Author Topic: Mordred's lullaby nìNa'vi  (Read 1518 times)

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Offline Herwìna

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Mordred's lullaby nìNa'vi
« on: January 15, 2012, 07:35:59 pm »
In the word descriptions is what I am trying to say. After the Na'vi lyrics there is a video of the song. Original lyrics are after the video. If anyone has any ideas of how to say some things in a possibly better manner or any corrections to my use of Na'vi, I would be glad to get constructive criticism. :)



Motretä uniltìrol

Fnu, 'eveng
Tìvawn zaya'u nefä tìtxukxftu
Ulte munge ngat nekll unilmì
'eveng, tìvawn zaya'u nefä tìtxukxftu
Ulte munge ngat nekll unilmì

Ma oeyä 'itan
Oel leykayatem tsa'ut a ngal spaw
Ulte ngal frakrr ayomum a ngeyä sempul lu 'akuyu
Ulte nga ke tslayam pelun nga 'efu keftxo
Slä ngal frakrr layek aymokrit a ta mìfa

Ngay ngay ngay ngay
ngay ngay ngay le'aw fpi oe


Ma oeyä 'itan,
Ngeyä tireal vaye'kì poeti
Syulang a muntxa sami oeyä tsmukanur alu kavukyu
Ulte ngal kayulat fya'ot a poanìl leykatem aylapoyä ayfya'ot
Taluna ngal wìntxu fya'ot a poanìl kavuk sami poeru

Ngay ngay ngay ngay
ngay ngay ngay le'aw fpi oe


Fnu, 'eveng
Tìvawn zaya'u nefä tìtxukxftu
Ulte munge ngat nekll unilmì
'eveng, tìvawn zaya'u nefä tìtxukxftu
Ulte munge ngat nekll unilmì


Ma oeyä 'itan
Fratrr nga tsawl slu nì'ul koak
Fraswaw oel tse'a fya'ot a oeyä tìkawng 'ong
Taluna oeyä tokxä 'eveng, oeyä vitrayä vey
Tayerkup tìtusätxaw muiä fpi 'ongokxyä

Ngay ngay ngay ngay
ngay ngay ngay le'aw fpi oe


Fnu, 'eveng
Tìvawn zaya'u nefä tìtxukxftu
Ulte munge ngat nekll unilmì
'eveng, tìvawn zaya'u nefä tìtxukxftu
Ulte munge ngat nekll unilmì





« Last Edit: February 11, 2012, 01:45:33 pm by lumivalko »
Siyevop nga nìzawnong ayukmì, vaykrr oengeyä mefya'o ultxaräpun fìtsap nìmun.

Oe zawng
nga zawng
nìwotx awnga zawng
fte oeti zeykivawng

Ngal yamom fì'ut srak?!

Offline Blue Elf

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Re: Mordred's lullaby nìNa'vi
« Reply #1 on: January 16, 2012, 01:38:29 am »
Don't look bad at first look, I'll read it in detail in the evening.
Does This text come from real song? Is it available on Youtube or somewhere?
Oe lu skxawng skxakep. Slä oe nerume mi.
"Oe tasyätxaw ulte koren za'u oehu" (Limonádový Joe)


Offline Herwìna

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Re: Mordred's lullaby nìNa'vi
« Reply #2 on: January 16, 2012, 07:29:43 am »
Oh, yes, the song is Mordred's lullaby by Heather Dale. I added a video of it.
« Last Edit: January 16, 2012, 08:11:58 am by lumivalko »
Siyevop nga nìzawnong ayukmì, vaykrr oengeyä mefya'o ultxaräpun fìtsap nìmun.

Oe zawng
nga zawng
nìwotx awnga zawng
fte oeti zeykivawng

Ngal yamom fì'ut srak?!

Offline Kamean

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Re: Mordred's lullaby nìNa'vi
« Reply #3 on: January 16, 2012, 09:45:18 am »
Suneiu oer. :)
Tse'a ngal ke'ut a krr fra'uti kame.


Offline Herwìna

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Re: Mordred's lullaby nìNa'vi
« Reply #4 on: January 16, 2012, 09:56:38 am »
I am sorry, my Na'vi is far from perfect... I do have a vague idea about what you are saying, but I am not sure.  :-\
« Last Edit: January 16, 2012, 01:27:37 pm by lumivalko »
Siyevop nga nìzawnong ayukmì, vaykrr oengeyä mefya'o ultxaräpun fìtsap nìmun.

