Eywa...

Started by Neyn'ite Te Tsahìk Txeptsyìp'ite, May 30, 2011, 12:05:10 PM

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Neyn'ite Te Tsahìk Txeptsyìp'ite

I'm sure Quaritch didn't make it to Eywa. ::)

but that's just like asking how to get into 'heaven' or whatever everyone's beliefs are.
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oel ayngati kameie, ma aysmukan sì aysmuke, Eywa ayngahu.
oeyä tsmukan, ma Nick, oeru ngaytxoa livu. nìmwey tsurokx. nga yawne lu oer.

Amaya

Quote from: Neyn'ite Te Tsahìk Txeptsyìp'ite on June 05, 2011, 04:33:42 PM
I'm sure Quaritch didn't make it to Eywa. ::)

Unless, of course, she decided to mine him for the military tactics in his head...no sense wasting resources, after all.

On topic, I agree that it's likely people see Eywa as whatever they expect to see.

Ftxavanga Txe′lan

Quote from: Amaya on June 05, 2011, 09:10:54 PMOn topic, I agree that it's likely people see Eywa as whatever they expect to see.

Yes, I also find it likely! :) So it would be very similar to a practicing people of any religion who would imagine her God according to her own perceptions and ideals, always in relation to the particular belief. :)

Neyn'ite Te Tsahìk Txeptsyìp'ite

if that's the truth, when I die, I want to see Eywa as a Na'vi. and ask her if she will make me one in the next life. :]
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oel ayngati kameie, ma aysmukan sì aysmuke, Eywa ayngahu.
oeyä tsmukan, ma Nick, oeru ngaytxoa livu. nìmwey tsurokx. nga yawne lu oer.

Human No More

Quote from: Lolet te Maticay on June 05, 2011, 02:36:55 PM
Quote from: Neyn'ite Te Tsahìk Txeptsyìp'ite on June 05, 2011, 02:32:55 PM
or maybe she is a woodsprite. (atokirina') or, perhaps, when the Na'vi die or humans with good souls die (I would imagine, since she is real, that she could possibly be the goddess of all life; human as well) that, so as some people say and/or believe, she is shown to them in a form that the dead would expect her to look, or want her to look. :-\ just some thoughts.

That makes me wonder, how good do you have to be to get to Eywa? Or does everyone get to go to blue heaven?
It isn't an afterlife as such, that's humans - it's the preservation of that person's memories, a part of their mind - really, it's more of a living backup than a transfer (except for Grace) - Quaritch never connected to the network at all so he has nothing to do with it.
"I can barely remember my old life. I don't know who I am any more."

HNM, not 'Human' :)

Na'vi tattoo:
1 | 2 (finished) | 3
ToS: Human No More
dA
Personal site coming soon(ish

"God was invented to explain mystery. God is always invented to explain those things that you do not understand."
- Richard P. Feynman

Neyn'ite Te Tsahìk Txeptsyìp'ite

ma Human, it could very well be an afterlife, and each Na'vi bond through to the links that Eywa provides for the living Na'vi.
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oel ayngati kameie, ma aysmukan sì aysmuke, Eywa ayngahu.
oeyä tsmukan, ma Nick, oeru ngaytxoa livu. nìmwey tsurokx. nga yawne lu oer.

Lolet

Quote from: Neyn'ite Te Tsahìk Txeptsyìp'ite on June 07, 2011, 08:39:33 PM
ma Human, it could very well be an afterlife, and each Na'vi bond through to the links that Eywa provides for the living Na'vi.

Neytiri did say that "they live".

'Itan Atxur

Wow! This is actually a pretty tough question. I know that I have imagined the physical for of Eywa, but not in great detail and not very often. Mostly when Eywa is mentioned, I think of the forest.

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'Oma Tirea

Quote from: Lolet te Maticay on June 08, 2011, 06:02:24 PM
Quote from: Neyn'ite Te Tsahìk Txeptsyìp'ite on June 07, 2011, 08:39:33 PM
ma Human, it could very well be an afterlife, and each Na'vi bond through to the links that Eywa provides for the living Na'vi.

Neytiri did say that "they live".

Sran but the question is whether or not they really do live, or whether they have given the Na'vi (including Neytiri) the illusion of life.

