Some Christians see Avatar as "demonic"

[Vawm tsamsiyu]

Ah the tin foil hats strike again
At least he's not as bad as the first two guys

[Duma Vadamee {Aungia Tsawkeyä}]

yes but Lucifer? really?? what is going through these peoples heads??

[Nusumea Tirea]

Looking for enlightment? 

[Maria TunVrrtep]

These people are just absolutely crazy. 

The first one is trying to say that Avatar is Demon Worship.

This idiot is trying to suggest that there is some conspiracy to create a world religion?  For the sake of any God, how could they do that?  There is no evidence that anyone is trying to do that.  He says Al Gore said they want to create this worldwide Gaia religion, but I have never heard anything of the sort, and I would have because I'm Wiccan.  It's a ridiculous statement. 

You know, I swear I may run for office just to show the voters what having someone who actually tells the truth in office is like!

[Dreamlight]

Good luck on surviving.  The Chr*st**ns would phucquing lynch you.

[Eyamsiyu]

What's funny about this whole thing is that I've heard of pastors giving sermons that actually use the message in Avatar to promote Christianity as well.  These guys just get more attention because they are being negative and accusative.

Just goes to show two things: the outspoken and negative will always get more media attention, and that ANYTHING can be interpreted many different ways, especially in the realm of arts.

I'm actually VERY surprised at how far this thread has gone without any sort of flaming.  And that's a good thing it hasn't: it shows that we can, at the very least, tolerate each other, and I believe most of us are of the same mindset here anyway.

As for the "creation of new religions," it's nothing new that people are accusing others of such: my old youth pastor accused Oprah of starting a religion all of her own.

[Nusumea Tirea]

I think they are afraid. Very afraid and unsure in themself.
The need their fixed framework, something to give them hold, to protect them, to tell them what to do, to hide behind. Everything what threatens that "Wall" is to be avoided at all costs or must be destroyed in order to be safe.
Imagine what happens to such a person when he sees Avatar and suddenly get's strange emotions which normally aren't there. Well, it has to be from somwhere and it can't be explained. So it has to be demonic and evil and has to be destroyed for protection.

I fell sorry for them, so blocked, so... blind to see.  

[Eyamsiyu]

Why is it that when I read the first part of your post, ma Nusumea Tirea, that I thought about the dialogue from Dark Knight where the Joker talks about how he ruins the "schemer's plans" to show that it is futile?

Anyway...

[Dreamlight]

What's funny about this whole thing is that I've heard of pastors giving sermons that actually use the message in Avatar to promote Christianity as well.  These guys just get more attention because they are being negative and accusative.

Just goes to show two things: the outspoken and negative will always get more media attention, and that ANYTHING can be interpreted many different ways, especially in the realm of arts.

Frankly, it is only grudgingly that I tolerate Christians.  They need to prove by their actions that they are not the majority type, in every way, before they earn my trust.

I'm actually VERY surprised at how far this thread has gone without any sort of flaming.  And that's a good thing it hasn't: it shows that we can, at the very least, tolerate each other, and I believe most of us are of the same mindset here anyway.

As for the "creation of new religions," it's nothing new that people are accusing others of such: my old youth pastor accused Oprah of starting a religion all of her own.

Hardly a decade, if that, passes without a new religion being founded in this age.  People just can't deal with that.

Christianity is on the decline, as adherents nowadays come to realize the blatant hypocrisy of the religion, and it is none too soon for the world.

[Maria TunVrrtep]

Frankly, it is only grudgingly that I tolerate Christians.  They need to prove by their actions that they are not the majority type, in every way, before they earn my trust.

Hardly a decade, if that, passes without a new religion being founded in this age.  People just can't deal with that.

Christianity is on the decline, as adherents nowadays come to realize the blatant hypocrisy of the religion, and it is none too soon for the world.

