Author Topic: Na'vi Proverbs  (Read 55310 times)

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Offline Tanri

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Re: Na'vi Proverbs
« Reply #120 on: March 14, 2012, 02:57:18 pm »
IMHO also Fra'u a tswayon... is not fully correct - not things fly, but birds/animals/creatures
...ayyayo, ayioang, ayswirä... alu fo (tup sa’u) ;)

Ke lu toruk frapo a tswayon - "Not all what flies is a toruk"
This pair of sentences sounds to me the best, both Na’vi and English version. They express the same meaning, but because they come from completely different languages (and worlds ;)), they cannot be literally the same. Literal translation attempt like "kea fraioang" seems to me unnatural. In fact, "kea" is the opposite of "fra", thus they can't be applied together to the same noun.
I found two interesting things to notice:
- first one is the different approach in negation. English negates the subject, while Na’vi the verb.
- second, both sentences put emphasis on the same thing. In English it is the beginning of the main sentence (Not all what flies is a toruk), Na’vi prefers the end (Ke lu toruk frapo a tswayon).

*Throws flower at Blue Elf. *Wonders if that flower is considered to be flying. ;D
Tsa’ewll ke lolu fkxakewll, sìlpey oe ;D
Tìvawmìri txopu rä’ä si. Nrr!

Offline Puvomun

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Re: Na'vi Proverbs
« Reply #121 on: March 14, 2012, 03:02:42 pm »
*Throws flower at Blue Elf. *Wonders if that flower is considered to be flying. ;D
Tsa’ewll ke lolu fkxakewll, sìlpey oe ;D

HRH!!!
Krr a lì'fya lam sraw, may' frivìp utralit.

Ngopyu ayvurä.

Offline Seze Mune

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Re: Na'vi Proverbs
« Reply #122 on: March 14, 2012, 07:20:37 pm »
IMHO also Fra'u a tswayon... is not fully correct - not things fly, but birds/animals/creatures
...ayyayo, ayioang, ayswirä... alu fo (tup sa’u) ;)

Ke lu toruk frapo a tswayon - "Not all what flies is a toruk"
This pair of sentences sounds to me the best, both Na’vi and English version. They express the same meaning, but because they come from completely different languages (and worlds ;)), they cannot be literally the same. Literal translation attempt like "kea fraioang" seems to me unnatural. In fact, "kea" is the opposite of "fra", thus they can't be applied together to the same noun.
I found two interesting things to notice:
- first one is the different approach in negation. English negates the subject, while Na’vi the verb.
- second, both sentences put emphasis on the same thing. In English it is the beginning of the main sentence (Not all what flies is a toruk), Na’vi prefers the end (Ke lu toruk frapo a tswayon).

*Throws flower at Blue Elf. *Wonders if that flower is considered to be flying. ;D
Tsa’ewll ke lolu fkxakewll, sìlpey oe ;D

One doesn't use tsn'ì in this construction? ↑

Offline Seze Mune

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Re: Na'vi Proverbs
« Reply #123 on: March 14, 2012, 07:23:27 pm »
What about Toruk ke livu fra'u a tswayon?

I think it should be "Toruk ke lu fra'u a tswayon" then.

livu makes your sentence say "Toruk may not be everything that flies"

I guess that would be alright too.  I was using the <iv> because the saying is meant proverbially and not as an actual event, therefore there is a sense of indefiniteness to it as in a subjunctive.  But your point is taken!  ;)

Offline Seze Mune

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Re: Na'vi Proverbs
« Reply #124 on: March 14, 2012, 10:05:16 pm »
Sngä'i a täftxu ulte Eywal tìng ngaru kìngit.

Begin to weave and Eywa will give you the thread.

or

Sngä'i tìtusäftxu ulte Eywal tìng ngaru kìngit.

Offline Seze Mune

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Re: Na'vi Proverbs
« Reply #125 on: March 14, 2012, 10:18:22 pm »

Txopu tsawl sleyku palulukan pxeya tsawl to pum leru.

Fear makes (grows) the thanator bigger than he is.

Offline Seze Mune

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Re: Na'vi Proverbs
« Reply #126 on: March 14, 2012, 10:29:28 pm »
Keng palulukan zene zivong ayzize'wä.

or do I put the wä with the verb:  Keng palulukan zene zivongwä ayzize'.

Even the thanator must defend himself against Hellfire wasps.

Offline Alyara Arati

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Re: Na'vi Proverbs
« Reply #127 on: March 15, 2012, 01:57:18 am »
Sngä'i a täftxu ulte Eywal tìng ngaru kìngit.

Begin to weave and Eywa will give you the thread.

or

Sngä'i tìtusäftxu ulte Eywal tìng ngaru kìngit.
This is another personal favorite of mine. :D  Sngä'i is a modal verb, so the controlled verb after it needs an <iv>, but you can say, "begin to weave" as: Sngä'i tiväftxu (ulte Eywal tayìng ngaru kìngit.)


Txopu tsawl sleyku palulukan pxeya tsawl to pum leru.

