Dictionary of missing words

[Blue Elf]

Na'vi language at this time has roughly 1500 words (in base uninflected form). This makes language quite usable, sometimes even incredibly usable. However, still many words are missing. But some words can be expressed by describing them by existing words, what gives possibility to extend vocabulary without creating new words. Of course words expressed this way can be quite long, so maybe they can be harder to use them in speech, although they can still be usefull for writing.

Goal of this thread is to propose "new words" by creating them using words we already have. I you have your own words created by this way, have seen such words somewhere, please post them here. If we have bigger amount of words, I can compile them into PDF to have them in one place.

A few words I created or collected until now:
Seasons:
- summer: zìsìkrr tìsomä, zìsìkrr asom
- winter: zìsìkrr herwìyä
- autumn: zìsìkrr ayrìkä azusup, zìsìkrr hufweyä
- spring: zìsìkrr aysulangä (a'usong)

- clock: krrwìntxuyu (seen on Le'eylan's blog)
- crop-plant, product of plant which contains seeds: 'eveng 'ewllä

[Kamean]

Nice idea!

[Tsmuktengan]

This seems to be a good idea. This can be interesting, save time and help the language to evolve more especially in types of vocabulary that cannot be the main focus currently, but that are yet frequently used.

I'm only a newbie, but setting a separate list like this can be interesting. This should however not slow up the submission and examination of new words as it is done in the usual sections in this forums.

This "dictionary of missing words" may need to be considered explicitly 'illegal' as the final words, that could be inspired by the constructions made in this list, may be different depending on how K. Pawl decides. As long as there is no validation for a word, root or constructed, it may be better to mention clearly their real status. Yet, this can be a step to create more unique na'vi words in a close future, based on these constructed words you suggest to list.  

[Blue Elf]

Well, this dictionary doesn't try to replace work of LEP. Here words should be created by describing them by existing words without processes used in "normal way" of creating words like connecting existing words with disapearing some letters. Such words must be posted into LEP, not here.
Of course if some official word will be created with the same meaning as word in this dictionary, it should be deleted here.

['Oma Tirea]

I like to think of these words as community-created words that the Na'vi don't normally have.  Here's another one I've seen floating around: rel arusikx

I can only think of one approved by Karyu Pawl that's not a loanword: eltu lefngap

I recall some other threads on a similar matter...

[Blue Elf]

I like to think of these words as community-created words that the Na'vi don't normally have.  Here's another one I've seen floating around: rel arusikx

Yes, it is widely used, so it should be listed here, thanks

I can only think of one approved by Karyu Pawl that's not a loanword: eltu lefngap

It is stated in main dictionary, so no need to put it here again.

And I forgot word I developed (although didn't use yet) for moon - tsawke txonä

[Kamean]

I more like txoneyä tsawke.

[Blue Elf]

I more like txoneyä tsawke.

What is incorrect As txon doesn't end with a, ä, e, i nor ì, -ä is the only possible case ending.
-eyä is very special ending for pronouns: nga -> ngayä, but "a" before -yä changes to "e", so result is ngeyä

[Kamean]

I more like txoneyä tsawke.

What is incorrect As txon doesn't end with a, ä, e, i not ì, -ä is the only possible case ending.
-eyä is very special ending for pronouns: nga -> ngayä, but "a" before -yä changes to "e", so result is ngeyä

Yes? i forget about it. Txonä tsawke.

[Yayo]

I more like txoneyä tsawke.

What is incorrect As txon doesn't end with a, ä, e, i not ì, -ä is the only possible case ending.
-eyä is very special ending for pronouns: nga -> ngayä, but "a" before -yä changes to "e", so result is ngeyä

Yes? i forget about it. Txonä tsawke.

Honest mistake.

Since the moon is an integral part of culture and Astronomy, wouldn't it be better to suggest a root in LEP? I feel that unofficial combination words for things as important as the moon shouldn't be used.

