Na'vi warfare

[Tìng Eywatikìte'e]

Oh no, not war starting. Just perhaps enough for them to carry out the punishment of cutting of the bond.

Though once again, wars can be started by little things. Perhaps if they did this to a beloved member of another clan it could start one. It is a possibility as they consider it worst than death.

[Hawnuyu atìtse'a]

Na'vi 1: "Um, you seem to have taken my spot by the fire."
Na'vi 2: "What are you gonna do? Go to war about it?"

Yeah, I can see how small things might cause wars

[Tìng Eywatikìte'e]

Well it's really a snowball effect. One person insults the wrong guy and he brings his friends over to start a fight and it goes up from there.

[Hawnuyu atìtse'a]

Hm. I said something about this earlier, but yeah. Now that the small scale causes have been thoroughly discussed, I say we switch to big picture sources (and get back to topic). Any ideas?

[Txur’Itan]

Na'vi have been known to sever the interface of criminals or enemies, thus forever severing their connection to Eywa and drastically reducing their effectiveness in hunting and combat, as the victim can no longer partner with a direhorse or banshee. This punishment is reserved only for very serious crimes, as it is seen by many to be worse than simply killing the victim.

While probably accurate, the pandorpedia is making speculation just as we are.  I think everything on the site is up for debate, not that I want to spend that much time on it.

I noticed this when watching the movie again tonight. When Jake first comes to Hometree as a captive they hold onto his neural link and held a blade to it.

Yeah I noticed that as well, it could cause a serious problem if someone cut it off.  Without it, a Na'vi may as well be a human... ish...

Na'vi 1: "Um, you seem to have taken my spot by the fire."
Na'vi 2: "What are you gonna do? Go to war about it?"

Yeah, I can see how small things might cause wars

Although it makes for a good speculative analogy, I can only see this happening to the more evolutionarily primitive ancestors of the Na'vi, or between fairly young children. I do not see this happening between the clans at the level of sophistication depicted in the film.

Well it's really a snowball effect. One person insults the wrong guy and he brings his friends over to start a fight and it goes up from there.

Agreed...

Hm. I said something about this earlier, but yeah. Now that the small scale causes have been thoroughly discussed, I say we switch to big picture sources (and get back to topic). Any ideas?

The earlier discussions wandered back towards the idea of significant conflict, and a time of sorrow, it is a complete mystery other than speculation and something to do with Toruk Makto.

The possibility of war escalates when you leave your continent to go to another, or your planet to go to another in the AVATAR universe.  This is a reflection on early colonialism here on Earth.  There was technically a war between the immigrants of the 1400's through the 1800's and the natives of the North and South American continents, but in reality it was genocide, a holocaust.

On Pandora, that could have happened once before.  A holocaust of mega proportions, Pandora was potentially a manufactured existence meant to save the Na'vi from them selves.

[Eyamsiyu]

Well it's really a snowball effect. One person insults the wrong guy and he brings his friends over to start a fight and it goes up from there.

To me, that wouldn't be typical of Na'vi activity, because that kind of activity is what is typical of gangs.  If this "one person" insults the wrong guy, I would expect that the insulted would take on the person making the insult himself, as a way to gain back his own pride.

[Roiki]

To me, that wouldn't be typical of Na'vi activity, because that kind of activity is what is typical of gangs.  If this "one person" insults the wrong guy, I would expect that the insulted would take on the person making the insult himself, as a way to gain back his own pride.

And that's what they essentially are, tribes are quite similiar to gangs(single leader, different castes), even their formation has few same features(safety, efficiency etc). When it becomes apparent Jake mated with Neytiri his first reaction was to attack him, so if that would've been another na'vi from a different tribe it could've led to at least some for of conflict. Someone mates with someone they shouldn't, they get killed because pride has been hurt, the clan of the murdered demands justice, the clan of the murderer doesn't comply since they feel that the killing was justified, they don't see eye-to-eye so unless there's a large gap in power, war might ensue.

[Hawnuyu atìtse'a]

But na'vi warfare would not be the same as gang warfare as far as style and method. The na'vi clans act like, well, clans. They are large groups of families dependent on one another for support and defense.

[Roiki]

But na'vi warfare would not be the same as gang warfare as far as style and method. The na'vi clans act like, well, clans.

Since we don't know how often or what type of warfare they practise, it's impossible to say. However in the movie we see them rallying and just deciding to attack in a frenzy without any apparent planning. Obviously you can't directly compare them since they are completely different, but the basic ideology and principles are the same, if a gang member is shot or hurt or the gang is offended, they gather people and go take a revenge without much of a plan, only goal being the revenge itself.

