Help me, please?

Started by rileyh406, July 03, 2013, 07:44:16 PM

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rileyh406

Okay, so I am working my tail of on Memrise.com to get a lot of the vocabulary for the Na'vi language down. I just mastered the Octal system for numbers as well. But my biggest challenge is that I have no idea where to even begin on putting sentences together.

Just an example sentence: "I am living". I know that
I = rey
Am = ma

&
live = rey

So would this become "Oe ma rey"? Or am I getting this whole thing off?

Another example sentence that I don't understand so well is this:
"The tree is green."

I know that
tree = utral
&
green = riekan

So would this become "Lu utral rieken."?

If someone could please just compile a little something that is very basic (because I honestly don't know where to put verbs and adjectives and pronouns  ;) ) with the difference between different tenses that would be wonderful. Thank you!!!

Alyara Arati

Good try!  And you almost have "the tree is green" correct!  There's a typo... green = rìkean, not riekan

Lu = am or is, so Lu utral rìkean means the tree is green.  We have free word order, so you don't have to say Utral lu rìkean.

With your first sentence:

I = oe
live = rey

I live = Oe rey.

For "am living", though, we don't use lu rey.  For that we have a verb "tense" that is the infix <er>.  You put the infix inside the verb, right before the vowel, so:

I am living = Oe r<er>ey = Oe rerey.

Does this help? :)
Learn how to see.  Realize that everything connects to everything else.
~ Leonardo da Vinci

rileyh406

That helped a lot! I did know, however, that the 'i' in rìkean what supposed to be a 'ì', and I just now found the button to do it!

The second part is still a little hazy, but I am sure with a lot more research it will come around.

Thanks again.


rileyh406

QuoteFor that we have a verb "tense" that is the infix <er>

So the <er> is what you insert into the middle, more or less, for something that is currently happening?


So 'I am eating' would become 'Oe yerom' ? because I=Oe and eat=yom. Or do I have that concept misunderstood.

And if I am thinking correctly that means 'I eat' would become 'Oe yom'.

Alyara Arati

Exactly!  Well done! :D

By the way, ma = O, as in "O my father..." or something else where you are addressing someone. :)
Learn how to see.  Realize that everything connects to everything else.
~ Leonardo da Vinci

Ezy Ryder

<er> doesn't exactly mean that something is happening right now. It means that the aspect of the verb is imperfective.

Blue Elf

#6
Quote from: rileyh406 on July 03, 2013, 08:27:26 PM
QuoteFor that we have a verb "tense" that is the infix <er>

So the <er> is what you insert into the middle, more or less, for something that is currently happening?
In general, infixes you put into last or last but one syllable, in front of vowel:
y<0><1><2>om
t<0><1>ar<2>on
etc. There are some exceptions, but infix position can be found in dictionary
<0> replaces with <äp>/<eyk>
<1> with aspect/time infixes + subjunctive (iv), like or/ol/ay/am and their combination
<2> is for ats/äng/ei/uy
Oe lu skxawng skxakep. Slä oe nerume mi.
"Oe tasyätxaw ulte koren za'u oehu" (Limonádový Joe)


Tìtstewan

Mllte oe hu Blue Elf.

Quote from: Blue Elf on July 04, 2013, 03:23:53 AM
In general, infixes you put into last or last but one syllable, in front of vowel:
y<0><1><2>?m
--> y<0><1><2>om ;)
pamrel s<0><1><2>i

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Blue Elf

Oe lu skxawng skxakep. Slä oe nerume mi.
"Oe tasyätxaw ulte koren za'u oehu" (Limonádový Joe)


Taronyu Leleioae

#9
Quote from: Blue Elf on July 04, 2013, 03:23:53 AM

t<0><1>ar<02>on
etc. There are some exceptions, but infix position can be found in dictionary
<0> replaces with <äp>/<eyk>
<1> with aspect/time infixes + subjunctive (iv), like or/ol/ay/am and their combination
<2> is for ats/äng/ei/uy

I will add here as rileyh406 may or may not be familiar with infix positioning and what they represent/mean.  As a quick overview and generalized explanation, the <0> infixes are essentially manipulation.  Either something you do to yourself, or something that is forced on something else.  <1> are all the time (past, present, future) infixes, aspect (done, still happening), subjunctive (might (future), might have (past)), and of course combinations of these.  <2> is for mood or opinion (intention or belief, unhappy, happy, honourific).

The infixes for verbs can be applied and stacked together (one of each type only!) to give more meaning on the verb you are describing.  And, as you can see from above examples, there is a specific order of which infix goes where.  Most importantly, if there are two or more vowels in a word (always about the vowels!), then the <0><1> go in front of the second to last vowel.  Hence for taron (to hunt), you have the infix structure t<0><1>ar<2>on.

There are some exceptions or unique verbs (such as compound verbs) that the dictionary will have information on, regarding infix placement (ii notation) and special use.  But they are fairly rare and you will learn to identify them as you progress.  (Example:  yomtìng)


There are a few nice resources for you to reference which can help.


Easy Guide to Navi Prefixes Infixes and Suffixes II

Na'vi Infix Chart

Na'vi in a Nutshell
(This last one discusses verbs in Chapter 5.  Just fyi that this guide is a bit out of date and is just beginning to be undergoing a revision proposal for hopefully a Spring/Summer 2014 release.)

Yawne Zize’ite

Quote from: Ezy Ryder on July 04, 2013, 03:13:29 AM
<er> doesn't exactly mean that something is happening right now. It means that the aspect of the verb is imperfective.
Perfective vs. imperfective is tricky for native English speakers like myself, because it's not a distinction English makes consistently. If you've studied Spanish, it is the distinction between the preterit and the imperfect, but Naʼvi can make that distinction in all tenses.

The basic idea is that perfective is for an event seen as a whole, while imperfective is for an event seen as ongoing. Perfective correlates with English simple past and perfects (have X'ed), and imperfective correlates with English progressives (is X'ing), but they're not exactly the same. Naʼvi doesn't have something exactly like the English perfect (a past action with present consequences). However, Naʼvi lets you use the "prophetic perfect" of the Hebrew Bible (verbs in the perfective form with future reference to indicate something that will certainly happen), like Isaiah 5:13 "Therefore my people will go into exile..." which I would translate into Naʼvi using the future perfective halyum.

I'm sure an expert could give a better explanation, though.

Taronyu Leleioae

#11
Quote from: rileyh406 on July 03, 2013, 08:27:26 PM
QuoteFor that we have a verb "tense" that is the infix <er>

So the <er> is what you insert into the middle, more or less, for something that is currently happening?

So 'I am eating' would become 'Oe yerom' ? because I=Oe and eat=yom. Or do I have that concept misunderstood.

And if I am thinking correctly that means 'I eat' would become 'Oe yom'.

I think an easier way to understand this without complex linguistic terms could be:

Oe yom.  = I (verb) = I eat.

Oe y<er>om.  = I (verb-ing) = I (am) eating.  >  In english, we add the word "am".  Because this is a continuing action, this would be called the imperfective case.  Simply, it's not time specific.  It's "aspect".

Oe y<ol>om.  = I (have verb-ed).  I have eaten.  This is the perfective case.  It means it's happened.  Over and done with.  But, again, it's not time specific.  Might have been a few minutes ago.  Could be days ago.  We only have a beginning and end to what happened.

Oe y<am>om.  = I (verb-ed).  I ate.  (Because in english we do not say "I eat-ed" with this verb.  This is time oriented.  IE... tense.


Compound invixes (combining tense and aspect) are complex.  In normal speech, you will use them less.  But they are important to recognize as you become more comfortable with using infixes, and how to translate them.