Writing a letter, need a proofreader.

[Rain]

Might someone want to check my grammar?

"Oel Ngati Kameie, ma lemeuia Karyu, ulte ngaru seiyi Irayo fpi tìngopit lì'fiyayä leNa'vi. Oe zene tsap'alute si, fpi Oeyä Na'vi lu ke nìtxan siltsan. Oe kayä mì nìInglisi."

I would very much like this to be as correct as possible, but I don't want to sound like a smartass either. This is the only part of the letter that will be entirely in Na'vi. I'll even take alternative phrasing suggestions.

Ayngaru seiyi Irayo
Rain

[Tirea Aean]

Might someone want to check my grammar?

"Oel Ngati Kameie, ma lemeuia Karyu, ulte ngaru seiyi Irayo fpi tìngopit lì'fiyayä leNa'vi. Oe zene tsap'alute si, fpi Oeyä Na'vi lu ke nìtxan siltsan. Oe kayä mì nìInglisi."

I would very much like this to be as correct as possible, but I don't want to sound like a smartass either. This is the only part of the letter that will be entirely in Na'vi. I'll even take alternative phrasing suggestions.

Ayngaru seiyi Irayo
Rain

are you really writing to Frommer?

my take:

"Oel Ngati Kameie, ma nawma Karyu. Lì'fyari leNa'vi oe ngaru seiyi Irayo. Oe zene tsap'alute sivi, taluna ke tsun oe pivlltxe fu pamrel sivi fa lì'fya leNa'vi nìtxan nìltsan. Oe pamrel sìyi nìInglisi."

[Rain]

Yes, actually. And thank you so much for your input! Your suggestion sounds so much prettier than my clumsy verbatim translation.

[Tirea Aean]

sweetness. I can't wait to see his reply to whatever you ask him.

[kewnya txamew'itan]

Might someone want to check my grammar?

"Oel Ngati Kameie, ma lemeuia Karyu, ulte ngaru seiyi Irayo fpi tìngopit lì'fiyayä leNa'vi. Oe zene tsap'alute si, fpi Oeyä Na'vi lu ke nìtxan siltsan. Oe kayä mì nìInglisi."

I would very much like this to be as correct as possible, but I don't want to sound like a smartass either. This is the only part of the letter that will be entirely in Na'vi. I'll even take alternative phrasing suggestions.

Ayngaru seiyi Irayo
Rain

are you really writing to Frommer?

my take:

"Oel Ngati Kameie, ma nawma Karyu. Lì'fyari leNa'vi oe ngaru seiyi Irayo. Oe zene tsap'alute sivi, taluna ke tsun oe pivlltxe fu pamrel sivi fa lì'fya leNa'vi nìtxan nìltsan. Oe pamrel sìyi nì'ìnglìsì."

This looks almost perfect, a couple of the oes can be dropped though as oe has been established as the subject, I've put them in strikethrough. Also you spelt nì'ìnglìsì wrong. 

[Tirea Aean]

Might someone want to check my grammar?

"Oel Ngati Kameie, ma lemeuia Karyu, ulte ngaru seiyi Irayo fpi tìngopit lì'fiyayä leNa'vi. Oe zene tsap'alute si, fpi Oeyä Na'vi lu ke nìtxan siltsan. Oe kayä mì nìInglisi."

I would very much like this to be as correct as possible, but I don't want to sound like a smartass either. This is the only part of the letter that will be entirely in Na'vi. I'll even take alternative phrasing suggestions.

Ayngaru seiyi Irayo
Rain

are you really writing to Frommer?

my take:

"Oel Ngati Kameie, ma nawma Karyu. Lì'fyari leNa'vi oe ngaru seiyi Irayo. Oe zene tsap'alute sivi, taluna ke tsun oe pivlltxe fu pamrel sivi fa lì'fya leNa'vi nìtxan nìltsan. Oe pamrel sìyi nì'ìnglìsì."

