North America and Europe may see a much worse winter than last year

[Tsanten Eywa 'eveng]

The ice caps are melting, and it is doing it rapidly. It has melted much more this year, than last year, and meteorologists fear the worse to happen.

The yellow line shows average distribution for the period 1979-2000. The small picture, shows the chaotic winter in USA, Chicago 2nd of february 2011




Arctic sea ice is shrinking at a rate much faster than scientists ever predicted and its collapse, due to global warming, may well cause extreme weather this winter in North America and Europe, according to climate scientists.

Last month, researchers announced that Arctic sea ice had dwindled to the smallest size ever observed by man, covering almost half the area it did 30 years ago, when satellites and submarines first began measuring it. While the loss of summer sea ice is likely to open up new shipping lanes and may connect the West Coast of the United States to the Far East via a trans-polar route, researchers say it will also affect weather patterns and Arctic wildlife. "It's probably going to be a very interesting winter," climate scientist Jennifer Francis said Wednesday in a teleconference with reporters. Francis, a researcher at the Institute of Marine and Coastal Sciences at Rutgers University, has argued that shrinking Arctic ice can be tied to such recent weather events as prolonged cold spells in Europe, heavy snows in the Northeastern U.S. and Alaska, and heat waves in Russia.

Read more at: http://phys.org/news/2012-09-loss-arctic-ice-trigger-extreme.html#jCp

[Kekerusey]

But the oil companies say global warming is a myth!!! 

Keke

[Tsanten Eywa 'eveng]

But the oil companies say global warming is a myth!!! 

Keke

Then, they were wrong, it's not a myth. It actually really happens. it currently is happening, and it's getting worse

[Lance R. Casey]

Myth? Worse, it's a conspiracy!

[Kekerusey]

Then, they were wrong, it's not a myth. It actually really happens. it currently is happening, and it's getting worse

Tsanten, Lance ... I was being facetious guys (that's why I used the "shocked" expression)

I'm fully aware the oil companies only real motivation is money and if that screws the environment well tough #%&£! I daresay most businesses are much the same.

Keke

[Taronyu Leleioae]

Myth? Worse, it's a conspiracy!

Don't get me started because I agree with this in so many ways.  Perhaps the worst of it is that the govt, through agreements, does not have the oil companies in the US pay income/capital gains taxes.  That's right, zip.  Oddly, they always say they pay more than any other sector, but wait...  ExxonMobil made $19 billion in profits in 2009. Exxon not only paid no federal income taxes, it actually received a $156 million rebate from the IRS, according to its SEC filings.   So which is it?

I suspect the reasoning at the time was to have the govt pay less (which I doubt considering the overpriced everything else they buy).  Now the argument is that the oil companies will simply raise the price which will cause another economic collapse with higher transportation and heating costs.  Oh wait, they did and they made the greatest profits on record ever.  So why wouldn't they deny all the environmental claims?  RDA nearly at its worst only behind surface/pit mining...

Dis-like the whole oil establishment even though I depend upon them for my transportation...

[`Eylan Ayfalulukanä]

There is little argument that global warming is actually happening.

The argument is, how much of it is man-caused?

And keep this in mind: It is not the oil companies ultimately causing the pollution. It is the end users of their products.

[Tsanten Eywa 'eveng]

When we talking about climate changes, I can talk what is now happening on Venus and Mars


Climate on Earth this year has been very weird, some places very cold, some places extreme heat, like in USA, and northern Europe unusual cold summer. The planet Venus are experiencing that a layer in it's atmosphere is so cold that carbon dioxide can freeze and form into ice and snow, colder than any layer in Earth's atmosphere. Then the third planet, Mars. Curiosity rover experiencing unusual hot temperature at the Gale Crater, up to 6 degrees celsius, even that it is not spring there yet

I blame this that it might be the Sun who is behind all this. Cause climate changes at the same time, at the 3 inner planets, doesn't sound quite right. So I blame the Sun


And I am right on this. I have a very high IQ, I think I have a very high IQ

[`Eylan Ayfalulukanä]

It has been known for some time, from heating on other planets, that the output of the sun is increasing. Believe it or not, the direct output of the sun is hard to measure. It is easier to measure the effect of the output. And I believe that this the cause of most (but not all) of global warming.

Another interesting thing is that the antartic ice cap appears to be expanding.

Overall, it shows how little we really know about this planet we call home.

as far as a conspiracy among scientists, there are direct measures to show such a conspiracy exists among some scientists. People want to be in control. One way to do this is by feigning a huge problem that will result in negative lifestyle changes for most people. For some reason, they get a 'kick' or a 'high' from doing this. There is another case where some scientists faked evidence of Canadian lynx living in an area just to get it closed to human activity.

