A human return to Pandora

Started by kintìomum, January 27, 2010, 01:00:35 PM

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Kaltxì Palulukan!

Quote from: Tsu'roen on February 14, 2010, 03:01:56 PM
As for captain Bligh - he is one of the most wronged people in history - mostly due to his negative depiction by Hollywood. The munity on the HMAV Bounty wasn't because he was unusual cruel. It was because he was unusual lenient - instead of confining the crew on board he allowed them to go on land and mix with the locals. As a result many found women and began to get used to the nice and easy island life.
(snip)

1: I just like pirates (arrgh!)

2: Women! bah! Is there any greater poison known to man? (<--Get it? It's Valentine's Day, and I am being . . .)
2022 update: Working on the new astrology book. "How to read tarot" books are on Amazon, if you are into that sort of thing.
Okay, so the old podcast is here: https://www.podomatic.com/podcasts/radioavatar It was goofy fun that ended too soon, but we had creative people. I hope we can get a new gang together (interested? PM me, let's make some magic!)
(Very old, outdated) Na'vi FUN activity book is here: But what are you doing? Let me know! :)

Kätsyín te Zotxekay Tsyal’itan

^LOL, speaking of Valentines Day, that stupid movie knocked us down to 4th place in the box office.
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Tsu'roen

Quote from: Tukruyä Tsamsiyu on February 14, 2010, 04:10:11 PM
^LOL, speaking of Valentines Day, that stupid movie knocked us down to 4th place in the box office.

WHAT?

"There are many dangers on Pandora, and one of the subtlest is that you may come to love it too much" ~ Dr. Grace Augustine

"You have a strong heart. No fear. But stupid!  Ignorant like a child!" ~ Neytiri te Tskaha Mo'at'ite

10x (1x 2D, 3x Real 3D, 6x IMAX 3D)
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kintìomum

Damn, all these ideas! My brain starts ticking...
Now, as far as we know (from ASG and movie) the ISV carries it's passengers in cryo and just a small crew is awake.
The why is the easier part: saving resources. A human floating around the ship needs air, water, food, air cleaners, heating and so on.
One sleeping in his cryo vat is just in need of a large bottle of nutrients to keep a very slow metabolism supplied and some energy to keep the pumps running.
The remaining question now is how long they can keep passengers in cryo. If they have to wake them up when they reach the orbit and then have to tell them: "sorry, someone left us diving nose-first in a big load of taliong-processed plants" there is most likely some argument on board.
If they have the time left to start a basic camp on one of the other moons -preferably the one with breathable atmosphere and rather earthlike conditions- they'll have a lot less problems.
Sure, there will be folks who go the line of: "I didn't sign up for this, I want to go to Pandora, don't mind the natives, I'm peacefull they won't hurt me!" but I guess when they're presented a made bed on the one hand and an uncertain future on Pandora most will fall in line and do what the superluminal transmitter says (or is said to have said, since nothing is as great in controlling folks on edge as carefully dosed information).
But a camp on the other life harboring moon would just be a temporary solution. As Selfridge put it: "This is why we're here, these little stones pay for everything." And if another moon had the same extremely rare element on it I doubt that there wouldn't be a base on it mining the second source at the sime time.
kintìomum : curiosity (lit.: need knowledge)

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Quote from: kintìomum on February 15, 2010, 01:57:46 PM
Damn, all these ideas! My brain starts ticking...
Now, as far as we know (from ASG and movie) the ISV carries it's passengers in cryo and just a small crew is awake.
The why is the easier part: saving resources. A human floating around the ship needs air, water, food, air cleaners, heating and so on.
One sleeping in his cryo vat is just in need of a large bottle of nutrients to keep a very slow metabolism supplied and some energy to keep the pumps running.
The remaining question now is how long they can keep passengers in cryo. If they have to wake them up when they reach the orbit and then have to tell them: "sorry, someone left us diving nose-first in a big load of taliong-processed plants" there is most likely some argument on board.
If they have the time left to start a basic camp on one of the other moons -preferably the one with breathable atmosphere and rather earthlike conditions- they'll have a lot less problems.
Sure, there will be folks who go the line of: "I didn't sign up for this, I want to go to Pandora, don't mind the natives, I'm peacefull they won't hurt me!" but I guess when they're presented a made bed on the one hand and an uncertain future on Pandora most will fall in line and do what the superluminal transmitter says (or is said to have said, since nothing is as great in controlling folks on edge as carefully dosed information).
But a camp on the other life harboring moon would just be a temporary solution. As Selfridge put it: "This is why we're here, these little stones pay for everything." And if another moon had the same extremely rare element on it I doubt that there wouldn't be a base on it mining the second source at the sime time.

