Na'Vi hunting

Started by Tonbogiri, March 19, 2010, 05:31:57 PM

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Tonbogiri

Could the na'vi culture specialists answer this one for me.

In order to become an initiated hunter, a Na'Vi must tame an ikran. They then use this ikran to hunt ("stone cold aerial hunter - death from above").
However, projectile hunting (arrows) from the back of a flying creature seems impractical in that environment. In an area of fairly dense rainforest, there is often a forest canopy that covers a good 50 metres from the ground. On Pandora, this may be taller. Surely the practical way of hunting is more like the track, stalk, shoot variety?
Is an ikran therefore more of a transport or enjoyment activity or a war machine?
Hunting with an ikran simply seems to make a difficult job much harder.

PS. "All I want for christmas is an ikran..."


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tìngay mungeyu

I'm also interested in this and especially the ikran part of it. ;)

Neytiri says that to become taronyu you must choose your own ikran and he most choose you. But what if I don't want to be a hunter (because I'm a girl so would rather deel with bringing up children etc.)? In this case I will never have my own ikran?

Maybe JC will answer it somehow but what do you think? :)

Nìwotxkrr Tìyawn

IMO the Na'vi would use ikrans for hunting most definitely, they don't exactly have to travel often seeing as how they have most things around where they live. I'd also imagine that ikrans are necessary for hunting larger game, being that large animals on Pandora tend to have extremely thick armor they would probably use the same tactic they used on the gunships, diving at a steep angle and flying extremely fast. Sure hunting from the air would be a lot harder but the reward would be much greater than traditional stalking and shooting. For all we know, Eywa might give directions to a good place for hunting.
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delen66

i have read that in full version JC produced a scene where Jake hunted from the sky and the tribe selebrated then his successful hunting - even Tsutey appraised him..

Mithcoriel

I'm guessing that, since the trees are much larger on pandora, making human- or Navi-sized creatures look almost like ants, there's plenty of height to work with, to hunt from above.

Quote from: tìngay mungeyu on March 19, 2010, 06:38:28 PMNeytiri says that to become taronyu you must choose your own ikran and he most choose you. But what if I don't want to be a hunter (because I'm a girl so would rather deel with bringing up children etc.)? In this case I will never have my own ikran?

I don't think that's an option in the Na'vi world. If I understood the ASG correctly, everyone becomes a hunter.
Ayoe lu aysamsiyu a plltxe "Ni" !
Aytìhawnu ayli'uyä aswok: "Ni", "Peng", si "Niiiew-wom" !

tìngay mungeyu

Quote from: tìngay mungeyu on March 19, 2010, 06:38:28 PMNeytiri says that to become taronyu you must choose your own ikran and he most choose you. But what if I don't want to be a hunter (because I'm a girl so would rather deel with bringing up children etc.)? In this case I will never have my own ikran?

I don't think that's an option in the Na'vi world. If I understood the ASG correctly, everyone becomes a hunter.
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In that case, it's okay. :D If everyone becomes a hunter, I don't want to lag behind either. ;)

Nifty

Have you guys considered animals that may also fly??? Like the little ìkrans flying by the scientist transport on Jakes first time on Pandora. Sure they might have trouble hunting the animals living in the forest but what about those little fellows?
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ShadowedSin

Quote from: Tonbogiri on March 19, 2010, 05:31:57 PM
Could the na'vi culture specialists answer this one for me.

In order to become an initiated hunter, a Na'Vi must tame an ikran. They then use this ikran to hunt ("stone cold aerial hunter - death from above").
However, projectile hunting (arrows) from the back of a flying creature seems impractical in that environment. In an area of fairly dense rainforest, there is often a forest canopy that covers a good 50 metres from the ground. On Pandora, this may be taller. Surely the practical way of hunting is more like the track, stalk, shoot variety?
Is an ikran therefore more of a transport or enjoyment activity or a war machine?
Hunting with an ikran simply seems to make a difficult job much harder.

PS. "All I want for christmas is an ikran..."

To become a hunter you must complete the "Clean Kill" ceremony.

Iknimaya is to become a warrior.

Uniltaron is to become a recognized adult.

All three are separate of each other.
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Mithcoriel

Quote from: ShadowedSin on March 22, 2010, 03:21:51 AM
Quote from: Tonbogiri on March 19, 2010, 05:31:57 PM
Could the na'vi culture specialists answer this one for me.

In order to become an initiated hunter, a Na'Vi must tame an ikran. They then use this ikran to hunt ("stone cold aerial hunter - death from above").
However, projectile hunting (arrows) from the back of a flying creature seems impractical in that environment. In an area of fairly dense rainforest, there is often a forest canopy that covers a good 50 metres from the ground. On Pandora, this may be taller. Surely the practical way of hunting is more like the track, stalk, shoot variety?
Is an ikran therefore more of a transport or enjoyment activity or a war machine?
Hunting with an ikran simply seems to make a difficult job much harder.

PS. "All I want for christmas is an ikran..."

To become a hunter you must complete the "Clean Kill" ceremony.

Iknimaya is to become a warrior.

Uniltaron is to become a recognized adult.

All three are separate of each other.

Are you sure about that? I seem to remember that, when Neytiri showed off her Ikran, she said something like: "To become taronyu, hunter, you must choose your ikran and he must choose you."
Ayoe lu aysamsiyu a plltxe "Ni" !
Aytìhawnu ayli'uyä aswok: "Ni", "Peng", si "Niiiew-wom" !