Fear makes (grows) the thanator bigger than he is.
With <eyk> infix, tsawl slu becomes transitive and therefore subject and object need cases.  So:  Txopul tsawl sleyku palulukanit apxa (nì'ul) to tìngay.

Keng palulukan zene zivong ayzize'wä.

or do I put the wä with the verb:  Keng palulukan zene zivongwä ayzize'.

Even the thanator must defend himself against Hellfire wasps.

Ah, the rare <äp> infix... Keng palulukan zene zäpivong wä ayzize'  OR  Keng zene palulukan zäpivong ayzize'wä.
Learn how to see.  Realize that everything connects to everything else.
~ Leonardo da Vinci

Offline Puvomun

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Re: Na'vi Proverbs
« Reply #128 on: March 15, 2012, 02:18:49 am »
Tsa’ewll ke lolu fkxakewll, sìlpey oe ;D

One doesn't use tsn'ì in this construction? ↑

No, one does not. Tanri said:
that flower not was itchplant, I hope.

In English you would not say that flower not was itchplant, I hope that either.

tsnì is only used as "that" when you request/hope something (ätxäle / sìlpey)
Krr a lì'fya lam sraw, may' frivìp utralit.

Ngopyu ayvurä.

Offline Blue Elf

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Re: Na'vi Proverbs
« Reply #129 on: March 15, 2012, 02:35:46 am »
IMHO also Fra'u a tswayon... is not fully correct - not things fly, but birds/animals/creatures
...ayyayo, ayioang, ayswirä... alu fo (tup sa’u) ;)

Ke lu toruk frapo a tswayon - "Not all what flies is a toruk"
Ma oeyä tsultätu, ngaru irayo seiyi! The best solution!

Quote
Sngä'i a täftxu ulte Eywal tìng ngaru kìngit.
Sngä'i is intransitive, so some changes would be needed, but it is also modal, so simplest way is to say:
Sngä'i tiväftxu ulte Eywal tìng ngaru kìngit.
Very nice statement!

Quote
Keng palulukan zene zivong ayzize'wä
Keng palulukan zene zäpivong ayzize'wä
As palulukan is that one who perform action and simultaneously receive it, <äp> is needed here. Also adposition can be connected only with nouns/pronouns (just add space in front of wä in your second sentence)

Quote
Txopu tsawl sleyku palulukan pxeya tsawl to pum leru.
sleyku is transitive verb, so cases are needed and also some other changes. My attempts:

Txopul sleyku palulukanit a lu tsawl to pum lesngä'i => Fear produces thanator which is bigger than the original one
Simpler version:
Palulukan 'ul krr a nga txopu si => Thanator increases when you are afraid
or maybe
Txopul 'eykul palulukanit => Fear causes thanator to increase/Fear makes thanator bigger
Not sure which version is best or most correct, the betters people must judge :)
« Last Edit: March 15, 2012, 02:42:48 am by Blue Elf »
Oe lu skxawng skxakep. Slä oe nerume mi.
"Oe tasyätxaw ulte koren za'u oehu" (Limonádový Joe)


Offline Blue Elf

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Re: Na'vi Proverbs
« Reply #130 on: March 15, 2012, 02:52:57 am »
Tsa’ewll ke lolu fkxakewll, sìlpey oe ;D

One doesn't use tsn'ì in this construction? ↑

No, one does not. Tanri said:
that flower not was itchplant, I hope.

In English you would not say that flower not was itchplant, I hope that either.

tsnì is only used as "that" when you request/hope something (ätxäle / sìlpey)
tsnì can be used, but also can be omitted, depends on what you want to say:
Sìlpey oe tsnì lilvu ngaru tìsop asìltsan. => I hope (that) you had a good journey
Ngaru lolu tìsop asìltsan, sìlpey oe. => You had a good journey, I hope.
Oe lu skxawng skxakep. Slä oe nerume mi.
"Oe tasyätxaw ulte koren za'u oehu" (Limonádový Joe)


Offline Puvomun

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Re: Na'vi Proverbs
« Reply #131 on: March 15, 2012, 03:42:01 am »
Quote
Txopu tsawl sleyku palulukan pxeya tsawl to pum leru.
sleyku is transitive verb, so cases are needed and also some other changes. My attempts:

Txopul sleyku palulukanit a lu tsawl to pum lesngä'i => Fear produces thanator which is bigger than the original one
Simpler version:
Palulukan 'ul krr a nga txopu si => Thanator increases when you are afraid
or maybe
Txopul 'eykul palulukanit => Fear causes thanator to increase/Fear makes thanator bigger
Not sure which version is best or most correct, the betters people must judge :)

Maybe:

Palulukan tsaw slu ngeyä txopuhu nì'eng
Palulukan grows equally with your fear.
Krr a lì'fya lam sraw, may' frivìp utralit.

Ngopyu ayvurä.