See? That is my point. (great post of course)

First: How long can they keep everyone in cryo--and thus keep this under wraps--or "the situation contained"? The FIRST thing that happens when people wake up is they expect to be going to Pandora. Do you process them as normal (in stages), but shuttle them to some distant part of Pandora to sleep on rocks and twigs? Do you pull a small crew to set up a base for the rest (who have to come out of cryo at some point)? And who's to say the local commander is going to A: like this turn of events, B: be a loyal company man, or C: be able to motivate everyone to stay in line when their future (and their paychecks) just got shot to Hell?

It just seems that human nature will make people VERY angry, and feeling VERY betrayed. It only takes a few loudmouths to stir up a lot of trouble. Just some thots :)
2022 update: Working on the new astrology book. "How to read tarot" books are on Amazon, if you are into that sort of thing.
Okay, so the old podcast is here: https://www.podomatic.com/podcasts/radioavatar It was goofy fun that ended too soon, but we had creative people. I hope we can get a new gang together (interested? PM me, let's make some magic!)
(Very old, outdated) Na'vi FUN activity book is here: But what are you doing? Let me know! :)

Tsu'roen

#105
Quote from: Kaltxì Palulukan! on February 15, 2010, 11:51:02 PM
Quote from: kintìomum on February 15, 2010, 01:57:46 PM
Damn, all these ideas! My brain starts ticking...
Now, as far as we know (from ASG and movie) the ISV carries it's passengers in cryo and just a small crew is awake.
The why is the easier part: saving resources. A human floating around the ship needs air, water, food, air cleaners, heating and so on.
One sleeping in his cryo vat is just in need of a large bottle of nutrients to keep a very slow metabolism supplied and some energy to keep the pumps running.
The remaining question now is how long they can keep passengers in cryo. If they have to wake them up when they reach the orbit and then have to tell them: "sorry, someone left us diving nose-first in a big load of taliong-processed plants" there is most likely some argument on board.
If they have the time left to start a basic camp on one of the other moons -preferably the one with breathable atmosphere and rather earthlike conditions- they'll have a lot less problems.
Sure, there will be folks who go the line of: "I didn't sign up for this, I want to go to Pandora, don't mind the natives, I'm peacefull they won't hurt me!" but I guess when they're presented a made bed on the one hand and an uncertain future on Pandora most will fall in line and do what the superluminal transmitter says (or is said to have said, since nothing is as great in controlling folks on edge as carefully dosed information).
But a camp on the other life harboring moon would just be a temporary solution. As Selfridge put it: "This is why we're here, these little stones pay for everything." And if another moon had the same extremely rare element on it I doubt that there wouldn't be a base on it mining the second source at the sime time.

See? That is my point. (great post of course)

First: How long can they keep everyone in cryo--and thus keep this under wraps--or "the situation contained"? The FIRST thing that happens when people wake up is they expect to be going to Pandora. Do you process them as normal (in stages), but shuttle them to some distant part of Pandora to sleep on rocks and twigs? Do you pull a small crew to set up a base for the rest (who have to come out of cryo at some point)? And who's to say the local commander is going to A: like this turn of events, B: be a loyal company man, or C: be able to motivate everyone to stay in line when their future (and their paychecks) just got shot to Hell?

It just seems that human nature will make people VERY angry, and feeling VERY betrayed. It only takes a few loudmouths to stir up a lot of trouble. Just some thots :)
Pandorapedia (I'm not sure if this is actually a valid source! It seems to be open source.) has a detailed description of the cryo process.
Now I have serious doubts that a process like described there can work at all (just one point of many: freezer burn).
But let's assume for a moment that it's canon. Then it can be deducted that the time in cryo isn't really limited - for sure it wouldn't be too dangerous to just keep the passengers in it for the flight back to Earth.
But considering the following they may just dump them in orbit to save fuel for the return flight:
"... Unfortunately, the cost of shipping back personnel precludes returning individuals still under contract who have medical problems that cannot be treated on Pandora, so they are euthanized there. The only exception to this policy is for high-level RDA executives."[1] (Wow! Is the name of the RDA CEO by any chance Adolf?)

