Author Topic: Na'vi Proverbs  (Read 55344 times)

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Offline Seze Mune

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Na'vi Proverbs
« on: March 07, 2012, 09:37:33 am »
As this thread has grown, we realize there is much to weed through before one finds the polished proverbs. For those who want only these, I will mention the post numbers where these proverbs are collected and presented.  However for those who wish to learn Na'vi,  there is MUCH value in reading through each page and noting the discussions of cases, word values, adpositions and much more.  I recommend the journey.   ;)

Now to the posts.  See these for the completed proverbs:

Post #  10     (page 1)
Post #  41    (page  3)
Post # 228   (page 16)
Post # 340   (page 23)
Post # 387   (Page 26)
Post # 446   (Page 30)
Post # 563   (Page 38)
Post #1280  (Page 86)
Post #1288  (Page 86)
Post #1290  (Page 87)
Post #1298  (Page 87)
Post #1299  (page 87)
Post #1303  (Page 87)

*******************************************************
ORIGINAL POST:


Actually, this combines my attempt to learn Na'vi with a little fun.  Corrections much appreciated!  And please add your own 'proverbs' if you like. :)

Peyhrr ayutral zivup, aysyaksyuk tayul.

Loosely translated: When when big guys (or big plans) go down, the little guys will scatter.  

Taron nìltsan leiu sre'ohakx 'efu.
« Last Edit: November 09, 2012, 09:15:39 pm by Seze Mune »

Offline Seze Mune

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Re: Na'vi Proverbs
« Reply #1 on: March 07, 2012, 01:40:59 pm »
Rä'ä s<er>ar tukru 'aku ayzize' ftu ngeyä 'eylanä  're'o.

Do not use a spear to remove a hellfire wasp from your friend's forehead.

Offline Puvomun

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Re: Na'vi Proverbs
« Reply #2 on: March 07, 2012, 02:23:15 pm »
Taron nìltsan leiu sre'ohakx 'efu.

It would be better to say this as:
Hunting is good before you are/feel hungry. To make verb-ing, you put tì in front of the verb.

Tìtaron lu sìltsan sre ngal 'efu ohakxit.
(We'll cover the l / it later in the lessons.)

The easiest way to say this:

Taron sre ngal 'efu ohakxit.
Hunt before you feel hungry.
Krr a lì'fya lam sraw, may' frivìp utralit.

Ngopyu ayvurä.

Offline Seze Mune

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Re: Na'vi Proverbs
« Reply #3 on: March 07, 2012, 02:31:22 pm »
Taron nìltsan leiu sre'ohakx 'efu.

It would be better to say this as:
Hunting is good before you are/feel hungry. To make verb-ing, you put tì in front of the verb.

Tìtaron lu sìltsan sre ngal 'efu ohakxit.
(We'll cover the l / it later in the lessons.)

The easiest way to say this:

Taron sre ngal 'efu ohakxit.
Hunt before you feel hungry.

Irayo, ma karyu.  I was wondering about the case endings.  Can they go on adverbs as well as objects?  I'm thinking 'hungry' is an adverb referring to 'feeling' which is a state of being.  I didn't know I could put the patientive case ending on it.

Offline Puvomun

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Re: Na'vi Proverbs
« Reply #4 on: March 07, 2012, 02:38:08 pm »
Rä'ä s<er>ar tukru 'aku ayzize' ftu ngeyä 'eylanä  're'o.

Do not use a spear to remove a hellfire wasp from your friend's forehead.

Rä'ä sar tukruti fpi 'aku zize'ti krr a pumìl tok mì re'o a ngeyä 'eylan.
Don't use spear for-reason remove wasp when it is located on head of your friend.
pum is 'it' which points back to something previously mentioned.

No <er>, as that means 'doing it now', 'fpi' - for the reason of, no ay in ayzize' (only 1). ;)
Krr a lì'fya lam sraw, may' frivìp utralit.

Ngopyu ayvurä.

Offline Puvomun

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Re: Na'vi Proverbs
« Reply #5 on: March 07, 2012, 02:40:57 pm »
Taron nìltsan leiu sre'ohakx 'efu.

It would be better to say this as:
Hunting is good before you are/feel hungry. To make verb-ing, you put tì in front of the verb.

