Online English to Na'vi translator

Started by kemptom, June 08, 2010, 02:50:27 PM

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kemptom

Hello!

I'm new here. When I saw Avatar, I was immediately interested in the Na'vi language.
I have studied it for a while (Wikipedia). I was curious if there was a real translator to translate English into Na'vi.
There is one on http://www.navilator.com , but it seems to translate the text word by word. The translation is grammatically incorrect.

e.g. It can translate "I See you" into "Oel ngati kameie" but it can't translate "You See me" correctly...

I decided to create one myself. You can see it on http://kemptomprojects.webs.com/navi

Please note that it's far from perfect, but i'm still improving it.

Kemptom


Muzer

I would have thought that making a decent English to Na'vi translator would be near impossible due to the difficulties of the English language. Na'vi to English, maybe so, because of how precise Na'vi is, but certainly not the other way around, I would have thought. So yeah, good luck, but I don't think you're going to manage to make it decent.
[21:42:56] <@Muzer> Apple products used to be good, if expensive
[21:42:59] <@Muzer> now they are just expensive

Tirea Aean

#2
I really dont like Navilator(YET...) I really like Tuiq's eana eltu : http://dvi.clonk2c.ch/translate_navi.pl that one requires a lot of work to your english input to get correct Na'vi output...but the one for Na'vi to english : http://dvi.clonk2c.ch/navi_translate.pl is very good. 90% accurate.

I FOR ONE LIKE TO ACTUALLY LEARN THE LANGUAGE...than rely on translators...so yeah...If you would like to learn the language, that would be cool! :D


I support aylì'uä fwewyu, which is an app for your computer which quickly searches the Taronyu dictionary for words. http://forum.learnnavi.org/your-projects-other-resources/learn-navi-desktop-dictionary/


So as far as translators go, I totally wish you the best of luck!! I will check out your take on a Na'vi-->eng trans...And would be more than happy to help you out.

kemptom

Quote from: Muzer on June 08, 2010, 02:57:47 PM
I would have thought that making a decent English to Na'vi translator would be near impossible due to the difficulties of the English language. Na'vi to English, maybe so, because of how precise Na'vi is, but certainly not the other way around, I would have thought. So yeah, good luck, but I don't think you're going to manage to make it decent.

It is indeed very difficult and I also think it's not possible to make it translate EVERY English sentence correctly. But I will try to make it as good as possible.
It can now recognize some basics of the English language, like translating different tenses (irregular verbs will be added soon).

Muzer

Constructive criticism coming - I'm not trying to pick holes, I'm trying to help you improve it, so don't take this the wrong way!

I just tried "I've got a friend who speaks Na'vi." and it didn't recognise "I've" or "got". I tried it with a simpler construction, I have a friend who speaks Na'vi, and it gave me:

Tupe oe 'eylan plltxe.


So, the errors:

* Completely missed out the word Na'vi for some reason - no idea why.
* Used the interrogative "tupe" instead of "a", which should be used as this is not a question.
* Completely deleted the word "have" instead of tranforming it into lu + dative
[21:42:56] <@Muzer> Apple products used to be good, if expensive
[21:42:59] <@Muzer> now they are just expensive

'eylan na'viyä

Quote from: Tirea Aean on June 08, 2010, 02:59:11 PM
I really dont like Navilator(YET...) I really like Tuiq's eana eltu : http://dvi.clonk2c.ch/translate_navi.pl that one requires a lot of work to your english input to get correct Na'vi output...but the one for Na'vi to english : http://dvi.clonk2c.ch/navi_translate.pl is very good. 90% accurate.
i thought tuiq disabled http://dvi.clonk2c.ch/translate_navi.pl because it was misused to translate complete sentences.
or am i doing something wrong ?, because i don't get an output.

Tirea Aean

Quote from: 'eylan na'viyä on June 08, 2010, 06:02:42 PM
Quote from: Tirea Aean on June 08, 2010, 02:59:11 PM
I really dont like Navilator(YET...) I really like Tuiq's eana eltu : http://dvi.clonk2c.ch/translate_navi.pl that one requires a lot of work to your english input to get correct Na'vi output...but the one for Na'vi to english : http://dvi.clonk2c.ch/navi_translate.pl is very good. 90% accurate.
i thought tuiq disabled http://dvi.clonk2c.ch/translate_navi.pl because it was misused to translate complete sentences.
or am i doing something wrong ?, because i don't get an output.