There are several other things to consider:
1. when do they normally start waking up people?
I would say the full wakeup takes at least a day if not more depending on the temperature the bodies are frozen at (anybody ever unfrozen a whole pig?). And the final stage takes the attention of the entire crew. So they will start it at a point that the passengers can stay in their chambers until they are in a stable orbit around Pandora as you really don't want to have 100 untrained people bouncing around in the ship while you make final course adjustments.
So the wakeup will not be initiated until at most a week into orbit

2. when does the crew normally contact Hell's Gate tower.?
Normal electromagnetic transmissions (radio, laser) are as fast as light so they probably would start some initial contact somewhere from about one light hour into the system (laser). More regular contact will only make sense from a distance close enough for regular radio - probably not more than a few light minutes out.
So several days if not weeks before arrival (I'm too lazy to calculate that precisely now) the crew on duty will find out for sure about the changed situation on Pandora.
That should be way enough time to stop or not not even start the usual wakeup routine.

3. did the Earth bound ship send a warning to the Pandora bound ships?
I would say yes. The ship Jake has sent away could have set up a beacon signal that sends during flight. They even could talk directly for a few minutes when passing each other - given that the ships maintain an open emergency channel at all time - but I would consider that standard procedure.

4. how does the new management at Hell's Gate Tower handle the arrival?
Are they upfront about the changed situation or try they to hide it? Unless they plan to highjack the ship what's the point of lying? Also they have to assume the possibility discussed under 3. - that the ship already knows.

5. How does the ISV crew react? What are their options?
They can try a forceful recapture of Hell's Gate.
If we assume
- 20% of the population of Hell's Gate was Sec-Ops
- the rotation is proportional
- the number of 100 passengers for the ISV is correct [1]
then the ship has 20 trained soldiers. Let's just assume several of the other passengers have also military training - heck, let's go all out and assume they get a total of 50 persons with at least basic military training.

But what military equipment do they have if any?
They most likely have a few boxes of replacement small arms, machineguns and ammunition. For sure they have no heavy equipment on board.
I'm not sure if they make the mine explosives on Pandora or import them from Earth - but for the sake of argument let's just assume they bring them in from Earth. So they have a few pallets of that too.

To sum this up
- they have about 50 men/woman with small arms or machineguns.
- they have enough explosives to make some nasty bombs
- they have 2 shuttles

Now, they can't bomb Hell's Gate because they need it intact for their survival.
They can bomb a clearing into the forest nearby to try a landing there and take Hell's Gate from the ground. Though with the animals on Pandora and Eywa now aware of the danger form those aliens I would consider that suicide.
They could commit one shuttle as a dive-bomber straight into the Tree of Souls to take out Eywa - if that is at all possible. And if they find a pilot who is willing to commit suicide since this is for sure a Kamikaze mission - I doubt it.

As a counterstrike the Na'vi could blow up the antimatter plant and eliminate any hope for the ship to return (and they can't stay either)

So the direct military options don't look good at all and they need to negotiate with the Na'vi for a delivery of antimatter and hydrogen for the trip back.

Most likely scenario is therefore that the crew leaves the passengers for the moment in cryo and tries to get as much fuel from Pandora as possible.

From there they have a few more options:
- They can wait for instruction from Earth how to proceed
- or they can immediately return to Earth (and loose their jobs for sure)
If they stay their options are:
a) - look for a place to land on one of the other moons.
b) - wake up some specialists and start setting up a robot factory to produce what they need for survival and heavy equipment for a recapture of Pandora.
c) - unload everything (including passengers) in a safe place and return for the next load.
d) - send most of the ships crew back into cryo sleep and just wait for the next ships to arrive (= more manpower).
e) - They can look if there is an alternative source of unobtanium in the system (assuming that hasn't been done before with a negative outcome).