Tìtaron lu sìltsan sre ngal 'efu ohakxit.
(We'll cover the l / it later in the lessons.)

The easiest way to say this:

Taron sre ngal 'efu ohakxit.
Hunt before you feel hungry.

Irayo, ma karyu.  I was wondering about the case endings.  Can they go on adverbs as well as objects?  I'm thinking 'hungry' is an adverb referring to 'feeling' which is a state of being.  I didn't know I could put the patientive case ending on it.
No, these endings are not for adverbs. Ohakx is defined as adjective in the dictionary, we tend not to alter meanings from there.
The l/it-ti endings are for objects, nouns, names, things when using transitive verbs.
Krr a lì'fya lam sraw, may' frivìp utralit.

Ngopyu ayvurä.

Offline Seze Mune

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Re: Na'vi Proverbs
« Reply #6 on: March 07, 2012, 03:02:07 pm »
Taron nìltsan leiu sre'ohakx 'efu.

It would be better to say this as:
Hunting is good before you are/feel hungry. To make verb-ing, you put tì in front of the verb.

Tìtaron lu sìltsan sre ngal 'efu ohakxit.
(We'll cover the l / it later in the lessons.)

The easiest way to say this:

Taron sre ngal 'efu ohakxit.
Hunt before you feel hungry.

Irayo, ma karyu.  I was wondering about the case endings.  Can they go on adverbs as well as objects?  I'm thinking 'hungry' is an adverb referring to 'feeling' which is a state of being.  I didn't know I could put the patientive case ending on it.
No, these endings are not for adverbs. Ohakx is defined as adjective in the dictionary, we tend not to alter meanings from there.
The l/it-ti endings are for objects, nouns, names, things when using transitive verbs.

So, when we say 'ohakxit', we are using the patientive ending for this adjective?

Offline Seze Mune

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Re: Na'vi Proverbs
« Reply #7 on: March 07, 2012, 03:17:43 pm »

Rä'ä sar tukruti fpi 'aku zize'ti krr a pumìl tok mì re'o a ngeyä 'eylan.

Don't use spear for-reason remove wasp when it is located on head of your friend.

pum is 'it' which points back to something previously mentioned.


Very interesting. So we have mune indirect objects (tukruti and zize'ti) with one implied agent (pum) which is glued with 'a' to the indirect objects in front of it.  'Tok' and 'mì'......located towards

Offline Blue Elf

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Re: Na'vi Proverbs
« Reply #8 on: March 07, 2012, 03:43:33 pm »
Woouuuu, nice thread! But I see that some corrections are needed.

Let's start with second sentence:
English: It's good to hunt before you are hungry
Proposed Na'vi versions: Taron nìltsan leiu sre'ohakx 'efu. / Tìtaron lu sìltsan sre ngal 'efu ohakxit.

"you are hungry" translates as Nga 'efu ohakx - notice no case ending. Why? ohakx is adjective, so it can't take case ending, and therefore nor subject can.
IMO best way to say this is "You should hunt before you feel hunger" => Sweylu txo nga tivaron srekrr 'efu ohakx.

First one:
English: When the trees fall, the prolemurises will run
Na'vi: Peyhrr ayutral zivup, aysyaksyuk tayul.
I'd say: Krr a ayutral z(er)up, aysyaksyuk t(er)ul.
<er> infix is not needed and I don't see reason for subjunctive and future. Pehrr is not good here, it is questionable word. Krr a is also "when", but non-questionable. Also if you want to ask in plural (what times), use payhrr (comes from pe+ ay+ krr)

And last one:
English: Do not use a spear to remove a hellfire wasp from your friend's forehead.
Na'vi: Rä'ä s<er>ar tukru 'aku ayzize' ftu ngeyä 'eylanä  're'o. / Rä'ä sar tukruti fpi 'aku zize'ti krr a pumìl tok mì re'o a ngeyä 'eylan.
I think Puvomun is on the better way, but it can be said simpler:
Rä'ä sar tukruti krr a new 'ivaku zize'ti a mì hey ngeyä 'eylanä (Do not use spear when you want to remove hellfire wasp (which is) in friend's face (causes lenition on key))
or
Rä'ä sar tukruti fte 'ivaku zize'ti a mì hey ngeyä 'eylanä (Do not use spear in order to remove hellfire wasp in friend's face)
or
Rä'ä 'aku zize'ti a tok keyit ngeyä 'eylanä fa tukru (Do not remove hellfire wasp in friend's face by spear)
« Last Edit: March 08, 2012, 12:41:07 am by Blue Elf »
Oe lu skxawng skxakep. Slä oe nerume mi.
"Oe tasyätxaw ulte koren za'u oehu" (Limonádový Joe)


Offline Seze Mune

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Re: Na'vi Proverbs
« Reply #9 on: March 07, 2012, 04:22:14 pm »
Woouuuu, nice thread! But I see that some corrections are needed.

