. This is why we most of us can have radically different pronounciations for an identical language. And I think this is a charm. Actually I think that two people who spend a lot of time togther speaking Na'vi may mix their accents.


Offline Tirea Aean

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Re: What's YOUR Na'vi dialect?
« Reply #24 on: August 14, 2012, 04:39:51 pm »
it's always interesting to hear (on Teamspeak or what have you) people from outside the USA speak Na'vi. you can almost tell they have a slight accent. it's usually in the vowels. ;)

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Offline Niri Te

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Re: What's YOUR Na'vi dialect?
« Reply #25 on: August 14, 2012, 04:40:59 pm »
 You know, I think that this idea of trying to get everyone to pronounce Na'vi exactly the same way is putting a bunch of pressure on people that might cause some to just give up.
  Just take a look at this country alone. Type up a two sentence statement, and have someone from:

Bangor Maine
Boston Mass.
Brooklyn N.Y.
Arlington Va.
Suwanee Fla.
Maryville Tenn.
Dell City Tx.
Spokane Wa.
and Los Angeles Ca.

Have them read it into a tape recorder, and see if it sounds exactly the same from each of them. Then try two German Sentences from someone from:

Berlin
Frankfurt
and Munich

and see how close THEY are.

I think that it is un natural to expect EVERYONE on Eywa Eveng to speak Na'vi exactly the same, and it would be un natural to expect it of everyone on THIS planet as well.  Get as close as you CAN, but once you get there, don't worry about it.

Due to my Aphaisia, while I can roll single "R's" as good as any German, but the "RR's" the nerves in my tongue will NOT let me do, so I ""purr" with the back of my tongue against the rear of the roof of my mouth, and can do it without affecting the timing" of the word at all, no matter what the word. Does it sound the same? Hell no, but Ateyo thinks it sounds "sexy", and it gets the meaning across.

Just my perspective folks.
Niri Te  

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Offline Tirea Aean

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Re: What's YOUR Na'vi dialect?
« Reply #26 on: August 14, 2012, 04:48:08 pm »
^ mllte

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Offline Tsmuktengan

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Re: What's YOUR Na'vi dialect?
« Reply #27 on: August 14, 2012, 05:15:04 pm »
I am not that sure that all germans have the same accent, yet on a similar size terriroty, take France, we have a radically different accent for so many different landcapes : the parisian/city accent, the usual countryside accent, the southern accent, the south-western accent that is very different as well, and the eastern accent that is tinted with some sort of german influence.

It is the same in the US. A new-yorker or a brit won't be able to understand anyone easily in virginian towns... just like a native french-speaking person will have many difficulties to understand canadian french to the point of requiering an adaptation time.

So at the exception of really badly pronounced vowels or parts, it is pretty useless to bash people who have a clearly identifyable accent, as long as they do an effort. Slight guidance is better. I am thinking about our chinese members here who certainly have a chinese accent when they speak na'vi, and they could hardly erase the accent because Chinese uses very different sounds compared to our western language. And I do think being able to share with our own accents in Na'vi, no mater where we come from, is fantastic!


Offline Ningey

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Re: What's YOUR Na'vi dialect?
« Reply #28 on: August 14, 2012, 05:49:34 pm »
I am not that sure that all germans have the same accent, yet on a similar size terriroty, take France, we have a radically different accent for so many different landcapes : the parisian/city accent, the usual countryside accent, the southern accent, the south-western accent that is very different as well, and the eastern accent that is tinted with some sort of german influence.

You bet. There's not only a difference between the federal states (accent in Bavaria differs from that in Baden-Württemberg, and both in turn differ greatly from those in Saxony, Lower Saxony, Schleswig-Holstein, etc.), but quite often within one federal state (you can, for example, notice a difference between Franken, the northern part of the state of Bavaria, and Bavaria proper, or take Lower Saxony you have a distinct difference between the Frisian dialect around Aurich, Emden, etc. and the Plattdeutsch spoken in the vicinity of Hamburg - and Schleswig-Holstein is yet another story, because there you find a minority of Danish origin) as well.

And to cut a long story short: All these differences in accent and pronunciation make a language alive and are a major part of its charm. Just consider how absolutely boring things would be if everybody spoke the same way... *yawn*
Plus it is also legitimate to assume that even in lì'fya leNa'vi there are regional differences - anything else wouldn't make any sense IMO.