Oe zawng
nga zawng
nìwotx awnga zawng
fte oeti zeykivawng

Ngal yamom fì'ut srak?!

Offline Kamean

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Re: Mordred's lullaby nìNa'vi
« Reply #5 on: January 16, 2012, 01:11:20 pm »
Tse'a ngal ke'ut a krr fra'uti kame.


Offline Herwìna

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Re: Mordred's lullaby nìNa'vi
« Reply #6 on: January 16, 2012, 01:43:11 pm »
Tolel. Txo nga plltxe "suneiu oer", tsunslu oe 'iveyng "irayo"? Oel fpìl tsaw lam keyawr...
« Last Edit: January 21, 2012, 07:36:23 am by lumivalko »
Siyevop nga nìzawnong ayukmì, vaykrr oengeyä mefya'o ultxaräpun fìtsap nìmun.

Oe zawng
nga zawng
nìwotx awnga zawng
fte oeti zeykivawng

Ngal yamom fì'ut srak?!

Offline Kamean

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Re: Mordred's lullaby nìNa'vi
« Reply #7 on: January 16, 2012, 02:36:25 pm »
Ma, tolel. Txo nga san "suneiu oer", tsunslu oe 'eyng "irayo"? Oe fpìl tsat ke lam eyawr...
Nìngay tsunslu. :)
Tse'a ngal ke'ut a krr fra'uti kame.


Offline Blue Elf

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Re: Mordred's lullaby nìNa'vi
« Reply #8 on: January 16, 2012, 03:33:02 pm »
Ma <put name here>, tolel. Txo nga plltxe san "suneiu oer", tsunslu oe 'iveyng fa "irayo"? Oe fpìl tsawt ke lam eyawr oeru...
Sran, nga tsun. Also you can use "Oeru meuia" or "tstunwi".

I read your text carefully and here's list of corrections with some explanation (ask if you don't understand anything)

txukx is not noun but adjective, so something like tìtxukx is needed (although it's unapproved word)
munge is transitive, so munge ngat
hahaw is verb, so you must use mì tìhusahaw (adposition is separeted by space if stands before noun)

Oel layatem peu nge spawit
spaw is verb, so no case ending, it goes to object. Also you must rephrase sentence a little:
Oel leykatem tsat a ngal spaw (I cause to change that (thing) you believe in). There is unwritten object, so agentive ending on nga is used. <eyk> is used to turn intransitive verb into transitive

Ulte ngal frakrr ayomum futa ngeyä sempul lu 'akuyu
Omum is transitive
Ulte nga ke tslayam pelun nga lu'efu keftxo
for feelings you must use 'efu

Slä ngal frakrr nayong aymokrit
nong here is used transitively. As adposition can't be used with case ending, I removed it

Syulang a muntxa soli oeyä tsmukanur alu kavukyu
Flower which married my brother, by other word traitor
si- verbs require dative ending. When connecting two nouns, alu is necessary

Ulte ngal kayulat fya'ot a poanìl leykatem aylapoyä ayfya'ot
kulat is transitive - don't forget case endings. And latem is intransitive, <eyk> helps here

tAluna ngal wìntxu fya'ot a poan kavuk sami poeru
because you show the way in which he betrayed her
Use taluna here (from the reason which is), alunta is used for reverse clause order. Wìntxu here works transitively.
Seems, that pe- word don't have to be used in questions only, but I don't prefer this, so I rephrased this line a little.

Fratrr nga tsawl slu nì'ul koak
I'd probably remove tsawl (Every day you become more older)

Sìn nìwotx ayswaw oel nari si oeyä kawngit 'ong
Mì fraswaw oel tse'a futa oeyä tìkawng 'ong
I think is better here. nìwotx is adverb, so use fra- prefix. Nari si means "be carefull, watch out", for physial seeing we have tse'a. Kawng is adjective, we need noun tìkawng

Alunta oeyä tokxyä 'eveng, oeyä vitrayä vey
Taluna oeyä tokxä 'eveng, oeyä vitrayä vey
again - use taluna. Genitive ending is -yä for words ending by -a,-ä, -e, -i, -ì. All other words take only -ä.