This looks almost perfect, a couple of the oes can be dropped though as oe has been established as the subject, I've put them in strikethrough. Also you spelt nì'ìnglìsì wrong. 

oh. I just copied her post and edited parts of it. I didn't catch the nì'Ìnglìsì thing. I am well aware of the correct spelling. XD hmmmm that's a lot if pro-drop...I see how that is possible. I was thinking formal but not Too formal bit not casual with this one, as it's headed K Pawl's way...pro-drop sounds like a casual chat style to me. I pro-drop when casually chatting...I never considered doing it in a situation like this...interesting.

[kewnya txamew'itan]

Dropping the oes is stylistic, I was just showing that almost all of them weren't necessary, leaving them in is by no means wrong; that said it isn't necessarily a sign of informality, in Spanish for example which is also pro-drop (although that's because verbs inflect for the subject) it might be considered rude not to drop the subject as that is more forceful, it's like putting extra emphasis on the subject which would probably get you odd looks in English and possibly be taken as rude, na'vi might not work that way, but it might not be like English's emerging pro-drop-ness. As for nì'ìnglìsì, I only recently realised there was a glottal stop in it so I've been spelling it wrong for ages, as long as it's roughly right I doubt Frommer will mind, if he queries it, Rain can say that's how po pronounces English. 

[Tirea Aean]

I see where you're comin from. makes sense...no way to know. leave or take ke tstanten a fì'u lam oer. XD

[Kì'eyawn]

Kaltxì, ma Rain.  I have nothing to add to what leNa'via meronsem atxantslusam nì'ul have already said; but i just wanted to tell you that the first time i sent Karyu Pawl a message (don't know if this is your first), i was so nervous.  But i didn't need to be, he was really nice. 

The one thing i might add, depending on how much Na'vi you decide to put in your message (i started in Na'vi, switched to English for the "meat," and then back to Na'vi for niceties), was i added a little line asking him to let me know if i made any mistakes—and it ended up that was where i did make a mistake!  So, for your benefit, the corrected version of what i said, straight from the Karyu's mouth:

Txo oeyä aylì'umì keyey livu, fayuti peng oeru, rutxe.

Enjoy talking to Karyu Pawl, and be sure to share any linguistic tidbits you get =)

[Tirea Aean]

I like that...That is similar to what I would have said:

Txo rivun ngal keyeyit aylì'umì oeyä, rutxe oeru fayuti piveng.

[kewnya txamew'itan]

Txo oeyä aylì'umì keyey livu, fayuti peng oeru, rutxe.

Enjoy talking to Karyu Pawl, and be sure to share any linguistic tidbits you get =)

Will do.

It's interesting that lu is used not tok, possibly if position is not a specific place but is done adpositionally you'd use lu not tok. I'd assumed you'd use tok but this seems to say otherwise.

[Tirea Aean]

Tok is seeming more and more like a useless verb...it might as well go away in the near future.

[kewnya txamew'itan]

Tok is seeming more and more like a useless verb...it might as well go away in the near future.

Yeah, given -ro- it seems that all uses of tok can be replaced with lu and an adposition so:

oel fìtsengit tok = oe fìtsengero lu

Of course there's probably a slight distinction that we don't know yet but even if there is tok does seem pretty useless now.

[Kì'eyawn]

My guess, ma kemeoauniaea, is that tok is only used in spatial relationships.  Imagine a Na'vi saying this sentence, then (since they don't write).  It wouldn't make sense to me to use tok to describe a sound among other sounds.  Speaking of which, i can see now that kip- might have been a better choice of adposition than mì+—but since Karyu Pawl didn't change it, i suppose it works.

[kewnya txamew'itan]

My guess, ma kemeoauniaea, is that tok is only used in spatial relationships.  Imagine a Na'vi saying this sentence, then (since they don't write).  It wouldn't make sense to me to use tok to describe a sound among other sounds.  Speaking of which, i can see now that kip- might have been a better choice of adposition than mì+—but since Karyu Pawl didn't change it, i suppose it works.

I guess so, maybe then lu would be used for metaphorical use of adpositions like here and tok for literal ones. That seems to rather defeat the point of the metaphor but is certainly possible.

kip would seem a bit more appropriate, when did you send this email, did we have kip- then?