[img]http://swokaikran.skxawng.lu/sigbar/nwotd.php?p=2b[/img]

ÌTXTSTXRR!!

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Human No More

Quote from: Lolet te Maticay on June 08, 2011, 06:02:24 PM
Quote from: Neyn'ite Te Tsahìk Txeptsyìp'ite on June 07, 2011, 08:39:33 PM
ma Human, it could very well be an afterlife, and each Na'vi bond through to the links that Eywa provides for the living Na'vi.

Neytiri did say that "they live".
That doesn't mean they are thinking, or holding a conversation. When you listen, it's a lot of different people speaking, which seems like memories. someone can 'live' in the form of their memories - indeed, depending on how you describe it, many people say even being remembered by someone can be considered as 'living' in a way.
As it is, when someone dies, then in just about every circumstance, they are not connected directly, so there is nowhere for any activity to be directly transferred. Grace's death was probably unique there.
"I can barely remember my old life. I don't know who I am any more."

HNM, not 'Human' :)

Na'vi tattoo:
1 | 2 (finished) | 3
ToS: Human No More
dA
Personal site coming soon(ish

"God was invented to explain mystery. God is always invented to explain those things that you do not understand."
- Richard P. Feynman

Kamean

It's very interesting question, what means: Live within Eywa.
Tse'a ngal ke'ut a krr fra'uti kame.


Neyn'ite Te Tsahìk Txeptsyìp'ite

Quote from: Human No More on June 12, 2011, 08:00:04 AM
Quote from: Lolet te Maticay on June 08, 2011, 06:02:24 PM
Quote from: Neyn'ite Te Tsahìk Txeptsyìp'ite on June 07, 2011, 08:39:33 PM
ma Human, it could very well be an afterlife, and each Na'vi bond through to the links that Eywa provides for the living Na'vi.

Neytiri did say that "they live".
That doesn't mean they are thinking, or holding a conversation. When you listen, it's a lot of different people speaking, which seems like memories. someone can 'live' in the form of their memories - indeed, depending on how you describe it, many people say even being remembered by someone can be considered as 'living' in a way.
As it is, when someone dies, then in just about every circumstance, they are not connected directly, so there is nowhere for any activity to be directly transferred. Grace's death was probably unique there.

that, there, kind of confused me; that he couldn't hear Grace. or... well, perhaps he could, but we didn't 'hear' any ancestors anyway, because maybe Eywa knew he was the one who needed to speak, and not listen to the ancestors.

I say, he should have listened to the past six Toruk Maktos; maybe could have saved himself and a lot of the Na'vi some trouble ;D
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oel ayngati kameie, ma aysmukan sì aysmuke, Eywa ayngahu.
oeyä tsmukan, ma Nick, oeru ngaytxoa livu. nìmwey tsurokx. nga yawne lu oer.

ZenMondo

Again, Necroposting (kaltxì, oe zìma'uyu hi I'm new). There is a deleted scene on the collector's edition dvd that shows what Grace is seeing when she says "I'm with her". The image used is an eye, radiating light, which recalls Moat's line that she must pass through the eye of Eywa.

I am not sure this is the true and only personification of Eywa, but probably one of many "aspects" that she allows herself to be known by.

Eywa is not just the neural network composed of the roots of the trees, that's just the medium in which she resides. She is in fact the personification of ALL living things. Truly she has no form, for what can we say is the shape of OUR minds? Certainly we have a self image that is represented by our bodies, but Eywa is present throughout all of Pandora. So to me the more interesting question is not how the Na'vi view Eywa but how she views herself...

Kamean

Interesting question, I never thought about it. But I think the answer to this question, we can not find. It's the same thing that the search for the answer to the question: How God sees himself.
Tse'a ngal ke'ut a krr fra'uti kame.


Seze Mune

Quote from: zineketaye on May 31, 2011, 03:06:17 AM
Quote from: Kamean on May 30, 2011, 04:20:59 PM
Grace: I see her. She's real.©

This proves that Eywа can see.
That statement has two lines. Each of them a surprising puzzle for me  :o .

First: Grace does not state to see Eywa in this or the other way. The line is "Jake?! I'm with her, Jake. She is real!"
"I'm with her" is - maybe just for me - far more than to "see" or even "kame", but it has a scent of Grace already beeing a part of Eywa (and her mind assigned the duty to transport this message to Jake)

Second: It would be very surprising to me if it would turn out that Eywa can not see, in some sort of a physical sense. In my attempts to study "Eywa" I put out the question, where we can see an acting (and reacting) Eywa. And it seems quite obvious, that she can gather information about the physical world and react to them ...

