Author Topic: Na'vi warfare  (Read 5961 times)

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Offline Txepa-utral Atxkxe

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Na'vi warfare
« on: January 06, 2010, 01:10:45 am »
I figured this was the best place to put this topic, seeing as it didn't really seem to fit elsewhere.

Okay, so in the guide, it is stated that the Na'vi have been known to war. They also have war drums, and are clearly a warrior society anyway. But what I can't really get is what Na'vi tribes would go to war over, especially since it has been stated several times that on Pandora resource distribution, overpopulation, homelessness, etc. are pretty much unheard of. So, why would Na'vi go to war? Any thoughts?
In all matters of opinion, our adversaries are insane.--Oscar Wilde

Offline Hawnuyu atìtse'a

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Re: Na'vi warfare
« Reply #1 on: January 06, 2010, 02:05:45 am »
Love. Tsu'tey tries to beat the crap out of jake for mating with neytiri.
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Offline Txepa-utral Atxkxe

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Re: Na'vi warfare
« Reply #2 on: January 06, 2010, 02:12:50 am »
Full-on war is what I mean. Makes me wonder what the Time of Great Sorrow was and why a "mighty" Toruk Makto would be needed. But again, unless you get a Romeo and Juliet thing going on, would Na'vi really shed loads of blood over it?
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Offline Hawnuyu atìtse'a

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Re: Na'vi warfare
« Reply #3 on: January 06, 2010, 02:16:16 am »
I mean like someone from one clan mated with someone from another and it turned into war somehow. This is why a prequel is needed (but shouldn't be made).
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Offline Sngä'i Tìrey-yä

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Re: Na'vi warfare
« Reply #4 on: January 06, 2010, 08:55:50 pm »
I would say its more likely over religion. The Omaticaya lives so closely to the Tree of Spirits I'm sure other tribes may have been unhappy with their close relationship to the holy areas.

Holy lands have sparked wars before...
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Offline Txur’Itan

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Re: Na'vi warfare
« Reply #5 on: January 06, 2010, 09:15:58 pm »
Love. Tsu'tey tries to beat the crap out of jake for mating with neytiri.
This sort of "mate stealing" could cause a couple of tribes to scirmish, but multiple clans needing to unite.  That almost sounds like repelling an invasion.

I would say its more likely over religion. The Omaticaya lives so closely to the Tree of Spirits I'm sure other tribes may have been unhappy with their close relationship to the holy areas.

Holy lands have sparked wars before...

That makes perfect sense.  All of the tribes may have fought over access to Eywa.

I wondering about why the Omatikaya would be the only ones with "Tee Of voices", especially when there were other regions of the moon where there was no jungle.  The Pa'li riders of the Plains where practically in the middle of nowhere, it has to be a pain to get back to have prayer sessions, they may even be less connected to Eywa because of it.

-------

There are other moons, but life may not exists on them.

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The Na'vi species could have evolved away from technology, and the last time of great sorrow was prior to that, like an end of the world type of thing, where uniting the tribes in the name of Eywa seemed the only viable solution.   That last war prior to that event could have been between major factions of Na'vi pre Eywa...

Eywa seems like it might be the result of a technological singularity in artificial intelligence.  The Anti-sky-net if you will...

-------

There are other continents, I am curious if the other land masses have a different connection to Eywa, the Na'vi, or the life on Pandora.  Dr Augustine said that Eywa was like a global network, which would suggest that there are physical biological links which cross the Pandora seas.  But how could she make that claim unless she was generalising, she may not have had the chance to go elsewhere on Pandora to thoroughly investigate.
« Last Edit: January 06, 2010, 09:19:28 pm by Txur’Itan »
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Offline Swok Txon

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Re: Na'vi warfare
« Reply #6 on: January 06, 2010, 11:52:40 pm »
I guess the love thing is valid considering the battle of Troy and many others were fought over love...

and yes the battle of Troy is no longer considered and myth/legend as they have found evidence to prove it happened

Offline Txepa-utral Atxkxe

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Re: Na'vi warfare
« Reply #7 on: January 07, 2010, 12:28:49 am »
Yeah, but there's no archaeological evidence that it was fought over a woman. Txur’Itan makes a lot of sense, though.
In all matters of opinion, our adversaries are insane.--Oscar Wilde

Offline Tìng Eywatikìte'e

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Re: Na'vi warfare
« Reply #8 on: January 07, 2010, 12:51:11 am »
One only needs to look back at Earth to think of reasons why they would go to war. Remember, we have plenty of cultures that live lives very similar to the Na'vi, in the woods as hunters and gatherers. They go to war for a number of reasons. Competing for the best territory is a big one. They do arranged marriages to an extent at least, so one person going off and mating with someone already betrothed could start a battle which could escalate to war.

