Do the Na'vi cook food ?

Started by Hufwe ta'em, January 24, 2010, 07:37:23 PM

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Technowraith

Quote from: ShadowedSin on February 04, 2010, 02:57:18 AM
The Na'vi do have pronounced fangs but so do bears, who are well known to be omnivorous.

True. The Na'vi are ominvores. They eat both meat and vegetation. Makes for great flexibility during times of difficult hunting. There are numerous edible plants on Pandora, I'm sure that everyday, various clan members go out to hunt and gather food. While we didn't see a storage area per se at Hometree, there might be an area close by where extra food or meat might be stored. Though I doubt meat is kept for any period of time due to obvious lack of refrigeration storage.
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ShadowedSin

Well, they could attempt to dry or smoke it. That is a common method of meat storage.
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AuLekye'ung

I highly doubt they would kill any more animals than they need, being so in touch with Eywä.  They probably hunt only enough to survive, viewing anything else as senseless killing.  I don't see any sort of natural disaster happening that severely cripples the wild animal population.
Txo *fìzìsìst*it oel ke lu, kxawm oel tutet lepamtseo lu.  Oe pxìm fpìl nìpamtseo, oel rey letrra ayunil oeyä nìpamtseo.

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Tìng Eywatikìte'e

They could still smoke excess meat. This would be seen as over killing. They send a lot of hunters out in a day, they're bound to come back on occasion with more than enough meat to feed the tribe over the next few days. Also smoked meats are good for traveling, something the huunters can keep with them to feed themselves on longer hunts.
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Technowraith

Quote from: Keyeunga Au on February 04, 2010, 07:19:04 AM
I highly doubt they would kill any more animals than they need, being so in touch with Eywä.  They probably hunt only enough to survive, viewing anything else as senseless killing.  I don't see any sort of natural disaster happening that severely cripples the wild animal population.

that makes perfect sense in the context of what Neytiri told Jake after rescuing him from the Viperwolves.
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Rim tsamsiyu

Quote from: Technowraith on February 04, 2010, 02:42:22 PM
Quote from: Keyeunga Au on February 04, 2010, 07:19:04 AM
I highly doubt they would kill any more animals than they need, being so in touch with Eywä.  They probably hunt only enough to survive, viewing anything else as senseless killing.  I don't see any sort of natural disaster happening that severely cripples the wild animal population.

that makes perfect sense in the context of what Neytiri told Jake after rescuing him from the Viperwolves.

true but that was an unavoidable incident... kinda

Quote from: Tìng Eywatikìte'e on February 04, 2010, 11:57:05 AM
They could still smoke excess meat. This would be seen as over killing. They send a lot of hunters out in a day, they're bound to come back on occasion with more than enough meat to feed the tribe over the next few days. Also smoked meats are good for traveling, something the huunters can keep with them to feed themselves on longer hunts.

this seems to be a fair assumption however, you cannot always guarantee the amonuts that people will eat or the amount that the hunters will gather. even if they limited it to one animal per party... some larger some smaller.....so there is the possibility that they'd have to find alternate method to preserve excess meat. unless of course they just leave it out for other animals to eat.


Technowraith

The Na'vi may only take what they need. And then leave the rest for natural reclaiming, through scavengers or what have you. It doesn't come across to me that the Na'vi are wasteful in any way. They appear to use everything they can from surrounding forests. Some sort of food storage may exist in case hunters fall upon a spate of bad luck. But again, with enough hunters sent out, someone is bound to find something. A large trophy hunt may have the entire clan involved in some way. The spoils are most likely divided among the entire clan. if there are any left overs? Donate it to the Na'vi charity?  :P
See that shadow? It's the last one you're gonna see.

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Tìng Eywatikìte'e

I'm not sure they would leave food behind. Even with a large group of hunters you cannot be sure that every hunt will be successful, so it's better to always have some food in storage. As said earlier, smoking is an ideal way of keeping meat and would also be a good treat for the hunters to take with them on long trips.
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Tsa'räni

I think there is a difference between hunting in excess, and having a little excess from some hunts.

A clan is going to know more or less how much food they need, and they'll know what they can usually get from the environment around them.  There will surely be some variation, so at times they'll have a more food than other times.  That's just natural and isn't the same thing at all as over hunting an area, taking more far more than the clan can possibly need, etc.

Tìng Eywatikìte'e

Exactly, there is a pretty big gap between just having a few extra kills now and then and making a point of taking more then you could need. The Na'vi clearly know that difference.
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Zefanaya

I think the Na'vi do grow limited amounts of certain vegetables or fruits it would not be beyond them they appear to be at the same level of technology as most pacific coast Native American tribes, also they probably fish as they have a huge river next to kelkutrel.

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kintìomum

Fishing is mentioned as a food source in the ASG (and I still think that the fish look really evil!).
But growing plants? Why? Sure it makes you a little less dependent on the surrounding area, weather, bad times and so on. But living in a rainforest that big with a relatively sparse population and almost perfect growth conditions for the plants (significantly more CO² and light for photosynthesis) it doesn't seem to make that much sense to me.
And every try to grow certain plants is an artificial influence into nature (here: Eywa) which seems to be something that the Na'vi do not do. They take what is offered when they need it and create as little impact as possible, no?
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Tìng Eywatikìte'e

Quote from: Tirey Hawnuyu on February 12, 2010, 06:19:18 PM
I think the Na'vi do grow limited amounts of certain vegetables or fruits it would not be beyond them they appear to be at the same level of technology as most pacific coast Native American tribes, also they probably fish as they have a huge river next to kelkutrel.