There is evil on both sides of this issue, and none of this evil is acceptable.

[Kekerusey]

as far as a conspiracy among scientists, there are direct measures to show such a conspiracy exists among some scientists. People want to be in control. One way to do this is by feigning a huge problem that will result in negative lifestyle changes for most people. For some reason, they get a 'kick' or a 'high' from doing this. There is another case where some scientists faked evidence of Canadian lynx living in an area just to get it closed to human activity.

Sorry mate but you're wrong ... there is no scientist conspiracy. A few groups have been over-zealous but broadly speaking the scientists are just ordinary, if somewhat smarter than average, Joes and the evidence they have uncovered indicates global warming is happening and we (Our activities here) are one of the major causes of it.

Keke

[`Eylan Ayfalulukanä]

The emails of the scientists 'adjusting' the data in Europe were exposed a couple of years back. The scientists faking the lynx evidence were convicted. The conspiracy might not be vast, but it is very real.

[Lance R. Casey]

The emails of the scientists 'adjusting' the data in Europe were exposed a couple of years back. The scientists faking the lynx evidence were convicted. The conspiracy might not be vast, but it is very real.

I don't know anything about those lynxes, but the so-called "climategate" was most certainly not a conspiracy, and that people still try to promote this outright lie is nothing short of pathetic.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Climatic_Research_Unit_email_controversy#Inquiries_and_reports
http://www.cce-review.org/index.php (http://www.cce-review.org/pdf/FINAL%20REPORT.pdf)
http://www.uea.ac.uk/mac/comm/media/press/CRUstatements/SAP
http://www.research.psu.edu/orp/documents/Findings_Mann_Inquiry.pdf , http://live.psu.edu/pdf/Final_Investigation_Report.pdf

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/8618024.stm#id8620000/8620200/8620253-audio
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-essex-10899538
http://www.nature.com/news/2010/100707/full/news.2010.335.html
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/03/31/science/earth/31climate.html?_r=0
http://articles.cnn.com/2010-07-07/world/climategate.email.review_1_real-temps-edward-acton-intergovernmental-panel
http://www.foxnews.com/scitech/2010/07/07/british-panel-clears-climategate-scientists-bias/
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2011-08-22/climate-change-scientist-cleared-in-u-s-data-altering-inquiry.html
http://www.deccanherald.com/content/61233/uk-climategate-inquiry-largely-clears.html
http://news.sciencemag.org/scienceinsider/2010/04/oxburgh-report-clears-controvers.html
http://www.cbc.ca/news/technology/story/2011/02/24/science-climategate-noaa.html

http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/2010/jul/07/climate-emails-question-answer
http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/2010/feb/09/climategate-bogus-sceptics-lies
http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v462/n7273/full/462545a.html
http://www.nature.com/nature/journal/v468/n7322/full/468345a.html
http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,1946935,00.html
http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/badastronomy/2011/08/24/case-closed-climategate-was-manufactured/

6. Climate Change -- Those hacked e-mails

[Kekerusey]

The emails of the scientists 'adjusting' the data in Europe were exposed a couple of years back. The scientists faking the lynx evidence were convicted. The conspiracy might not be vast, but it is very real.

No it isn't ... one group of scientists whose data was claimed to be flawed (by what appears to be an extremely biased group with their own agenda) does not constitute a "conspiracy". However the so-called "conspiracy" appeared to be far more that of biased & selective data used by the hackers that stole it from the university in question and, indeed, an independent review of "the scandal" pretty much exonerated the research group in every way.

A friend of mine bought me a book on conspiracy theories for Christmas thinking I'd like that sort of thing ... I didn't! I'm well used to reading high quality popular science books and this was, perhaps the worst example of truly muddy commentating on such things that I have ever had the displeasure to read  ... frankly, those that want to believe these kind of things are actually "conspiracies" should really wake up and smell the coffee. I strongly suspect that most (if not all) conspiracy theories) are truly, deeply flawed ideas and if they happen to hit on something with a grain of truth in it, it's more by chance than by any form of rational research of their own.

Keke

[`Eylan Ayfalulukanä]

Here's something interesting, germane to this topic:

http://www.scientificcomputing.com/news-DS-Fraud-Growing-in-Scientific-Research-Papers-100912.aspx?et_cid=2889057&et_rid=41422502&linkid=http%3a%2f%2fwww.scientificcomputing.com%2fnews-DS-Fraud-Growing-in-Scientific-Research-Papers-100912.aspx