[Kì'eyawn]

My guess, ma kemeoauniaea, is that tok is only used in spatial relationships.  Imagine a Na'vi saying this sentence, then (since they don't write).  It wouldn't make sense to me to use tok to describe a sound among other sounds.  Speaking of which, i can see now that kip- might have been a better choice of adposition than mì+—but since Karyu Pawl didn't change it, i suppose it works.

I guess so, maybe then lu would be used for metaphorical use of adpositions like here and tok for literal ones. That seems to rather defeat the point of the metaphor but is certainly possible.

kip would seem a bit more appropriate, when did you send this email, did we have kip- then?

I got his reply to my e-mail on 16 May.  So yeah, i'm pretty sure we had kip- at that point. Mì+ seems to be a catch-all adposition.  My guess is either would have been acceptable, but technically kip- is more precise.  Kinda like in English.

[kewnya txamew'itan]

My guess, ma kemeoauniaea, is that tok is only used in spatial relationships.  Imagine a Na'vi saying this sentence, then (since they don't write).  It wouldn't make sense to me to use tok to describe a sound among other sounds.  Speaking of which, i can see now that kip- might have been a better choice of adposition than mì+—but since Karyu Pawl didn't change it, i suppose it works.

I guess so, maybe then lu would be used for metaphorical use of adpositions like here and tok for literal ones. That seems to rather defeat the point of the metaphor but is certainly possible.

kip would seem a bit more appropriate, when did you send this email, did we have kip- then?

I got his reply to my e-mail on 16 May.  So yeah, i'm pretty sure we had kip- at that point. Mì+ seems to be a catch-all adposition.  My guess is either would have been acceptable, but technically kip- is more precise.  Kinda like in English.

Seems a reasonable assumption.

[Tirea Aean]

Tok is seeming more and more like a useless verb...it might as well go away in the near future.

Yeah, given -ro- it seems that all uses of tok can be replaced with lu and an adposition so:

oel fìtsengit tok = oe fìtsengero lu

Of course there's probably a slight distinction that we don't know yet but even if there is tok does seem pretty useless now.

According to Omängum Fra'uti, Paul said not to use -ro+ with lu, because that would totally obliterate the point of tok...i am guessing the whole tok vs lu +adp thing has not been 100% decided yet. hmmm.

[kewnya txamew'itan]

Tok is seeming more and more like a useless verb...it might as well go away in the near future.

Yeah, given -ro- it seems that all uses of tok can be replaced with lu and an adposition so:

oel fìtsengit tok = oe fìtsengero lu

Of course there's probably a slight distinction that we don't know yet but even if there is tok does seem pretty useless now.

According to Omängum Fra'uti, Paul said not to use -ro+ with lu, because that would totally obliterate the point of tok...i am guessing the whole tok vs lu +adp thing has not been 100% decided yet. hmmm.

Yay! At least some use remains for it! 

And I'll be interested to see where the boundary lies.

[Kayrìlien]

Tok is seeming more and more like a useless verb...it might as well go away in the near future.

Yeah, given -ro- it seems that all uses of tok can be replaced with lu and an adposition so:

oel fìtsengit tok = oe fìtsengero lu

Of course there's probably a slight distinction that we don't know yet but even if there is tok does seem pretty useless now.

According to Omängum Fra'uti, Paul said not to use -ro+ with lu, because that would totally obliterate the point of tok...i am guessing the whole tok vs lu +adp thing has not been 100% decided yet. hmmm.

Yay! At least some use remains for it! 

And I'll be interested to see where the boundary lies.

I get the feeling there's some comparison that could be made here with Spanish ser and estar. Both verbs are forms of what we in English would say is "to be", but each is used for a different purpose. Like, ser is used to indicate characteristics such as size and color, whereas estar is used both for location (like tok) and temporary conditions, such as indicating health.

Na'vi appears to have three different verbs for these purposes; lu is used for the first case, tok for location, and 'efu for feelings. Meh, obviously the comparison is not exact, but it seems like this sort of thing is what Karyu Pawl is probably trying to sort out. (Or perhaps he already has and we're just not in the know as of yet.)

@ Rainan: Just curious, but what is it you're asking Dr. Frommer about? Is it something that we've been wondering about as a community for a long time now, or something totally different? Either way, it's awesome that you're emailing him!

Kayrìlien