I think battling to be closer to Eywa is a very likely reason. Also, even if they all believe in Eywa there could be different ideas on how to worship her. Just look at Christians and Muslims, same god+different ideas of worship=war that won't go away.

I think the fact that it took a guy riding in on the fiercest beast out there to unit them during a crisis shows that the relationships between tribes may not be on the best of terms. If they were they could have asked for help a lot earlier.
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Offline Txepa-utral Atxkxe

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Re: Na'vi warfare
« Reply #9 on: January 07, 2010, 12:59:04 am »
One only needs to look back at Earth to think of reasons why they would go to war. Remember, we have plenty of cultures that live lives very similar to the Na'vi, in the woods as hunters and gatherers. They go to war for a number of reasons. Competing for the best territory is a big one. They do arranged marriages to an extent at least, so one person going off and mating with someone already betrothed could start a battle which could escalate to war.

I think battling to be closer to Eywa is a very likely reason. Also, even if they all believe in Eywa there could be different ideas on how to worship her. Just look at Christians and Muslims, same god+different ideas of worship=war that won't go away.

I think the fact that it took a guy riding in on the fiercest beast out there to unit them during a crisis shows that the relationships between tribes may not be on the best of terms. If they were they could have asked for help a lot earlier.

Do a little research. Christian and Muslim god are not the same. But that's beside the point--those are some really, really good points. I hadn't considered that the Na'vi people (considering how Pandora is presented) may not always be on good terms with one another as tribes.
In all matters of opinion, our adversaries are insane.--Oscar Wilde

Offline Tìng Eywatikìte'e

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Re: Na'vi warfare
« Reply #10 on: January 07, 2010, 01:21:49 am »
Well, not to go off topic, but they are in fact the same god-ask any priest. Jews, Christians, and Muslims are all "sons of Abraham" and follow the old testament, they have just continued to branch off into different sects. Believe me I've done the research , I just finished a class (with a nice shiney A) that followed the history of it.



But back on topic. Yeah I can see the Na'vi getting in fights over plenty of things. They are not perfect, put sentient species in an area and eventually they'll find a reason to fight.
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Offline Txepa-utral Atxkxe

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Re: Na'vi warfare
« Reply #11 on: January 07, 2010, 01:26:09 am »
Well, not to go off topic, but they are in fact the same god-ask any priest. Jews, Christians, and Muslims are all "sons of Abraham" and follow the old testament, they have just continued to branch off into different sects. Believe me I've done the research , I just finished a class (with a nice shiney A) that followed the history of it.



But back on topic. Yeah I can see the Na'vi getting in fights over plenty of things. They are not perfect, put sentient species in an area and eventually they'll find a reason to fight.

Very well. I suppose that whole deal could be debated, but not here.

Well, if the Na'vi are anything at all like humans...which they have proven to be...you would be right. Humans find all sorts of dumb things to fight about, so I guess the question would the Na'vi be the same as humans in that particular respect? They don't have technology because they simply don't need it, but in terms of mindset...
In all matters of opinion, our adversaries are insane.--Oscar Wilde

Offline Tìng Eywatikìte'e

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Re: Na'vi warfare
« Reply #12 on: January 07, 2010, 01:38:43 am »
Well once again, there are plenty of human cultures that have not developed that advanced of technology. (Note that the Na'vi do, in fact, have technology. In anthropological terms technology is really any man made tool, so bows and arrows count, but I know what you're saying)

Technology doesn't equal war. I think the Na'vi have shown themselves to be warriors and there have been plenty of hints that they could have such a mindset. They are a proud people, and pride often times leads to conflict.

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Offline Hawnuyu atìtse'a

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Re: Na'vi warfare
« Reply #13 on: January 07, 2010, 01:42:59 am »
This discussion is actually a perfect analogy. The conflict would start as something small, say questioning authority. The argument would get input from many different factions, and then when no solution could be reached a war broke out. I'm not saying that's what this thread will become, but war could originate from such an event.
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Offline Txepa-utral Atxkxe

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Re: Na'vi warfare
« Reply #14 on: January 07, 2010, 01:49:41 am »
This discussion is actually a perfect analogy. The conflict would start as something small, say questioning authority. The argument would get input from many different factions, and then when no solution could be reached a war broke out. I'm not saying that's what this thread will become, but war could originate from such an event.