Eywa ngahu.

We discussed this in the Na'vi Pet forum quite a bit. At the moment we believe the idea of domestication contradicts with the NA'vi view of nature. To domesticate something you have to take it out of it's natural cycle and control it yourself. You mentioned Pacific Coast Natives, I agree that these are very similar to the Na'vi and one should note that the Pacific Coast is one of the few areas where there were people living in permanent establishments without the need for domestication. The continued their hunter and gatherer society even when settling in one area.
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magne

Quote from: Tìng Eywatikìte'e on February 13, 2010, 04:08:57 AM
Quote from: Tirey Hawnuyu on February 12, 2010, 06:19:18 PM
I think the Na'vi do grow limited amounts of certain vegetables or fruits it would not be beyond them they appear to be at the same level of technology as most pacific coast Native American tribes, also they probably fish as they have a huge river next to kelkutrel.

Eywa ngahu.

We discussed this in the Na'vi Pet forum quite a bit. At the moment we believe the idea of domestication contradicts with the NA'vi view of nature. To domesticate something you have to take it out of it's natural cycle and control it yourself. You mentioned Pacific Coast Natives, I agree that these are very similar to the Na'vi and one should note that the Pacific Coast is one of the few areas where there were people living in permanent establishments without the need for domestication. The continued their hunter and gatherer society even when settling in one area.
Problem with farming is that it's a lot of work, why plant, then water and weed in four months then you can go out and pick it. You need plants suitable for domestication, north America had few good the jungles on Pandora might be worse add the hyperactive jungle ecology who might give a monoculture serious problems. As the Na'vi has pa'li and ikran they can easy forage in a large area. Farming has one main benefit in a stone age setting, you can have more people on a square kilometer, as the Na'vi population is pretty low where is no need.

Many Plain Indian tribes went from farming to nomadic hunter gatherers then they got horses, they made it easy to follow and kill the buffalo. 


AuLekye'ung

So, as a summary:

Farming is out, srane?
Fishing is in
Hunting is in
Gathering is in

Preserving meat is out?

Is that about correct?
Txo *fìzìsìst*it oel ke lu, kxawm oel tutet lepamtseo lu.  Oe pxìm fpìl nìpamtseo, oel rey letrra ayunil oeyä nìpamtseo.

- Älpert Aynstayn

kintìomum

I wouldn't say that preserving meat is out.
Even a fairly large tribe would have it's difficulties with eating a talioang in one unless they plan on lying flat digesting for a day.
And the Book of Quotes shows that they do hunt talioang.
In addition it mentions the nikt'chey (food wraps), that are prepared from -as it seems- whatever is at hand and provides a good meal that's not rotting/running away in the next few days.
It would make sense to take as much meat from a hunted animal as is needed for the happy-hunting-return-party and hang the rest above the firepit to dry and smoke it. Even cooking does some good on making meat more durable (is that right? Sounds strange...) and with the preparation of nikt'chey in mind they could cook or smoke the "excess meat" to use it as a supply for the next hunting party.
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Letxuma Swizaw

i would assume their immense respect of nature would make them a very wasteless culture so it is safe to assume that perhaps they have smoking dens. For the omatikeya maybe in the bowels of kelutrel.
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magne

Quote from: kintìomum on February 13, 2010, 11:14:25 AM
I wouldn't say that preserving meat is out.
Even a fairly large tribe would have it's difficulties with eating a talioang in one unless they plan on lying flat digesting for a day.
And the Book of Quotes shows that they do hunt talioang.
In addition it mentions the nikt'chey (food wraps), that are prepared from -as it seems- whatever is at hand and provides a good meal that's not rotting/running away in the next few days.
It would make sense to take as much meat from a hunted animal as is needed for the happy-hunting-return-party and hang the rest above the firepit to dry and smoke it. Even cooking does some good on making meat more durable (is that right? Sounds strange...) and with the preparation of nikt'chey in mind they could cook or smoke the "excess meat" to use it as a supply for the next hunting party.
Probably true, store food so it last some days and some smoked meat you can take with you on travels. However the Omaticaya clan lives in a tropical or semitropical forest where access to food is pretty constant. Other tribes mostly them living in colder climates has to preserve lots of food for the winter and other times with little food.
It's probably also true for the horse clans on the plains unless they are herders or nomads. 

AuLekye'ung

Well, my point is that, at least the Omaticaya, the tribes would more likely return any un-used food to Eywa.

Also, there are several hundred (or were, I guess) Na'vi in the Omaticaya - in other words, no one thing they hunt should have any left-overs; and they probably do not hunt much outside of a day's journey from Kelutral.
Txo *fìzìsìst*it oel ke lu, kxawm oel tutet lepamtseo lu.  Oe pxìm fpìl nìpamtseo, oel rey letrra ayunil oeyä nìpamtseo.

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Tìng Eywatikìte'e

Yes, no one thing hey hunt would have leftovers, but I doubt they send only one hunting group out. That would be inefficient as hunting can take days and they may not have an success. They would send out a few parties. That way if only one or two parties is successful they would still be able to fee the tribes, and if all were successful they would be able to store meat for times of hardship.

Also, one must think of what they eat through out the day. The fresh kill of the night is probably reserved for the nightly dinner around the communal fire, but they'll still need something to eat earlier. It could be a mixture of the gathered fruits they collected and strips of smoked meats.
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