If a recapture of Pandora is the goal a combination of a), b) and d) is the most likely scenario.
"There are many dangers on Pandora, and one of the subtlest is that you may come to love it too much" ~ Dr. Grace Augustine

"You have a strong heart. No fear. But stupid!  Ignorant like a child!" ~ Neytiri te Tskaha Mo'at'ite

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1x Special Ed. (1x IMAX 3D)

Kaltxì Palulukan!

#106
All good points (very good--you would make a great RDA cost/risk analyst).

Here is my main concern, boiled down to a sticky, gooey substance:

1: Monday you are strapped in to go to Pandora. You have a wife and kids to feed, rent to pay, breathable air to buy.
2: Tuesday (6 years later) you wake up "the next day," still believing everything you did "yesterday" (6 years ago) but with a bad hangover, and the following news:

"Um... we regret to announce that Pandora is now "off limits." As there are no mining jobs in this sector, and well, come to think of it, none in the Sol system, your contract has been terminated*. Your services are no-longer needed by RDA, but we thank you for your past performance. While a handful of you will be rotated out to await future ships, for (possible) transport back to Earth, our cost-analyst exprt (Tsu'roen) has determined that returning you back to Terra would incur 3.7 billion Earth Euro-Dollars (current market value--but when adjusted for the almost inevitable market crash and subsequent economic depression...charting out 6 years--will probably be more like 17.9 billion Euro-Dollars) of unrecoupable investment capital.

Translation: "Aint none of you worth no 187 million dollars each!"

Okay, so you wake up and get the news. Your kindly field COO has thought you *might* have a chance cannibalizing the ISV to make a base on a nearby moon. It's that or euthanasia. So, now how do YOU feel about the RDA? What about the wife and kids who are now forced into prostitution, slave labor, or left to starve slowly? Your salary just vanished. Oh, I'm sorry, did the RDA already OWE you 6 years in back employment salary? HA! good luck getting that money! As Ashton Kucher would have said in th early-20th century:

"You just got punk'd!"

* James Cameron wrote AND directed T2 (squeeeee!), and is directing (and writing?) T5, after being disappointed with T4. (double squeeee!) So, coincidence? I think me not!
2022 update: Working on the new astrology book. "How to read tarot" books are on Amazon, if you are into that sort of thing.
Okay, so the old podcast is here: https://www.podomatic.com/podcasts/radioavatar It was goofy fun that ended too soon, but we had creative people. I hope we can get a new gang together (interested? PM me, let's make some magic!)
(Very old, outdated) Na'vi FUN activity book is here: But what are you doing? Let me know! :)

kintìomum

I guess most folks would go a cannibalize-and-maybe-survive-route than sit and wait till breathable air runs out or they are shown the way to the closest airlock.
And I don't think that the RDA would actually pay anyone who is on their ships (well, not the folks in cryo) since they use up ressources and don't earn the corp anything.
I bet it's something like: "Sign here, but your paycheck for the next six years will be used to cover the trip. Once you're on Pandora you'll get this (brightly coloured and blindingly high number) as a months salary. We're set?" (add broad corporate-man-smile from the "I wouldn't dare lying to you" shelf).
And yes, I could really think that while they actually travel 5y 9m 22d on-board time that the RDA cashes the paycheck for six years. After all there's time dilation effects due to high speed (they are traveling ~7y Earth time) and when folks arrive on Pandora and die in the first two months doing their duty for our land the RDA they wouldn't have to pay anything...
kintìomum : curiosity (lit.: need knowledge)

"You don't dream in cryo" they say. Good! Imagine a 6-year-nightmare!

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Kaltxì Palulukan!

I could see a signing bonus: a (token) "advance payment!" to wifey, mommy, daddy, whomever, on Terra, with "guaranteed salary--even while you are in cryo--earning while you sleep!' but that turning out to be the old shell game "Company towns played on coal miners:

1: The company owns the town. Yes, this happened in America, not some foreign country. Now they own the "ship." (town)
2: You get paid !$10,000 a month in cryo! $25,000 a month on basic active duty, more for hazardous jobs!