Tìng Eywatikìte'e

This is where the ASG and the Movie seem to contradict each other. For now the movie is above the ASG in canon, but this aspect is still unclear.

I don't believe every Na'vi becomes a hunter, and certainly not everyone becomes a warrior, so naturally not every Na'vi has an Ikran.
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ShadowedSin

#10
Exactly no.

However, I had a massive discussion on the board when earlier and the current theory is that Uniltaron as described in the ASG is a ceremony dealing with Coming of Age. Where as Iknimaya is separate and can be done after or before Uniltaron.

Clean Kill is what everyone is calling where a Hunter aka Jake kills his first anima aka the Yerik. Because of how the Movie and the 07 script present it. There is not direct sequence of rites that leads to a particular status. All of them are done separately and independently of each other.
\Shadow's Sin
A Blog discussion Amazon and notes for the Arrow Child Novella!

Arrow Child
An Online Serial Novel and the first story in the Amazon Diaspora Saga.

Mithcoriel

Quote from: Tìng Eywatikìte'e on March 22, 2010, 12:57:49 PMI don't believe every Na'vi becomes a hunter, and certainly not everyone becomes a warrior, so naturally not every Na'vi has an Ikran.

Not sure about that. ASG P.65 says: "Every Na'vi has a toy banshee. [...] The toy serves as a daily reminder that the child will one day bond with a living banshee."

Anyway, why are people constantly refering to the "Clean kill" as if that were some kind of official name? I always understood Neytiri's comment "A clean kill. You are ready." to simply mean: "Smoothly done. You've shown you've gathered enough hunting experience. Time for Iknimaya."
Ayoe lu aysamsiyu a plltxe "Ni" !
Aytìhawnu ayli'uyä aswok: "Ni", "Peng", si "Niiiew-wom" !

Neykun

Yes it's true to say that ikrans probably aren't the best for hunting in the forest, even though their agility was demonstrated when Jake and Neytiri were fleeing Toruk.  Maybe the ikran is used for hunting "higher quality" game that only lives in specific regions of Pandora that are impossible or impractical to get to, like whatever Jake was after right before Toruk swooped in.  Not to mention flying game, as Nìftxavangutan said.  Just an idea ::)
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Tsuksìm atsawl (KaPTan)

um, remember please, that there is a varied landscape of pandora, its not just rainforest.  there are also plains with which hunting on an Ikran would be very very easy, since everything would be flat.
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ShadowedSin

Quote from: Kawnga Palulukana Tutan (KPT) on April 04, 2010, 01:49:06 AM
um, remember please, that there is a varied landscape of pandora, its not just rainforest.  there are also plains with which hunting on an Ikran would be very very easy, since everything would be flat.

The Plains Clans favor the Pa'li, not Ikran.

Not every Na'vi tribe flies the Banshee. So it doesn't make sense if it is a widely cultural aspect to have an Ikran. From what the ASG points to, Iknimaya is how you earn the right to be considered a warrior.
\Shadow's Sin
A Blog discussion Amazon and notes for the Arrow Child Novella!

Arrow Child
An Online Serial Novel and the first story in the Amazon Diaspora Saga.

Tsuksìm atsawl (KaPTan)

yes, I know that the plains tribes favor Pa'li, but i'm just saying, not all of pandora is rainforest.
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Nifty

ACtually I thought the whole point of the Ikran was to be a man and one of the Omaticaya people. Therefore I believe that all the clans have a different set of rules or laws. So don't think that they are all the same.
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Mithcoriel

Quote from: ShadowedSin on April 04, 2010, 09:31:39 PMThe Plains Clans favor the Pa'li, not Ikran.

I'll wager a guess that the reason they do so is cause their plains are just too far away from Iknimaya or any other place they can find wild Ikran, so it's impractical to take the long journey.
Ayoe lu aysamsiyu a plltxe "Ni" !
Aytìhawnu ayli'uyä aswok: "Ni", "Peng", si "Niiiew-wom" !

ShadowedSin

Quote from: Mithcoriel on April 05, 2010, 05:01:30 AM
Quote from: ShadowedSin on April 04, 2010, 09:31:39 PMThe Plains Clans favor the Pa'li, not Ikran.

I'll wager a guess that the reason they do so is cause their plains are just too far away from Iknimaya or any other place they can find wild Ikran, so it's impractical to take the long journey.

I believe the ASG states that Ikran do not nest in the Plains. The reasons why the Omatikaya and the Sea Cliff Clan has access is because they are in or near a mountainous regions. The Mountain banshee being the one you can ride. Forest banshees are far too small.
\Shadow's Sin
A Blog discussion Amazon and notes for the Arrow Child Novella!

Arrow Child
An Online Serial Novel and the first story in the Amazon Diaspora Saga.

Tsuksìm atsawl (KaPTan)

Quote from: ShadowedSin on April 05, 2010, 01:52:32 PM
Quote from: Mithcoriel on April 05, 2010, 05:01:30 AM
Quote from: ShadowedSin on April 04, 2010, 09:31:39 PMThe Plains Clans favor the Pa'li, not Ikran.

I'll wager a guess that the reason they do so is cause their plains are just too far away from Iknimaya or any other place they can find wild Ikran, so it's impractical to take the long journey.

I believe the ASG states that Ikran do not nest in the Plains. The reasons why the Omatikaya and the Sea Cliff Clan has access is because they are in or near a mountainous regions. The Mountain banshee being the one you can ride. Forest banshees are far too small.


Forest banshees? WTF do you find that?(obviously in the forest, I mean where did you get the term?)
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