They are large groups of families dependent on one another for support and defense.

And that's what gangs are mostly as well, they encompass the members families and form an integrated "family", that is their appeal. If you don't have a good family or family at all, gangs are an easy way to find brotherhood and family, they take care of their own and defend their own. Albeit with questionable methods.
That's how tribes and later small nations formed in the past, humans grouping together to provide support and defence to eachother in times of need.

[Hawnuyu atìtse'a]

Point taken. Assuming that Navi had warfare prior to the arrival of humans, then a comparison of the clans to miniature nations would be better. If an alien species landed on earth with malicious intentions, I would (hope) think that the nations would abandon current wars and join to repel the invaders, being a common enemy. Same as in the movie. Any past conflicts between the clans were out aside for a moment to focus on the overarching threat of the humans. Whether the clans resume conflict is anybodys guess.

[Tìng Eywatikìte'e]

Well I think it's obvious enough that they carried out war before the humans arrived, if they didn't then they would have a word for war or warrior.

Also, considering the distance between them, I doubt they are very dependent on each other. They seen their own clan as family and probably only interact with other clans occasionally. I will always consider the fact that it takes Toruk Makto, the mightiest of their warriors, to unite them shows that they are not on that fantastic of terms.

I think when it comes to war with the Na'vi is we must always remember that they are by no means perfect. They are quick to anger and their pride is easily bruised. Those are qualities that can lead to conflict quite easily.

[Hawnuyu atìtse'a]

Add any flaws from the "Navi-the flawless people?" thread to the list of possible catalysts.

[Nìwotxkrr Tìyawn]

You should always keep in mind that there may be other races of Na'vi and not all of them may think that they should be superior to others. Think of it as a 10ft. tall, blue Hitler. In other words...MEGA HITLER.

Kìyevame, Eywa ngahu.

[Hawnuyu atìtse'a]

Easy now, let's not get into stuff like that. No need risking the banhammer.

[Tìng Eywatikìte'e]

Well, it is a possibility. We know that Pandora is similarly sized to Earth, there are probably Na'vi of a completely different culture on the other side of the moon. Who knows how they react to each other? Whenever you have a large population there are bound to be those who think they are superior to the others.

[Hawnuyu atìtse'a]

I'm not arguing that, I'm saying easy on the references to a certain 1940s German leader.

[Tìng Eywatikìte'e]

Well it makes for easy reference. It's a lot quicker to write Na'vi Hitler rather than "Na'vi who doesn't like other Na'vi for arbitrary reasons and uses superior skills in rhetoric to manipulate an unhappy people who got the short end of the stick from the last war to place all their blame on said arbitrary Na'vi tribe and start sending them away to "camp" where you can get rid of them for years before other people start taking note."

[Nìwotxkrr Tìyawn]

Well it makes for easy reference. It's a lot quicker to write Na'vi Hitler rather than "Na'vi who doesn't like other Na'vi for arbitrary reasons and uses superior skills in rhetoric to manipulate an unhappy people who got the short end of the stick from the last war to place all their blame on said arbitrary Na'vi tribe and start sending them away to "camp" where you can get rid of them for years before other people start taking note."

It's longer but it would make me look a lot smarter. XD

Kìyevame, Eywa ngahu.

[Txepa-utral Atxkxe]

Well I think it's obvious enough that they carried out war before the humans arrived, if they didn't then they would have a word for war or warrior.

Also, considering the distance between them, I doubt they are very dependent on each other. They seen their own clan as family and probably only interact with other clans occasionally. I will always consider the fact that it takes Toruk Makto, the mightiest of their warriors, to unite them shows that they are not on that fantastic of terms.

I think when it comes to war with the Na'vi is we must always remember that they are by no means perfect. They are quick to anger and their pride is easily bruised. Those are qualities that can lead to conflict quite easily.

You are right...it is stated in the guide that they did indeed carry out warfare before the humans arrived.

But really, one needs to consider the actual differences between Na'vi and human attitudes concerning war. So far, the only real difference between a human and Na'vi way of considering life as a whole is the fact that they are spiritually/PHYSICALLY connected to their environment. Naturally, that has a huge impact on the way they think when that environment is threatened. But otherwise, they seem to react in quite human ways--again, to reference Tsu'Tey's attack on Jake, and their apparent readiness to wage war in general...Are they really that different from humans, then?

[Hawnuyu atìtse'a]

They were conceived in the mind of a human, so there are going to be subconscious similarities. I would go into detail, but it was already discussed on the "navi are flawless?" thread.