The fine print reads:

3: Employee is responsible for all transportation, billable at $10,500 per month (times 72-ish?), so you end up in debt the momet you come out of cryo.
4: Equipment rental: Employee is an independent contractor (hereafter: "I.C.") and is supplied with ___ at a cost of $1,000/ month, including time in cryo (again, times $72-ish)
5: Crew quarters rental on Pandora: I.C. is provided basic housing free (a bed), however personal space (apartment) upgrade is $12,000 a month, includes "air, water, and other basic needs."
6: medical insurance is covered. (They take it out of your $25,000 a month).
7: Life insurance is also taken out of your check, with the RDA names as primary beneficiary.
8: and so on...

At the end of the day, you owe the company more money than you will ever make. This is how they built railroads and mines. This was 100% "legal." This was also the birthplace of the blues. Evil capitalists suck. I know--I was raised by them.

1955: Tennesee Ernie Ford (an all-time American music legend) released this classic song:

"Sixteen Tons"

You load sixteen tons, what do you get?
Another day older and deeper in debt.
Saint Peter, don't you call me, 'cause I can't go;
I owe my soul to the company store.
2022 update: Working on the new astrology book. "How to read tarot" books are on Amazon, if you are into that sort of thing.
Okay, so the old podcast is here: https://www.podomatic.com/podcasts/radioavatar It was goofy fun that ended too soon, but we had creative people. I hope we can get a new gang together (interested? PM me, let's make some magic!)
(Very old, outdated) Na'vi FUN activity book is here: But what are you doing? Let me know! :)

Kaltxì Palulukan!

Come to think of it--a comparison of "Company towns" (in American history) and the RDA on Pandora (and asteroids, mars, etc) would be good for the podcast.
2022 update: Working on the new astrology book. "How to read tarot" books are on Amazon, if you are into that sort of thing.
Okay, so the old podcast is here: https://www.podomatic.com/podcasts/radioavatar It was goofy fun that ended too soon, but we had creative people. I hope we can get a new gang together (interested? PM me, let's make some magic!)
(Very old, outdated) Na'vi FUN activity book is here: But what are you doing? Let me know! :)

Kätsyín te Zotxekay Tsyal’itan

That would be a great idea. With its enourmous reach and influence, just like the coal companies of Industrializing America, I wouldn't doubt if the RDA had some kind of a "Screw them over" clause(s) in their employment contracts.
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kintìomum

They actually wouldn't need to, would they?
The RDA controls all interstellar and intrasystem vehicles so they control the price for a ride.
Let the folks earn a decent 5.000 $ which is enough to live a month or two in luxury on Earth. Then you set the price for a ride back from Asteroid 14-F to Earth at 180.000$ and the workers need to stay for at least 3 years before they are able to pay for the transport back...
Then add the "I was rockscraping, I want some luxury down here" and they'll stay even longer. If you add extra charges for transport out of orbit (who said "back to Earth" meant down on solid ground?) you'll keep them another two-three months and so on.
They see that they don't get totally screwed by signing a legal slavery contract and with a bit of light at the end of the tunnel people tend to work harder.
kintìomum : curiosity (lit.: need knowledge)

"You don't dream in cryo" they say. Good! Imagine a 6-year-nightmare!

All Things Avatar: AIM for us on twitter!

Kaltxì Palulukan!

Quote from: kintìomum on February 17, 2010, 11:42:41 PM
They actually wouldn't need to, would they?
The RDA controls all interstellar and intrasystem vehicles so they control the price for a ride.
Let the folks earn a decent 5.000 $ which is enough to live a month or two in luxury on Earth. Then you set the price for a ride back from Asteroid 14-F to Earth at 180.000$ and the workers need to stay for at least 3 years before they are able to pay for the transport back...
Then add the "I was rockscraping, I want some luxury down here" and they'll stay even longer. If you add extra charges for transport out of orbit (who said "back to Earth" meant down on solid ground?) you'll keep them another two-three months and so on.
They see that they don't get totally screwed by signing a legal slavery contract and with a bit of light at the end of the tunnel people tend to work harder.