Let's hope this thread doesn't break out into war! XD

And yes, I understand that technology includes bows and arrows and looms and such. However, Na'vi society is implied to be quite old, and in the guidebooks it says that they've not changed for a long time. So it might be logical to assume their technology hasn't either, simply because they don't require it. They don't need to invent planes because they can already fly, for example.
In all matters of opinion, our adversaries are insane.--Oscar Wilde

Offline Txur’Itan

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Re: Na'vi warfare
« Reply #15 on: January 07, 2010, 01:54:02 am »
This discussion is actually a perfect analogy. The conflict would start as something small, say questioning authority. The argument would get input from many different factions, and then when no solution could be reached a war broke out. I'm not saying that's what this thread will become, but war could originate from such an event.

Let's hope this thread doesn't break out into war! XD

And yes, I understand that technology includes bows and arrows and looms and such. However, Na'vi society is implied to be quite old, and in the guidebooks it says that they've not changed for a long time. So it might be logical to assume their technology hasn't either, simply because they don't require it. They don't need to invent planes because they can already fly, for example.


They could also be suffering from a forced culling, Neytiri Quote:("Eywa does not choose sides, she only protects the balance of life.")  Maybe Eywa triggers conflict to even things out, and the Na'vi are only aware of it in a superficial manner.
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Offline Hawnuyu atìtse'a

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Re: Na'vi warfare
« Reply #16 on: January 07, 2010, 01:56:13 am »
*facepalm* see, this is why you're a mod. Higher brain function.
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Offline Txepa-utral Atxkxe

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Re: Na'vi warfare
« Reply #17 on: January 07, 2010, 01:57:09 am »
Oooh, that's interesting! Also, they point out that overpopulation isn't an issue on Pandora...maybe it's dealt with in the manner you suggested.

Superficial understanding meaning, "Hey, I think it's a great time for us to fight with that other clan for X reason," and not, "Hey, time for the balancing-war!", correct?

*facepalm* see, this is why you're a mod. Higher brain function.

I agree. Hail the mods!
In all matters of opinion, our adversaries are insane.--Oscar Wilde

Offline Tìng Eywatikìte'e

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Re: Na'vi warfare
« Reply #18 on: January 07, 2010, 11:50:05 am »
That's a very interesting idea. So yeah, there are plenty of reasons for them to go to war with each other.

They also seem fond of the death penalty, as we see when they want to execute Jake after his betrayal. Mayhaps a war could break out if they believe a member of another tribe betrayed them and they execute them. That would piss people royally off.
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Re: Na'vi warfare
« Reply #19 on: January 07, 2010, 12:32:47 pm »
This discussion is actually a perfect analogy. The conflict would start as something small, say questioning authority. The argument would get input from many different factions, and then when no solution could be reached a war broke out. I'm not saying that's what this thread will become, but war could originate from such an event.

Let's hope this thread doesn't break out into war! XD

And yes, I understand that technology includes bows and arrows and looms and such. However, Na'vi society is implied to be quite old, and in the guidebooks it says that they've not changed for a long time. So it might be logical to assume their technology hasn't either, simply because they don't require it. They don't need to invent planes because they can already fly, for example.


They could also be suffering from a forced culling, Neytiri Quote:("Eywa does not choose sides, she only protects the balance of life.")  Maybe Eywa triggers conflict to even things out, and the Na'vi are only aware of it in a superficial manner.

See I'll bet that when Jake took his "prayers" to Eywa, and Neytiri said that, etc... Eywa realized how the humans would eventually unbalance life on Pandora, thus taking action against the humans.

However, and it has been discussed in other forums, there may have been a little bit of technological advancement within the movie itself: during the burning of Home Tree, the arrows would not penetrate the glass.  In the final war scene, however, the arrows would.  Yes angles were different, and would cause a difference in the arrows ballistics properties.  However, I would bet that if the arrows were of the same make, I don't think any angle would have penetrated the glass to the degree that it did in the final battle.  So my hypothesis is that they make stronger arrows.  


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