It is still there, and is disabled...I didnt realize this because I never use the eng-->nav one.

Tuiq

Only 90%? Feel free to share what is not detected. Also, translate_navi hasn't been touched for ages. It is not "disabled", it just does not work anymore the way the old translators did with the whole new Eana Eltu system. Since many people did not know how to use the tool properly, I won't create a new one.

Also, in my opinion, English => Na'vi or Na'vi => proper English is just a lot of (misspent) work. Grammar is one complex thing that I'm not going to touch. It's too much effort for too few results. Instead, I'm working on parsing Na'vi as well as possible. Which is, I'd say, more than 90% at the moment. It should know everything, except "irregular" verbs (kllsomething) and of course the proper nouns, which moved out of the dictionary some time ago - maybe they will be included again soon, I'm not sure. Searching for "and" or anything that matches "Pandora" / "Pandorean" was just spammed. But, I agree, at least the search engine should know what toruk-LENITED is.
Eana Eltu: PDF/TSV/jMemorize

Tirea Aean

#8
Quote from: Tuiq on June 09, 2010, 08:28:28 AM
Only 90%? Feel free to share what is not detected. Also, translate_navi hasn't been touched for ages. It is not "disabled", it just does not work anymore the way the old translators did with the whole new Eana Eltu system. Since many people did not know how to use the tool properly, I won't create a new one.

Also, in my opinion, English => Na'vi or Na'vi => proper English is just a lot of (misspent) work. Grammar is one complex thing that I'm not going to touch. It's too much effort for too few results. Instead, I'm working on parsing Na'vi as well as possible. Which is, I'd say, more than 90% at the moment. It should know everything, except "irregular" verbs (kllsomething) and of course the proper nouns, which moved out of the dictionary some time ago - maybe they will be included again soon, I'm not sure. Searching for "and" or anything that matches "Pandora" / "Pandorean" was just spammed. But, I agree, at least the search engine should know what toruk-LENITED is.

I must admit that it has been a while since I have used eana eltu navi_translate im sure it has seen much editing and improvement since I last used it...i may just go and try it out...and then edit my post.


I copy pasted Paul Frommer's earth day message(and replaced dashes with commas so it didnt get confused.) it did NOT catch/understand the following:

Fìtrrmì (fì-trr-mì) On this day
'Rrtayä <'Rrta-yä> this one slides cuz you said prop nouns arent in there
lì'ut (lì'u-t) word-ACC
tì'efumì (tì-'efu-mì) <tì'efumì oeyä=in my opinion> so tì'efumì=in opinion/feelinng
frato most <it thought it was forato <for-a-to>...bug message: Contradicted. Dative. Adjective attributed. Bug. Please report that AWAY hasn't been found.
lì'fya language
leNa'vi Na'vi-ADJ <as you know, lì'fya leNa'vi= Na'vi language>
fìlì'uä (fì-lì'u-ä) THIS-word-GEN
tìme'em harmony(general sense)
sa'nokä (sa'nok-ä) mother-GEN
'uo ('u-o) something
rey'eng the-balance-of-life
Eywa'evengmì (Eywa'eveng-mì) on-Pandora, but you said prop nouns arent in there, so this again slides, as does the next one:
'Rrtamì ('Rrta-mì)
lì'fyari (lì'fya-ri) language-TOP
awngeyä (ay-oe-ng-eyä--->awngeyä) we/us-GEN (our)
sivi (from tìkangkem sivi) sivi is an important one... I would try to have it recognize si verbs in the form of "noun si" instead of "noun" "si" if possible.
fmawno (fmawn-o) some news. does it know -o?(the suffix that means "some")
ye'rìn soon.
'ìyi'a ('<ìy>i'a = 'i'a + <ìy>) conclude/end-NEAR FUTURE
kllfro' be responsible
mawkrr (maw-krr) after-time
nì'ul more
aylì'ut words. does it know lì'u?
tsayfnesänumvit (tsa-ay-fne-sä-num(e)-vi-t) those-types-lessons-ACC
sivi (srung sivi) see above note.
prrte' pleasurable(talking about an activity, adj)
Eywa (but EVERYONE knows what this is <prop noun> so nbd.>

so there ya go...this is why I didnt say 100%. it is a VERY good trans. <easily the best out there.> keep up the good work and try to fix these if you have time. :D

Tuiq

Damned. I quoted everything and then, for some odd reason, I managed to delete the input field.