Will die in returning the birthright he stole
Tayerkup tìtusätxaw muiä fpi 'ongokxyä
There's problem to translate this sentence. muiä is adjective, we don't have word for "right" in sense of to have something allowed to do. Also you can't use adposition with noun with case ending (only one option is allowed - adposition + noun or noun+case ending)
I'd try to write it as (no guarantee of correctness):
Tayerkup tengkrr teykätxaw tì'ongokxit a pol ska'a
Will die while return  birth he destroyed

Still good attempt - translating song is great fun (make it singable even better fun (honestly - it is horrible job :)))
Main rule is - do not translate word literally, many words we are missing, existing words often have narrower meaning that English word. Rephrasing is often needed. Sorry if I scared you, but I hope you stay here :)
If you fall into problems, just ask, many great people are here to help you
Eywa ngahu!
Oe lu skxawng skxakep. Slä oe nerume mi.
"Oe tasyätxaw ulte koren za'u oehu" (Limonádový Joe)


Offline Herwìna

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Re: Mordred's lullaby nìNa'vi
« Reply #9 on: January 16, 2012, 04:15:19 pm »
Do not worry, I was waiting for someone to come and point out my mistakes. That is why I posted the translation here in the first place.
I will look into it more one of these days, now I need to sleep. *yawn*
« Last Edit: January 21, 2012, 07:27:41 am by lumivalko »
Siyevop nga nìzawnong ayukmì, vaykrr oengeyä mefya'o ultxaräpun fìtsap nìmun.

Oe zawng
nga zawng
nìwotx awnga zawng
fte oeti zeykivawng

Ngal yamom fì'ut srak?!

Offline Herwìna

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Re: Mordred's lullaby nìNa'vi
« Reply #10 on: January 22, 2012, 05:14:18 am »
@Blue Elf: I have gone through the translation and corrected most of the mistakes. May you go through it again and see if there still are some?

@All: On another note, would someone have suggestions about how to say the following sentences in Na'vi?
"And you will expose his puppeteer behavior"
and
"Will die in returning the birthright he stole".

I do like your suggestion, Blue Elf, but I would like to see if there would be any other suggestions. :)
Siyevop nga nìzawnong ayukmì, vaykrr oengeyä mefya'o ultxaräpun fìtsap nìmun.

Oe zawng
nga zawng
nìwotx awnga zawng
fte oeti zeykivawng

Ngal yamom fì'ut srak?!

Offline Blue Elf

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Re: Mordred's lullaby nìNa'vi
« Reply #11 on: January 22, 2012, 02:27:17 pm »
@Blue Elf: I have gone through the translation and corrected most of the mistakes. May you go through it again and see if there still are some?
Ok, I found these three:
Oel leykayatem tsa'ut a ngal spaw (missing patientive case and connector between clauses)
Slä ngal frakrr nayong äo aymokrit (use case ending only or noun+adposition. First option is better here, I think)
Ulte ngal kayulat fya'ot a poanìl leykatem aylapoyä ayfya'ot (missing patientive)

Quote
@All: On another note, would someone have suggestions about how to say the following sentences in Na'vi?
"And you will expose his puppeteer behavior"
and
"Will die in returning the birthright he stole".

I do like your suggestion, Blue Elf, but I would like to see if there would be any other suggestions. :)
Nothing wrong, more proposals - more options to choose. You can try post these sentences in beginners subforum / vocabulary. There is bigger chance to get good answers.
Oe lu skxawng skxakep. Slä oe nerume mi.
"Oe tasyätxaw ulte koren za'u oehu" (Limonádový Joe)


Offline Tanri

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Re: Mordred's lullaby nìNa'vi
« Reply #12 on: January 29, 2012, 09:06:59 am »
You can try post these sentences in beginners subforum / vocabulary. There is bigger chance to get good answers.
Because there are ayskxawng like me, who don't visit songs section frequently, if anyway. ::)

I will try to go through your text, however I must notice that regarding words nonexisting in Na'vi, we can do a lot by "describing the meaning", not translating it directly. This is suitable for plain text, but surely can make it unfitting to the original melody. I am afraid that two sentences you asked for in beginners section falls to this category. We will see...
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Offline Tanri