Offline Blue Elf

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Re: Na'vi Proverbs
« Reply #132 on: March 15, 2012, 04:08:27 am »
One small letter is missing:
Quote
Palulukan tsawl slu ngeyä txopuhu nì'eng
but good attempt, ma Puvomun!
Oe lu skxawng skxakep. Slä oe nerume mi.
"Oe tasyätxaw ulte koren za'u oehu" (Limonádový Joe)


Offline Tanri

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Re: Na'vi Proverbs
« Reply #133 on: March 15, 2012, 05:46:09 am »
Tsa’ewll ke lolu fkxakewll, sìlpey oe ;D

One doesn't use tsn'ì in this construction? ↑

No, one does not. Tanri said:
that flower not was itchplant, I hope.

In English you would not say that flower not was itchplant, I hope that either.

tsnì is only used as "that" when you request/hope something (ätxäle / sìlpey)
tsnì can be used, but also can be omitted, depends on what you want to say:
Sìlpey oe tsnì lilvu ngaru tìsop asìltsan. => I hope (that) you had a good journey
Ngaru lolu tìsop asìltsan, sìlpey oe. => You had a good journey, I hope.
Exactly. :)
I wanted to avoid tsnì, because it requires subjunctive and combination <ilv> was somewhat over-complicated for such simple saying.
Tìvawmìri txopu rä’ä si. Nrr!

Offline Seze Mune

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Re: Na'vi Proverbs
« Reply #134 on: March 15, 2012, 12:05:59 pm »
I think both of these express the point well:

Txopul 'eykul palulukanit

 Fear causes thanator to increase/Fear makes thanator bigger.


Or:

Palulukan tsawl slu ngeyä txopuhu nì'eng.

Palulukan grows equally with your fear.

(And not only that, I can see where/why the case endings are used)

Txopul tsawl sleyku palulukanit apxa (nì'ul) to tìngay.

Fear makes the thanator grow bigger than the truth.

And teaches me the lovely <eyk> infix which teaches me the transitivity also.  It also might have a sort of fish-that-got-away implication: 'c'mon, really - the thanator wasn't THAT big! Pffttt.'


« Last Edit: March 15, 2012, 12:13:54 pm by Seze Mune »

Offline Seze Mune

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Re: Na'vi Proverbs
« Reply #135 on: March 15, 2012, 12:09:26 pm »


Sngä'i tiväftxu ulte Eywal tayìng ngaru kìngit.

Begin to weave and Eywa will give you the thread.   :D

Offline Seze Mune

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Re: Na'vi Proverbs
« Reply #136 on: March 15, 2012, 12:17:11 pm »
Tsa’ewll ke lolu fkxakewll, sìlpey oe ;D

One doesn't use tsn'ì in this construction? ↑

No, one does not. Tanri said:
that flower not was itchplant, I hope.

In English you would not say that flower not was itchplant, I hope that either.

tsnì is only used as "that" when you request/hope something (ätxäle / sìlpey)
tsnì can be used, but also can be omitted, depends on what you want to say:
Sìlpey oe tsnì lilvu ngaru tìsop asìltsan. => I hope (that) you had a good journey
Ngaru lolu tìsop asìltsan, sìlpey oe. => You had a good journey, I hope.
Exactly. :)
I wanted to avoid tsnì, because it requires subjunctive and combination <ilv> was somewhat over-complicated for such simple saying.

This sounds complicated.  Why would tsnì require the <ilv> infix combination? (Not even sure what that means)

Offline Seze Mune

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Re: Na'vi Proverbs
« Reply #137 on: March 15, 2012, 12:29:08 pm »
Keng palulukan zene zäpivong ayzize'wä.

Even the thanator must defend himself against Hellfire wasps.

Adpositions:  some require <iv> and so do certain modal verbs, so this one <iv> suffices for both in the same sentence, if I were using fpi, mì or ilä?

Palulukan zene tivaron fpi yivomtìng sneyä ayprrnen.  Hmm.  That didn't work out quite right as an example...

And I shall have to figure out a few more <äp> constructions for practice!
« Last Edit: March 15, 2012, 12:31:24 pm by Seze Mune »

Offline Puvomun

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Re: Na'vi Proverbs
« Reply #138 on: March 15, 2012, 12:52:38 pm »
Keng palulukan zene zäpivong ayzize'wä.

Even the thanator must defend himself against Hellfire wasps.

Adpositions:  some require <iv> and so do certain modal verbs, so this one <iv> suffices for both in the same sentence, if I were using fpi, mì or ilä?

Adpositions don't require <iv> as far as I know. Using a modal verb requires <iv> in the following verb, and when you want to say "may/might verb", you use <iv> in the verb (v<iv>erb). An adposition can cause lenition, when the adposition is noted with a + in the dictionary.
Krr a lì'fya lam sraw, may' frivìp utralit.

Ngopyu ayvurä.

Offline Tanri

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Re: Na'vi Proverbs
« Reply #139 on: March 15, 2012, 03:16:05 pm »
This sounds complicated.  Why would tsnì require the <ilv> infix combination? (Not even sure what that means)
Sìlpey used with tsnì requires subjunctive (<iv>), but I wanted to use only perfective (<ol>). They can be combined in one infix <ilv>, although I would leave this for true "I hope that ..." sentences (oe sìlpey tsnì ...).
Tìvawmìri txopu rä’ä si. Nrr!

 

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