So, long story short:
- prepositions may be a bit old, I'm working on a system to create them automagically. (-types-, -o)
- mì placed at the end is pretty new - I thought it's either mì-word or word mì, seperated.
- sivi was not recognized as verb; fixed.
- AWAY is now there, fixed.
- What the hell is 'awng'
- Everything else is working. Many of the words you quoted are working, and I did not change anything. How did you get to think they're not?

Quote from: Tirea Aean on June 09, 2010, 12:30:06 PM
so there ya go...this is why I didnt say 100%. it is a VERY good trans. <easily the best out there.> keep up the good work and try to fix these if you have time. :D
There are others?
Eana Eltu: PDF/TSV/jMemorize

Lance R. Casey

Quote from: Tuiq on June 09, 2010, 02:23:48 PM
- mì placed at the end is pretty new - I thought it's either mì-word or word mì, seperated.

Precisely the other way around (and when placed before, like a handful of other words triggers lenition). This goes for all adpositions -- and .

// Lance R. Casey

Tuiq

Quote from: Lance R. Casey on June 09, 2010, 03:03:09 PM
Quote from: Tuiq on June 09, 2010, 02:23:48 PM
- mì placed at the end is pretty new - I thought it's either mì-word or word mì, seperated.

Precisely the other way around (and when placed before, like a handful of other words triggers lenition). This goes for all adpositions -- and .

Oh. It's fixed now, then.
Eana Eltu: PDF/TSV/jMemorize

Tirea Aean

lì'ut   Unable to translate.
tì'efumì   Unable to translate.
lì'fya   Unable to translate.
leNa'vi   Unable to translate
Fìlì'uä   Unable to translate.
tìme'em   Unable to translate.
Sa'nokä   Unable to translate.
'uo   Unable to translate.
rey'eng   Unable to translate.
lì'fyari   Unable to translate.
awngeyä   Unable to translate.
ye'rìn   Unable to translate.
'ìyi'a   Unable to translate.
kllfro'   Unable to translate.
mawkrr   Unable to translate.
nì'ul   Unable to translate.
aylì'ut    Unable to translate.
tsayfnesänumvit   Unable to translate.(I'll be lenient on this one: tsa-ay-fne-sä-num(e)-vi-t)

just pulled these off the screen. cp for the win.

as far as other nav-->eng, there are none. youre right. (as far as I know)

as for adpositions: they are separate before the noun, or attached to the end, as LRC said. mì word, wordmì. it causes lenition on word tho...sì is the same way: sì word or wordsì...that one doesnt cause lenition tho.




Tuiq

#13
Try to use ' instead of ´. ´ is an accent, ' is apostrophe. maw is undefined as of now (until the new preposition system). Also is -fne- unknown.

I'm not replacing ´ anymore with ', the database just knows '.
Eana Eltu: PDF/TSV/jMemorize

Tirea Aean

That explains a lot...haha Thanks...I personally use ' and not ` because I dont feel like typing ` its just that I cp the thing I typed in...let me try again..it should all work this time...

Prrton

Quote from: Tuiq on June 09, 2010, 02:23:48 PM

- What the hell is 'awng'


awnga (we plural inclusive (alternative to ayoeng))
awngeyä (GEN)
awngari (TOP)
awngaru/awngar (DAT)
awngal (ERG)
awngati/awngat (ACC)

'eylan na'viyä

Quote from: zivgik on June 08, 2010, 02:50:27 PM
Hello!

I'm new here. When I saw Avatar, I was immediately interested in the Na'vi language.
I have studied it for a while (Wikipedia). I was curious if there was a real translator to translate English into Na'vi.
There is one on http://www.navilator.com , but it seems to translate the text word by word. The translation is grammatically incorrect.

e.g. It can translate "I See you" into "Oel ngati kameie" but it can't translate "You See me" correctly...

I decided to create one myself. You can see it on http://kemptomprojects.webs.com/navi

Please note that it's far from perfect, but i'm still improving it.

Kemptom



the link isnt working, i get a 404

Tirea Aean


Tuiq

Quote from: Prrton on June 09, 2010, 08:56:28 PM
awnga (we plural inclusive (alternative to ayoeng))
awngeyä (GEN)
awngari (TOP)
awngaru/awngar (DAT)
awngal (ERG)
awngati/awngat (ACC)


Sounds like it would have the standard rules for a pronoun - if Taronyou would add awnga, it would work. I'd rather not add anything to his dictionary.
Eana Eltu: PDF/TSV/jMemorize