Your corporate philosophical musings warm my sadistic heart :)

I am working on a nice RDA corporate motivational poster. Waiting on the art. It will directly address the madness of unrestrained/unregulated capitalism.
2022 update: Working on the new astrology book. "How to read tarot" books are on Amazon, if you are into that sort of thing.
Okay, so the old podcast is here: https://www.podomatic.com/podcasts/radioavatar It was goofy fun that ended too soon, but we had creative people. I hope we can get a new gang together (interested? PM me, let's make some magic!)
(Very old, outdated) Na'vi FUN activity book is here: But what are you doing? Let me know! :)

Tsu'roen

Well the RDA can wait a while and then send a nice little fleet of ships with full loads of cherry-picked Sec-Ops guys (including Quaritch's (now really pissed) twin brother ;D), loads of fancy Pandora proofed military hardware - a few Main Battle Tanks, Fighter Jets, plenty of Cruise missiles, ICBMs and to round it all off a few nukes - heck if the Earth government pulls out the law books and complains they can get it from above too, since - who controls the airspace controls the ground! The RDA has Earth by the throat anyway as they are the only supplier of metals and minerals - Earth has run out of most resources and now needs to import them from space.

Yeah - and then they need a competent partner for "terraforming" Pandora and the neighboring habitable moon.

-> The next corporate merger: Resource Development Agency and Wayland-Yutani

From there on they won't have any problems to get all the recruits they want: "work or fight for us and as a retirement plan we offer you a nice little farm on Pandora or it's neighbor moon". That model worked quiet well for the Roman Legions.
How about that for a recruiting incentive ...
"There are many dangers on Pandora, and one of the subtlest is that you may come to love it too much" ~ Dr. Grace Augustine

"You have a strong heart. No fear. But stupid!  Ignorant like a child!" ~ Neytiri te Tskaha Mo'at'ite

10x (1x 2D, 3x Real 3D, 6x IMAX 3D)
1x Special Ed. (1x IMAX 3D)

Kaltxì Palulukan!

Quote from: Tsu'roen on February 18, 2010, 02:47:42 AM
Well the RDA can wait a while and then send a nice little fleet of ships with full loads of cherry-picked Sec-Ops guys (including Quaritch's (now really pissed) twin brother ;D),
I can't help but think of Curly (Jack Palance in City Slickers) and his "twin brother" in City Slickers 2. I loved the colonel, but he really needs to be dead.
2022 update: Working on the new astrology book. "How to read tarot" books are on Amazon, if you are into that sort of thing.
Okay, so the old podcast is here: https://www.podomatic.com/podcasts/radioavatar It was goofy fun that ended too soon, but we had creative people. I hope we can get a new gang together (interested? PM me, let's make some magic!)
(Very old, outdated) Na'vi FUN activity book is here: But what are you doing? Let me know! :)

Kätsyín te Zotxekay Tsyal’itan

Quote from: Kaltxì Palulukan! on February 18, 2010, 10:21:16 AM
Quote from: Tsu'roen on February 18, 2010, 02:47:42 AM
Well the RDA can wait a while and then send a nice little fleet of ships with full loads of cherry-picked Sec-Ops guys (including Quaritch's (now really pissed) twin brother ;D),
I can't help but think of Curly (Jack Palance in City Slickers) and his "twin brother" in City Slickers 2. I loved the colonel, but he really needs to be dead.

Yea, he needs to stay dead. I'm not really all that wild about the "Quartich was driving a human avatar" theory, he died in the movie, he needs to stay that way.
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Tsu'roen

Hey guys, cool down - that was a joke 8)
"There are many dangers on Pandora, and one of the subtlest is that you may come to love it too much" ~ Dr. Grace Augustine

"You have a strong heart. No fear. But stupid!  Ignorant like a child!" ~ Neytiri te Tskaha Mo'at'ite

10x (1x 2D, 3x Real 3D, 6x IMAX 3D)
1x Special Ed. (1x IMAX 3D)

Kaltxì Palulukan!

Quote from: Tsu'roen on February 18, 2010, 12:25:19 PM
Hey guys, cool down - that was a joke 8)

No, no, it wasn't about that at all. You are all kinds of cool. In fact, have a cookie. I was generally grunting about the overall "Colonel in A2" rumblings I have been reading in this forum and elsewhere.