Let's start with second sentence:
English: It's good to hunt before you are hungry
Proposed Na'vi versions: Taron nìltsan leiu sre'ohakx 'efu. / Tìtaron lu sìltsan sre ngal 'efu ohakxit.

"you are hungry" translates as Nga 'efu ohakx - notice no case ending. Why? ohakx is adjective, so it can't take case ending, and therefore nor subject can.
IMO best way to say this is "You should hunt before you feel hunger" => Sweylu txo nga tivaron srekrr 'efu ohakx.

Blue Elf: IMO best way to say this is "You should hunt before you feel hunger" => Sweylu txo nga tivaron srekrr 'efu ohakx.

Seze Mune: I translate that literally as:  "It is best if you would hunt before feeling hungry."  So...in this case <iv> is used as the subjunctive expressing a suggestion or wish?
« Last Edit: March 07, 2012, 05:19:06 pm by Seze Mune »

Offline Seze Mune

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Re: Na'vi Proverbs
« Reply #10 on: March 07, 2012, 05:42:32 pm »
Irayo seiyi Puvomun sì Blue Elf, we have three new Na'vi proverbs.  I will translate the overt meanings and not the direct words. If you want the derivations and discussion, please see above.  If you want to discuss the implication of the proverb...well, I guess that's okay too:

Sweylu txo nga tivaron srekrr 'efu ohakx. It is best to hunt before you are hungry!

Krr a ayutral z(er)up, aysyaksyuk t(er)ul.
 When the tree falls, the prolemurises will run.

and

Rä'ä sar tukruti fpi 'aku zize'ti krr a pumìl tok mì re'o a ngeyä 'eylan.

Do not use a spear to remove a hellfire wasp from your friend's face.

OR

Rä'ä sar tukruti krr a new 'ivaku zize'ti a mì hey ngeyä 'eylanä


OR

Rä'ä sar tukruti fte 'ivaku zize'ti a mì hey ngeyä 'eylanä

OR

Rä'ä 'aku zize'ti a tok keyit ngeyä 'eylanä fa tukruti


I will be posting a few more for tomorrow!

NOTE: NONE of these is canon.  Use at will.
« Last Edit: March 07, 2012, 07:50:37 pm by Seze Mune »

Offline Seze Mune

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Re: Na'vi Proverbs
« Reply #11 on: March 07, 2012, 05:53:25 pm »
Hufwet pumìl 'efu, pumìl fyawìntxu ikranit.


Offline Seze Mune

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Re: Na'vi Proverbs
« Reply #12 on: March 07, 2012, 06:03:46 pm »
 
   
'Aw tskxe ahì'i ska'a mesh'kai huru teyluhu nìwotx.


Offline Seze Mune

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Re: Na'vi Proverbs
« Reply #13 on: March 07, 2012, 06:13:25 pm »
Fahew aysyulang 'ì'awn tsyokhu pum tìng aysyulang.

« Last Edit: March 07, 2012, 07:47:08 pm by Seze Mune »

Offline Alyara Arati

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Re: Na'vi Proverbs
« Reply #14 on: March 07, 2012, 08:54:25 pm »
Irayo seiyi Puvomun sì Blue Elf, we have three new Na'vi proverbs.  I will translate the overt meanings and not the direct words. If you want the derivations and discussion, please see above.  If you want to discuss the implication of the proverb...well, I guess that's okay too:

Sweylu txo nga tivaron srekrr 'efu ohakx. It is best to hunt before you are hungry!

Krr a ayutral z(er)up, aysyaksyuk t(er)ul.
 When the tree falls, the prolemurises will run.

and

Rä'ä sar tukruti fpi 'aku zize'ti krr a pumìl tok mì re'o a ngeyä 'eylan.

