Negative temperatures?

Started by `Eylan Ayfalulukanä, January 14, 2013, 04:42:24 PM

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`Eylan Ayfalulukanä

Here is an interesting story to try and wrap your brain around...

(Grossly incorrect and malfunctioning link removed!)

Oops! The correct link is here! http://www.scientificcomputing.com/news-DS-Below-Absolute-Zero-011013.aspx?et_cid=3039287&et_rid=41422502&linkid=http%3a%2f%2fwww.scientificcomputing.com%2fnews-DS-Below-Absolute-Zero-011013.aspx

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Taronyu Leleioae

It went negative!   ;D

(Missing the URL there...)

Tìtstewan

 ???
Negative temperatures?
Hmm, ok in °C and °F no problem, but do not try to do this at K (Kelvin)... :o

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Vawmataw

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Vawmataw

Negative temperatures? This night, temperatures will be negative.  ;)

Interesting story XD. It went negative  ;D:
Quote from: `Eylan Ayfalulukanä on January 14, 2013, 04:42:24 PM
Here is an interesting story to try and wrap your brain around...

Quote from: archaic/url]
Fmawn Ta 'Rrta - News IN NA'VI ONLY (Discord)
Traducteur francophone de Kelutral.org, dict-navi et Reykunyu

Tìtstewan

Quote from: Kameyu a Kepekmì on January 14, 2013, 06:00:09 PM
Negative temperatures? This night, temperatures will be negative.  ;)

Interesting story XD. It went negative  ;D:
Quote from: `Eylan Ayfalulukanä on January 14, 2013, 04:42:24 PM
Here is an interesting story to try and wrap your brain around...

Quote from: archaic/url]
[/quote]
Negative URL, hah? ;D
And yes here the night have negative temperatures.

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Taronyu Leleioae

#6
Not sure what the article/quote is about..

But for some sort of reference... (going by memory mind you)

Liquid Nitrogen was at -321F / -196C / +77K
Liquid Oxygen was a little "warmer".  I want to say it was around +88 to +90K putting it at around -183C?

Liquid Nitrogen froze around -346F / -210C / +63K

And "how low can you go?".  Definition of 0 Kelvin was where the theoretical point at where all motion within the molecular atomic structure stopped.  It's also used as a comparison in astrophysics to try measure temperatures of "space".
-460F / -237C / 0K    (ignoring a decimal because I think it was something like -237.15C)


As far as I'm concerned, anything below -20C enters the "damned" cold range...

`Eylan Ayfalulukanä

Oops! That copy and paste didn't work! (I never bothered to check that link, as I was at the end of lunchtime. I'll fix that tomorrow  :'(

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Tìtstewan

Quote from: Taronyu Leleioae on January 14, 2013, 06:23:28 PM
Liquid Oxygen was a little "warmer".  I want to say it was around +88 to +90K putting it at around -183C?
Melting point    54.36 K, -218.79 °C, -361.82 °F
Boiling point    90.20 K, -182.95 °C, -297.31 °F
:)

The lowest measured natural temperature on Earth: −89.2 °C (−128.6 °F). Brrrrr....

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`Eylan Ayfalulukanä


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Tìtstewan

Nice article. If I understand this article correct, they don't reach a temperature under 0K. Only that the temperatures can get a negative values, that is meaninng a 'higher' temperature - a maximum tem. that an atom can absorb like a peak of a hill of a energy landscape.

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`Eylan Ayfalulukanä

I think that sums up what they are trying to say. In any case, one of the more bizaarre science news posts I have seen of late...

If you want to learn a little more about 'uphill/downhill' effects, look up how a thermocouple operates. That is som e very interesting physics!

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Tìtstewan

Quote from: `Eylan Ayfalulukanä on January 17, 2013, 12:49:08 AM
I think that sums up what they are trying to say. In any case, one of the more bizaarre science news posts I have seen of late...
I have worked as lab assistant for a while, so I know some physics rules and so on and I heared some interesting physic facts and that article is one of the most bizarre what I ever read. :o ;D

Quote from: `Eylan Ayfalulukanä on January 17, 2013, 12:49:08 AM
If you want to learn a little more about 'uphill/downhill' effects, look up how a thermocouple operates. That is som e very interesting physics!
Irayo for this info. :)

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Clarke

I happen to know that a large negative temperature (e.g. -10,000K) is colder than a smaller negative temperature, e.g. -0.1K, both of which are hotter than any possible positive temperature.

Thermodynamics is complicated, let's go shopping?  :P

Tìtstewan

Quote from: Clarke on January 18, 2013, 10:59:32 AM
I happen to know that a large negative temperature (e.g. -10,000K) is colder than a smaller negative temperature, e.g. -0.1K, both of which are hotter than any possible positive temperature.

Thermodynamics is complicated, let's go shopping?  :P
Well, I have readed this article 5 times and I searched for a German version (and readed it 2 times :o) to understand this logic.  :o oO

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`Eylan Ayfalulukanä

Its intersting that even knowledgable people can sometimes get 'tripped up' on some crazy theory.

I recently read about a laboratory where they were making very sensitive brainwave measurements. This lab was located 5 floors underground, in a structure that used steel beams. I am assuming then, it had metal floor deck pans as well.

Amplifiers for these kinds of sensitive signals are usually of a special design, called an 'insturmentation amplifier', and are designed to amplify the typically very small signal of interest, and ignore everything else. In any case, they started seeing a burst of interference that was happening about every 5 seconds or so. The source of the noise was traced to a radar system a couple of miles away. How a microwave signal got 5 floors underground, through concrete and steel, remains a mystery. But the engineer troubleshooting this had a bizarre theory.

He believed that the interference was being caused by 'scalar electromagnetic radiation', a supposedly uncommon kind of electromagnetic radiation where 'the electric and magnetic field are in phase'. This came from a knowledgeable and experienced engineer. The problem here is that 'scalar RF radiation' is a concept often talked about in 'fringe science'. You find references to it in articles about things like wireless power transmission. The closest real thing to 'scalar RF' might be the separate electric and magnetic fields found in the vicinity of an antenna. In any case, a couple miles away from the microwave source is hardly the 'near field' ('near field' at microwave frequencies is at best, a few inches). And real electromagnetic fields have their electric and magnetic fields in phase with each other at all times.

The mysterious interference stopped after the engineer talked to the radar operator. This is also strange as in 'what is the government not telling us'? ;)

In any case, don't believe everything you hear, even if it comes from a distinguished scientist. They can be wrong, too. Very wrong!

Yawey ngahu!
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