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Re: Mordred's lullaby nìNa'vi
« Reply #13 on: January 29, 2012, 03:46:33 pm »
I have to say that I intentionally have not read the Blue Elf's corrections, for not to being influenced by them. Although our (Elf's and mine) opinions are mostly similar, this way you can treat our reviews as independent.
Also, as I am writing this on PDA, I prefer to split my review into smaller parts.
Tse, sngä'i ko! (let's begin!)

your text -> my version
comments and explanations


Ulte munge ngat nekll unilmì ->
Ulte munge ngat nekll nemfa unil.
- mì means "in" in a static way, unlike nemfa, which means "into" with a sense of movement.
If this is too long, I prefer to skip nekll and keep nemfa.
Also keep in mind that "nemfa unil" means "into the dream". We don't have yet a noun for "the sleep", although I think that "tìhahaw" can be derived for this purpose.

Oel leykayatem tsa'u ngal spaw ->
Oel leykayatem tsa'ut a ngal spaw.
- added "-t" and separated those two clauses by "a".
Maybe it is also possible to say:
"Oel leykayatem fya'ot a nga spaw" = "I will change the way you believe".

Ulte ngal frakrr ayomum a ngeyä sempul lu 'akuyu. ->
Ulte ngal frakrr ayomum futa ngeyä sempul kawng lu.
1) replaced attributive "a" with a direct object placeholder "futa", literally "fì'ut a..." = "this thing which is...".
2) thief versus bad - it's obviously hard to translate "thief" to the people whose society doesn't rely on ownership. Personally I didn't got the meaning from 'akuyu, before looking at original text.
From this reason I would prefer more generic "bad person", instead of verb derivation with unpredictable meaning.
3) about "sempul lu X" and "sempul X lu": for better pronounciation and understanding, I prefer to avoid two consecutive identical letters, as long as possible.

Ulte nga ke tslayam pelun nga 'efu keftxo ->
Ulte ngal ke tslayam lunit a 'eykefu keftxo.
- which is a shortened version of "Ulte ngal ke tslayam lunit a tsal ngati 'eykefu keftxo." = literally "You will not understand the reason which makes you feel bad."

Slä ngal frakrr nayong äo aymokrit. ->
Slä ngal frakrr layek aymokrit a ta mìfa.
1) nong is "to follow" in physical sense, or speaking about timeline (some action follows another one), thus the verb "lek" = "heed, obey" fits here better.
2) "voices beneath" seems to me not as voices from the bottom, or voices from behind of something, but rather a voices from the inside, an internal voice. Again, the "a" is required to attach the description "from inside" to the noun "voices".
...
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Offline Tanri

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Re: Mordred's lullaby nìNa'vi
« Reply #14 on: January 29, 2012, 05:39:38 pm »
...
ngay ngay le'aw fpi oe ->
spivaw spivaw oeti nì'aw.
Without a word for "loyalty", I think that "trust, trust me only" could be a good replacement.

Syulang a muntxa sami oeyä tsmukanur alu kavukyu. ->
Syulang a muntxa soli hu oeyä tsmukan alu kavuksiyu.
1) sami / soli - in sentence like this, those meanings are very close, but not identical.
"Sami" says to me that some action has been taken in the past, but whether the action succeeded or not, remains unknown to me.
For this reason I would say "soli", which tells me that some action has been completed, therefore had take place in the past. Someone can mention that <ol> infix can be used even with future tense - yes, it can, but in this sentence, as well in all instances of <ol> alone, you can be pretty sure that it means "completed action", action that happened somewhere in the past.
This applies to the previous instances of <am> in your translation too, but with "muntxa si" I found it worthy of notice. In reality, the <ol> infix is more frequently used than <am>.
2) tsmukanur / hu tsmukan - both are grammatically correct, both can be understood, but speaking about actions that are performed "with" someone else, I prefer to say it literally, not through the dative case (a recipient of the action). It is the same pattern as in "meet someone"  = "ultxa si hu tuteo".
3) kavukyu / kavuksiyu - the verb "to betray" is "kavuk si", kavuk alone is a noun. Thus we must use "kavuksiyu" for the person that is "doing the betrayal". -Yu derivations are productive (for non-infixed verbs) - they can be created freely, if they make sense with particular verb.
There is also a non-zero possibility to use the noun "kavuktu", however -tu derivations are not productive, they must already exist in the dictionary, which is obviously not this case.
...
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Offline Blue Elf