Now--on topic: Human's returning to Pandora: WILL it happen in A2 or A3? Or will it be "The Happy Pony Show"? with Jake and Neytiri, and their adorable (non Star Wars-ish) blue kids with the conflict of who to invite for dinner: Toruk of Palulukan? (This means: who will be the focus of A2 and A3? Are we looking at human exploration of space, or at a world invaded by Humans?)

AND--if Humans DO return, will they bring religion? Crack? Will the Na'vi become addicted to hallucinogenics and become the new "hot slave trade"? What happens (if/when) humans come back?

P.S. I am going to start a NEW THREAD specifically on RDA/Human culture. It will be nice and dark, but as close to canon as possible, so please look for it under "RDA/Human culture speculation."
2022 update: Working on the new astrology book. "How to read tarot" books are on Amazon, if you are into that sort of thing.
Okay, so the old podcast is here: https://www.podomatic.com/podcasts/radioavatar It was goofy fun that ended too soon, but we had creative people. I hope we can get a new gang together (interested? PM me, let's make some magic!)
(Very old, outdated) Na'vi FUN activity book is here: But what are you doing? Let me know! :)

magne

Quote from: kintìomum on February 17, 2010, 11:42:41 PM
They actually wouldn't need to, would they?
The RDA controls all interstellar and intrasystem vehicles so they control the price for a ride.
Let the folks earn a decent 5.000 $ which is enough to live a month or two in luxury on Earth. Then you set the price for a ride back from Asteroid 14-F to Earth at 180.000$ and the workers need to stay for at least 3 years before they are able to pay for the transport back...
Then add the "I was rockscraping, I want some luxury down here" and they'll stay even longer. If you add extra charges for transport out of orbit (who said "back to Earth" meant down on solid ground?) you'll keep them another two-three months and so on.
They see that they don't get totally screwed by signing a legal slavery contract and with a bit of light at the end of the tunnel people tend to work harder.
Agree here, the cost of sending people is far higher than the cost of salary during the stay so it would be the wrong place to cut corners, and the bonus for staying longer makes perfect sense for the same reason.
Downside with a slave contract is that only desperate or stupid know nothing people would sign it, not the one you want to handle expensive equipment four light-years away.

But might wonder how many who has run away from legal or other problems, hard to leave your family behind, easy to leave an investigation.

Kaltxì Palulukan!

Quote from: magne on February 19, 2010, 04:05:43 AM
Quote from: kintìomum on February 17, 2010, 11:42:41 PM
They actually wouldn't need to, would they?
The RDA controls all interstellar and intrasystem vehicles so they control the price for a ride.
Let the folks earn a decent 5.000 $ which is enough to live a month or two in luxury on Earth. Then you set the price for a ride back from Asteroid 14-F to Earth at 180.000$ and the workers need to stay for at least 3 years before they are able to pay for the transport back...
Then add the "I was rockscraping, I want some luxury down here" and they'll stay even longer. If you add extra charges for transport out of orbit (who said "back to Earth" meant down on solid ground?) you'll keep them another two-three months and so on.
They see that they don't get totally screwed by signing a legal slavery contract and with a bit of light at the end of the tunnel people tend to work harder.
Agree here, the cost of sending people is far higher than the cost of salary during the stay so it would be the wrong place to cut corners, and the bonus for staying longer makes perfect sense for the same reason.
Downside with a slave contract is that only desperate or stupid know nothing people would sign it, not the one you want to handle expensive equipment four light-years away.

But might wonder how many who has run away from legal or other problems, hard to leave your family behind, easy to leave an investigation.


You see, the general fact is that life on Earth is so bad that "off world contracts" (Mars, Io, any of the asteroids), is considered "choice" (or "very good") work. The company of course will never tell you that you are going to owe them more than you make (in certain job positions--after all, they need janitors, laundry workers, and non-white collar jobs on "field sites" just as much as they do anywhere else. Pandora is the new super-cool gig. No matter what the job, you are on Pandora! It probably has a coolness factor (and real, or useless bonuses) that makes people fight for that job. The science techs and Avatar drivers (and upper execs of course) probably have good contracts, but the general grunts and menial workers probably get the shaft on a regular basis. It just makes sens to the bottom line.

And I like what you said about leaving problems behind on Earth. There's no place to hide/start over like a different planet.
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