Do not use a spear to remove a hellfire wasp from your friend's face.

OR

Rä'ä sar tukruti krr a new 'ivaku zize'ti a mì hey ngeyä 'eylanä


OR

Rä'ä sar tukruti fte 'ivaku zize'ti a mì hey ngeyä 'eylanä

OR

Rä'ä 'aku zize'ti a tok keyit ngeyä 'eylanä fa tukruti


I will be posting a few more for tomorrow!

NOTE: NONE of these is canon.  Use at will.

You can use a case ending or an adposition on a noun, but not both, so fa tukru OR tukrufa.

Hufwet pumìl 'efu, pumìl fyawìntxu ikranit.

Hufweti fkol 'efu anafì'u, nìtengfya fkol fyawìntxu ikranit.

My version might not be the most simple, but the important thing here is that one must use "fko" rather than "pum" as your pronoun.


'Aw tskxe ahì'i ska'a mesh'kai huru teyluhu nìwotx.


'Awa tskxel ahì'i ska'a (illegal word) "huru"ti teyluä nìwotx.

Perhaps you might use "meal" of teylu, or just "teylu" alone (does anyone know if it is a collective noun like "syuve"?)

Fahew aysyulang 'ì'awn tsyokhu pum tìng aysyulang.

Fahew aysyulangä 'ì'awn tsyokmì a fumit tìng.

I personally love this one.  You have a clever and creative mind. :D
« Last Edit: January 13, 2013, 02:53:56 pm by Alyara Arati »
Learn how to see.  Realize that everything connects to everything else.
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Offline Puvomun

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Re: Na'vi Proverbs
« Reply #15 on: March 07, 2012, 11:08:14 pm »
Taron nìltsan leiu sre'ohakx 'efu.

It would be better to say this as:
Hunting is good before you are/feel hungry. To make verb-ing, you put tì in front of the verb.

Tìtaron lu sìltsan sre ngal 'efu ohakxit.
(We'll cover the l / it later in the lessons.)

The easiest way to say this:

Taron sre ngal 'efu ohakxit.
Hunt before you feel hungry.

Irayo, ma karyu.  I was wondering about the case endings.  Can they go on adverbs as well as objects?  I'm thinking 'hungry' is an adverb referring to 'feeling' which is a state of being.  I didn't know I could put the patientive case ending on it.
No, these endings are not for adverbs. Ohakx is defined as adjective in the dictionary, we tend not to alter meanings from there.
The l/it-ti endings are for objects, nouns, names, things when using transitive verbs.

So, when we say 'ohakxit', we are using the patientive ending for this adjective?
No, this was my bad. The -it does not belong there. I don't do well with smart in evenings, sorry.
Krr a lì'fya lam sraw, may' frivìp utralit.

Ngopyu ayvurä.

Offline Puvomun

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Re: Na'vi Proverbs
« Reply #16 on: March 07, 2012, 11:18:03 pm »


'Aw tskxe ahì'i ska'a mesh'kai huru teyluhu nìwotx.


'Awa tskxel ahì'i ska'a (illegal word) "huru"ti teyluä nìwotx.

Perhaps you might use "meal" of teylu, or just "teylu" alone (does anyone know if it is a collective noun like "syuve"?)

A simpler version might indeed be:
'Aw tskxe ahì'i tsun skiva'a wutsot nìwotx. One small stone can ruin the whole meal.
Krr a lì'fya lam sraw, may' frivìp utralit.

Ngopyu ayvurä.

Offline Blue Elf

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Re: Na'vi Proverbs
« Reply #17 on: March 08, 2012, 12:47:26 am »
Woouuuu, nice thread! But I see that some corrections are needed.

Let's start with second sentence:
English: It's good to hunt before you are hungry
Proposed Na'vi versions: Taron nìltsan leiu sre'ohakx 'efu. / Tìtaron lu sìltsan sre ngal 'efu ohakxit.

"you are hungry" translates as Nga 'efu ohakx - notice no case ending. Why? ohakx is adjective, so it can't take case ending, and therefore nor subject can.
IMO best way to say this is "You should hunt before you feel hunger" => Sweylu txo nga tivaron srekrr 'efu ohakx.