[Tìsrusewä Karyu]

Maybe I don't understand what this topic is about, but I have two reactions.
First, I really *HATE* the idea of a separate dictionary. Seems like the phrases you are collecting should appear in the official dictionary. The current dictionary has a place for them, Appendix F. Have you asked them about adding your examples?
Second, reading the subject line, I was hoping you are collecting words that need Na'vi equivalents some day. For example, we see Jake and Neytiri running paths on tree branches that are trails above ground. I have called such trails "aerial walkways" and would love to see a Na'vi word or phrase for them. After seeing your examples, it seems this is not what you are collecting. Looks like you are collecting phrases made of existing Na'vi words. Is that correct?
Irayo.

[Yayo]

That is correct. The purpose of this seems to be the establishment of 'new' words from a combination of already existing words. Perhaps you should refer to the LEP suggestions board, for your 'aerial walkways'.

EDIT: I agree that this shouldn't be a 'dictionary' per se, but a database for reference or loan words that will be used temporarily until a new root is suggested.

[Tìsrusewä Karyu]

Thanks for the quick response. On one hand, I hate the idea of having something separate, be it a dictionary, database, list, whatever. On the other hand, getting something through the approved channels seems practically insurmountable. I have been chided in other forums for not submitting suggestions to the LEP, but I don't have a PhD in linguistics, don't feel qualified to play in that sandbox, and hate to spend the time to make submissions only to see them go for naught. Guess submitting phrases for inclusion into the dictionary could also fall into the same trap. Still think it would be instructive to submit such phrases as the examples above to see what the reception would be. I understand the time limitations the "guardians of the Na'vi language" have, and maybe they would not be happy for increasing their workload, but I don't see any other path to achieving a unified approach.

[Yayo]

You don't need a PhD in Linguistics and since it's Anonymous, I don' feel understand you shouldn't feel obligated to submit words to the LEP if you have them. But hey, that's my opinion.

[Tìsrusewä Karyu]

Sorry, I do not have any Na'vi words ready for submission. Started writing a hunting story for the Na'vi writing contest last holiday season, and found it was impossible as the language is so limited. At that point, I decided to stop learning the language. My list has over a hundred American English words, mainly clothing, hunting, anatomical, geological, and hydrological terms, that the Na'vi would use on a daily basis. Recently, some clothing terms were released by Dr. Frommer, but there are many words still needed. Since then, been looking for a way to get the list out there. Need someone who knows the language and knows how to get submissions through the LEP to take the list and run with it.

[Ikran Ahiyìk]

You can simply submit the English word only without any proposed Na'vi word or explanation, that's called level 1 submission.
This will cause more work for Karyu and the committee to do, but there's at least something.
Maybe there are some words under your list and you are the only one who think of those words.

btw this "Dictionary of missing words" functions in reminding people which word/phrase/idea is useful and not yet proposed in LEP - my interpretation

[Yayo]

Couldn't we then just think of a new root and submit that? I feel that combinations should be purely temporary... 

['Oma Tirea]

Couldn't we then just think of a new root and submit that?

Part of the problem, though, is that the Na'vi aren't as advanced as the sawtute, so technical terms, for instance, are hard to come by....

[Yayo]

I remember hearing something... Idealists vs. Realists...

Those who are for and against the humanisation of the Na'vi language. I'm suggesting that we suggest a new root for everything, just what we feel necessary.

[Blue Elf]

That is correct. The purpose of this seems to be the establishment of 'new' words from a combination of already existing words. Perhaps you should refer to the LEP suggestions board, for your 'aerial walkways'.

EDIT: I agree that this shouldn't be a 'dictionary' per se, but a database for reference or loan words that will be used temporarily until a new root is suggested.

exactly - intention is create words, which we don't have yet by describing them using existing words to use it until word approved by PF comes.
It is good idea to incorporate them into main dictionary, I probably propose this when there will be enough words on the list. On the other hand, appendix F contains phrases approved by PF, so I'm afraid this proposal will be rejected. Also all depends on popularity of this "project" - if there will be no proposals, it falls into oblivion.

New word: birthday: trr tstxoä. I found this word while reading Game of Thrones, where term "day of the name" is used probably in meaning of "birthday", although is sounds more like "name-day" (not sure as I'm reading Czech translation, I didn't read original)