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Offline Ricardo

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Re: What's YOUR Na'vi dialect?
« Reply #29 on: August 14, 2012, 06:36:22 pm »
I am not that sure that all germans have the same accent

The answer:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/f/f8/Brockhaus_1894_Deutsche_Mundarten.jpg
It's an old map but up-to-date for the areas which are still German.

To have an accent is not bad. It would be too sad to never hear again a french accent. (Do french people even know how wonderful it sounds?)
It's nearly impossible to don't have an accent in a foreign language. But that doesn't mean that you can't handle the language and express yourself.

And don't forget: All listened Na'vi has an accent, too, until there are any native speakers who internalized the language and all its rules exemplary. To reach this will take minimum two generations.

Offline `Eylan Ayfalulukanä

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Re: What's YOUR Na'vi dialect?
« Reply #30 on: August 14, 2012, 08:30:42 pm »
Wow! I awoke this thread into a screaming monster!

Although I think it is a good goal to try and get as close to 'IPA' as possible, I doubt few will ever pronounce Na'vi that cleanly.

Paul Frommer is the only person anywhere that can speak 'unaccented Na'vi', and there is no question that his Na'vi is 'accented' by his linguistuc background.

Ma Tirea, I would be interested to learn some IPA from you. I do know the sounds (and a lot of the symbols) for Na'vi, and I definitely know the same (as dictionary editor) for Dothraki. What confuses me is when slightly different vowels are compared, with often significantly different symbols. To understand what is being said there, I often have to go to a site that has the sounds available, and listen.

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Offline Tirea Aean

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Re: What's YOUR Na'vi dialect?
« Reply #31 on: August 14, 2012, 09:34:21 pm »
Quote from: Ningey
And to cut a long story short: All these differences in accent and pronunciation make a language alive and are a major part of its charm. Just consider how absolutely boring things would be if everybody spoke the same way... *yawn*Plus it is also legitimate to assume that even in lì'fya leNa'vi there are regional differences - anything else wouldn't make any sense IMO.

Mllte oe nìwotx. :)

Wow! I awoke this thread into a screaming monster!

Although I think it is a good goal to try and get as close to 'IPA' as possible, I doubt few will ever pronounce Na'vi that cleanly.

Paul Frommer is the only person anywhere that can speak 'unaccented Na'vi', and there is no question that his Na'vi is 'accented' by his linguistuc background.

Ma Tirea, I would be interested to learn some IPA from you. I do know the sounds (and a lot of the symbols) for Na'vi, and I definitely know the same (as dictionary editor) for Dothraki. What confuses me is when slightly different vowels are compared, with often significantly different symbols. To understand what is being said there, I often have to go to a site that has the sounds available, and listen.

It helps to krow the fancy schmancy names of stuff like the unaspirated voiceless velar plosive :)

Though imo I don't believe that is necessary in order to learn Na'vi or any language. It's good for discussion and studies in topics of  intermediate/advancem linguistics.


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Offline Irtaviš Ačankif

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Re: What's YOUR Na'vi dialect?
« Reply #32 on: August 14, 2012, 10:17:05 pm »
it's always interesting to hear (on Teamspeak or what have you) people from outside the USA speak Na'vi. you can almost tell they have a slight accent. it's usually in the vowels. ;)
Actually, many people from the USA have a bad Na'vi accent, as a recording of the meetup would show. English speakers easily mangle up the [u] sound and overlengthen the [ts] sound. Pharyngealizing rathering than ejecting/glottalizing the ejective sounds seems to also be a common mistake - the ejectives tend to end up like Semitic emphatic consonants.

Speaking of my own Na'vi, I feel that it has somewhat of a Spanish plus Japanese accent because of the time I spend learning those two languages. The t's are dental rather than alveolar (though that is somewhat of a habit of me - my Chinese and English suffer the same problem, and for my tongue alveolar stops, although possible to make, seem to be really "tougue-twisting"), the e's are more close than the standard Na'vi e, the flapped R's are heavy and slightly lateral, and I often use a Japanese-style mora-timed pitch accent rather than Frommer's English-style accent.

I also disagree with the notion that Paul Frommer's Na'vi is 100% "standard". What he wrote in the IPA is 100% standard, because IPA sounds have strict definitions. Frommer (rather rarely) does make pronounciation mistakes, often related to English-style O's and U's. Only finely-tuned text-to-speech programs could be called "100% standard"  :)
Previously Ithisa Kīranem, Uniltìrantokx te Skxawng.

Name from my Sakaš conlang, from Sakasul Ältäbisäl Acarankïp

"First name" is Ačankif, not Eltabiš! In Na'vi, Atsankip.

 

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