BTT and the "sceptical" Jake - that is not contradictory. Jake has learnt to "see" (in the sense of kame), and maybe he is facing the same question as you with this thread: That tree is not Eywa herself, nor her representation. It is - as every living thing on Eywa'eveng - somehow connected to her, but would this connection be bi-directional? As far as Jake has learned, there are no direct answers from Eywa, so he is unable to tell, if his message may be heard, or he is just talking to a (special) tree.

I think of Eywa as the Living Matrix of all life on Eywa'eveng. There is instantaneous communication between all its parts, but the communication remains subconscious, for the most part, except for tsahìks who can access some of the Matrix at certain levels.  From the tsahìk's abilities came the general recognition of the intuitive "kame" which probably came into general use as part of the tsahìk's spiritual teachings.

All living things are a part of Eywa, but they are not Eywa - in the same sense that a drop of ocean water isn't the ocean.  I see Eywa as a synergy which has an existence as a living Beingness apart from the existence of the individual... sort of like the cells of your body have their own lives and functions which they fulfill without any real comprehension that they are part of you as a physical entity, so life on Eywa'eveng gives rise and embodiment to a Great Being without truly comprehending the entirety of that Being.

Or at least that's my intuition.  :D

Tsuksìm atsawl (KaPTan)

I think that she wouldn't have a form so much as a presence, if that makes any sense.  So, people can see her how they image, but i don't think she has one set form.  A presence tat one can figure out with their own senses.
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ZenMondo

Something else occurs to me. Do you think Eywa is aware of all Life on Pandora even when it is not directly linked to her such as at a site of the Tree of Voices?  I think for a fully aware and conscious being, which is what Eywa seems to be she must have some sensory apparatus apart from just momentary links with something brushing a neural queue on something compatible. How does Eywa sense what is going on on Pandora's surface (and perhaps elsewhere?) and how does she direct her will?

I think that Eywa must be telepathic somewhat. Such things are possible within the fictional world of Avatar as its technologically reproduced with a Driver moving and inhabiting their Avatar. This would explain how she was able to mobilize  the fauna in her defense against the RDA. 

Human No More

They weren't 'remote controlled' or anything - they just came to understand the danger and what they had to do.

Sense though might seem reasonable - the prevalence of bioluminescence within plants means that photosensitivity wouldn't be completely out, while the background details plants that seem to 'hear' in a vague way, as well as other plants that have rudimentary senses of sorts.

Of course, these would still only give a vague picture in themselves, which would perhaps tie in with her taking a 'longer' view of time, while greater clarity comes from shared memory.
"I can barely remember my old life. I don't know who I am any more."

HNM, not 'Human' :)

Na'vi tattoo:
1 | 2 (finished) | 3
ToS: Human No More
dA
Personal site coming soon(ish

"God was invented to explain mystery. God is always invented to explain those things that you do not understand."
- Richard P. Feynman

ZenMondo

It occurs to me that Eywa would be able to use animal and Na'vi senses from time to time as part of her sensory apparatus.  Surely there is some life form linking somewhere on Pandora at any given time.  There are direct links like when the Na'vi use their tswin at a place like the Utral Aymokriyä, but I think Eywa can sense the life upon Pandora.  When Grace was placed at the foot of the Tree of Souls it was aware of both her and her Avatar body and put all those little tendrils in her body connecting to her. So there are connections other than through the Queue.

According to Norm, Eywa is the embodiment of all living things, not just the plants.

Human No More

Yes, I did point that out :)

Quote from: Human No More on October 29, 2011, 07:39:23 PM...
Of course, these would still only give a vague picture in themselves, which would perhaps tie in with her taking a 'longer' view of time, while greater clarity comes from shared memory.
"I can barely remember my old life. I don't know who I am any more."

HNM, not 'Human' :)

Na'vi tattoo:
1 | 2 (finished) | 3
ToS: Human No More
dA
Personal site coming soon(ish

"God was invented to explain mystery. God is always invented to explain those things that you do not understand."
- Richard P. Feynman