Blue Elf: IMO best way to say this is "You should hunt before you feel hunger" => Sweylu txo nga tivaron srekrr 'efu ohakx.

Seze Mune: I translate that literally as:  "It is best if you would hunt before feeling hungry."  So...in this case <iv> is used as the subjunctive expressing a suggestion or wish?
No, <iv> here is required because of sweylu. there are two forms:
future: Sweylu txo ... verb+ <iv> ...
past: Sweylu fwa ... verb + <am>/<ol> ...
See here for more info: http://naviteri.org/2011/04/%E2%80%99a%E2%80%99awa-li%E2%80%99fyavi-amip%E2%80%94a-few-new-expressions/, paragrah 2.
Quote
You can use a case ending or an adposition on a noun, but not both, so fa tukru OR tukrufa.
Dammit! Of course you are right - how could I do such stupid kxeyey which I so often correct for other people? Deep night is not good time for thinking :(
Oe lu skxawng skxakep. Slä oe nerume mi.
"Oe tasyätxaw ulte koren za'u oehu" (Limonádový Joe)


Offline Blue Elf

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Re: Na'vi Proverbs
« Reply #18 on: March 08, 2012, 01:19:30 am »

Hufwet pumìl 'efu, pumìl fyawìntxu ikranit.

Hufweti fkol 'efu anafì'u, nìtengfya fkol fyawìntxu ikranit.

My version might not be the most simple, but the important thing here is that one must use "fko" rather than "pum" as your pronoun.
This. Pum is "repeater" of the word previously mentioned (so it can be inferred from the context). But ma Seze Mune, there is nothing in your sentence to which "pum" can reffer back, you can't use "pum" on its own. Fko must be used. Nari si: both pum and fko translates as "one" into English, but in English "one" has more meanings. You must select the correct one, and use the correct Na'vi counterpart.
Quote

'Aw tskxe ahì'i ska'a mesh'kai huru teyluhu nìwotx.


'Awa tskxel ahì'i ska'a (illegal word) "huru"ti teyluä nìwotx.

Perhaps you might use "meal" of teylu, or just "teylu" alone (does anyone know if it is a collective noun like "syuve"?)
We should avoid the unofficial words. What about: 'Awa tskxel ahì'i ska'a tsngalit teyluä nìwotx ?

Quote
Fahew aysyulang 'ì'awn tsyokhu pum tìng aysyulang.

Fahew aysyulangä 'ì'awn tsyokmì a fumit tìng.
I personally love this one.  You have a clever and creative mind. :D
Nothing to add. Very nice words.

Whole this thread is good language exercise (+1 for this), we also creating sentences based on the pictures in Ngaynume lessons. Don't you want to come to us? Lessons are on Tuesdays and Thursdays starting at 21:00 [GMT+1]. I know you are from America, but maybe your time allows you to come... Not many people attends Ngaynume...
Oe lu skxawng skxakep. Slä oe nerume mi.
"Oe tasyätxaw ulte koren za'u oehu" (Limonádový Joe)


Offline Seze Mune

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Re: Na'vi Proverbs
« Reply #19 on: March 08, 2012, 10:07:45 am »
Taron nìltsan leiu sre'ohakx 'efu.

It would be better to say this as:
Hunting is good before you are/feel hungry. To make verb-ing, you put tì in front of the verb.

Tìtaron lu sìltsan sre ngal 'efu ohakxit.
(We'll cover the l / it later in the lessons.)

The easiest way to say this:

Taron sre ngal 'efu ohakxit.
Hunt before you feel hungry.

Irayo, ma karyu.  I was wondering about the case endings.  Can they go on adverbs as well as objects?  I'm thinking 'hungry' is an adverb referring to 'feeling' which is a state of being.  I didn't know I could put the patientive case ending on it.
No, these endings are not for adverbs. Ohakx is defined as adjective in the dictionary, we tend not to alter meanings from there.
The l/it-ti endings are for objects, nouns, names, things when using transitive verbs.

So, when we say 'ohakxit', we are using the patientive ending for this adjective?
No, this was my bad. The -it does not belong there. I don't do well with smart in evenings, sorry.

Kea tìkin ngaru txoa leru, ma Puvomun.  Haryu aswey aynumeyu nìteng leiu, kefyak?
« Last Edit: March 08, 2012, 10:10:06 am by Seze Mune »

 

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