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Re: Mordred's lullaby nìNa'vi
« Reply #15 on: January 30, 2012, 02:56:34 am »
3) kavukyu / kavuksiyu - the verb "to betray" is "kavuk si", kavuk alone is a noun. Thus we must use "kavuksiyu" for the person that is "doing the betrayal". -Yu derivations are productive (for non-infixed verbs) - they can be created freely, if they make sense with particular verb.
There is also a non-zero possibility to use the noun "kavuktu", however -tu derivations are not productive, they must already exist in the dictionary, which is obviously not this case.
Good catch, ma Tanri, I missed that. Kavuksiyu is surely correct here.
Oe lu skxawng skxakep. Slä oe nerume mi.
"Oe tasyätxaw ulte koren za'u oehu" (Limonádový Joe)


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Re: Mordred's lullaby nìNa'vi
« Reply #16 on: January 30, 2012, 10:16:41 am »
...
Ulte ngal kayulat fya'ot a poanìl leykatem aylapoyä ayfya'ot ->
Ulte ngal kayulat peyä tìnusewit a täftxu aysyayit suteyä alahe.
- literally "And you will reveal his willing, which is to weave the fate of other people".
Tì-n<us>ewit is "the willing", a name of the action "to want". This construction is safely productive and all Na’vi should understand.
Then a closer description of this willing is attached by attributive "a". You can also use the verb "leykatem" (to change something), instead of "täftxu". If this is too long, I think we can leave out "alahe", and the meaning should remains clear.

Taluna ngal wìntxu fya'ot a poanìl kavuk sami poeru ->
Taluna ngal wìntxu fya'ot a poan kavuk sami poeru.
- deleted "ìl", as there is no transitive verb

Fratrr nga tsawl slu nì'ul koak ->
Fratrr a nga sleru fyeyn nì’ul
1) "fratrr a...": I feel the meaning of the original as "Each day, in which you grow older", not a simple statement "You grow older every day".
2) koak / fyeyn: because we are speaking to a child, I would prefer the "becoming more adult/mature", instead of "being older".
3] slu / sleru: added <er> infix to express the continuation of "becoming more adult" during all that days.

Fraswaw oel tse'a fya'ot a oeyä tìkawng 'ong ->
Fraswaw a oel ’erefu fya'ot a oeyä tìkawng 'ong
- same as above, plus replaced "tse’a" with "’efu", because IMHO this kind of things cannot be seen through eyes.
For the sake of being shorter, if necessary, I would sacrifice the <er> infix.

Taluna oeyä tokxä 'eveng, oeyä vitrayä vey ->
’Evengfpi a ta tokx oeyä, tìseykxel vitrayä oey...
- literally "For the sake of the child, which comes from my body, the strength of my soul..."

Tayerkup tìtusätxaw muiä fpi 'ongokxyä ->
...tayerkup tengkrr teykerätxaw tìreyit a pol kolanom.
- literally "...will die while returning the life he got."

Those last three sentences can surely be translated in many other ways, but personally I found these fit best to the original text.

One last note - I completely ignored the need for specific number of syllables, or the ability of my text to be singable, so this requires a lot more effort for become an actual song lyrics.
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Re: Mordred's lullaby nìNa'vi
« Reply #17 on: February 01, 2012, 08:07:07 am »
Wow. That's a lot of text. I shall take some time to go everything through and fix the lyrics when I feel less flu-y. :)
Siyevop nga nìzawnong ayukmì, vaykrr oengeyä mefya'o ultxaräpun fìtsap nìmun.

Oe zawng
nga zawng
nìwotx awnga zawng
fte oeti zeykivawng

Ngal yamom fì'ut srak?!

Offline Tirea Aean

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Re: Mordred's lullaby nìNa'vi
« Reply #18 on: February 01, 2012, 08:12:18 am »
Nice one Tanri ;D I'm not sure I have much of anything to add to that.

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Re: Mordred's lullaby nìNa'vi
« Reply #19 on: February 02, 2012, 01:50:05 pm »
On a non-linguistic note; THIS SONGS ROCKS! I had never heard this artist or song and love them both. I've pretty much stuck the song on repeat at work and am probably going to have to buy it now. Can't wait to hear the Na'vi version when it's complete. Also, have you heard that Heather Dale posts fan-sung songs on her YouTube page? You should send this in when it's done.

Finally, if you want a spoken version of the Na'vi let me know and I'll make you a recording.

 

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