I'm not too sure I totally agree with that Dreamlight.  I am a Wiccan of the Strega tradition.  My coven is Irish Celtic tradition.  I have many friends who are Christian.  They are totally accepting of my views and, in fact, have participated in ceremonies that I have officiated at.  I flew up to Philadelphia from my home in Houston, to perform a Handfasting (the couple was already married legally, since I couldn't do a legal marriage in Pennsylvania) and then again to perform a funeral.  I was quite thrilled that my VERY Christian friend wanted to be at the Handfasting.  The funeral, I flew in, went to the hospital, and the man was still alive.  Within an hour he was gone, after a very moving impromptu ceremony that I performed in order to help him to cross over.  He was still fighting, I think more so he knew that his wife was going to have the support that she needed than anything else.  When he knew I was there, he was ready, but by then he lacked the strength to let go.  He was laying there in the bed, his best friend on one side of him, his wife on the other, both holding his hands, and the rest of us were all gathered around.  The best friend was holding his fiances' hand, I took hers on my left, then my best friends on my right, she took that VERY Christian friend's hand on her right and then the Christian friend took the wife's hand.  I felt the energy flowing and started a chant that gave us something to focus on and the energy just kept flowing.  It was an absolutely beautiful experience to help someone to pass through the veil.  I continued to chant until I could feel the energy starting to waiver, then released it to him.  And he took it and used it to pass.  It was an incredible experience. 
At the funeral two days later, the wife asked me to say a few words at the graveside.  Since he was in the "broom closet" as we put it, we had told her mother that he followed an eclectic, more personal faith and did not have a pastor.  Since I was the closest thing to a Priestess that they had, I felt it my responsibility to ask my friend if she wanted me to say something at the graveside.  I was very eclectically Christian about it, using the words Holy Father instead of Great Mother, saying "accept him into your presence and allow his soul to travel through the planes of existence."  It was actually quite beautiful.  I truly believe that the words were sent to me by the Goddess and she knew that I was just using different words to say what I wanted to say. 
My point here is that Christianity and Paganism can live side by side in total harmony, as long as they respect each other.  The problem comes in when you have narrow-minded idiots like these few preachers, who think they know what is best for everyone. 
I believe in the TRUTH.  I put that in all caps for a reason.  There is only one TRUTH.  Each different religion sees a different path to the TRUTH.  I look at the subject of religion as a many faceted jewel.  Each religion looks through one facet to see the TRUTH that is in the center of the jewel.  And if you want to look at another facet, why not?  There's no reason you can't.  And it gives you a different perspective on the TRUTH that you may not have seen before.
ta TunVrrtep

[Dreamlight]

Your story is quite beautiful and, well, maybe a few more heretics like your friend might make a difference eventually, but so far it is too little even if it is not too late.  Part and parcel of the Christian religion is to refuse to look through other aspects of the jewel.

[Tsyal Maktoyu]

Wow, that was amazing, TunVrrtep. Now THAT is what religion should be about!   Not people slashing each others throats because they don't see eye to eye.

You earned a karma.

[Maria TunVrrtep]

Wow, that was amazing, TunVrrtep. Now THAT is what religion should be about!   Not people slashing each others throats because they don't see eye to eye.

You earned a karma.

Irayo.  I have many stories like that.  That was just the most recent. 

I come from an extremely magical family, even though they were all Roman Catholic.  They all knew they had gifts, and believed them to be gifts from God.  My great grandfather healed his daughter when she had Pneumonia way back in the 1920's.  Way before Penicillin.  He just prayed over he and she got better.  My grandfather woke up from a coma on his death bed to tell me to always trust my instincts.  And the doctors didn't believe me when I told them he woke up. 

I have been an empath since I was in grade school.  I started early.  Most don't discover their gifts until puberty.  It was hard to be a young girl who knew that the kids were teasing me, not because they didn't like me, but because they didn't understand me.  And knowing that I tried to explain to them and they were even more uncomfortable.  It was really difficult growing up.  So I have a lot of stories like this. 

I have been Wiccan for going on 5 years now.  I went to my teacher because I was getting to a point where I couldn't control the empathy anymore.  I was getting these feelings that were coming from outside of myself and couldn't control them anymore.  And I didn't want them to control me.  So I went to my friend who was Wiccan and asked her to teach me to control the empathy.  She did and she also taught me some simple stuff to kind of spur my interest.  When I understood what I was, I went all in (as the saying goes).  I'm now a First Degree Priestess, getting ready to take my Second Degree Vows.  (I can't say any more than that, because of the secrecy involved.) 

I am saddens that SOME Christians seem to have this idea that anything that isn't precisely what they teach is wrong.  I am drawn to the mystical, however, mystical doesn't mean evil.  In my religion, there is no Devil.  That is a Christian concept. 

Personally, I think my religion thinks better of others than most Christian religions do.  I won't say Christian people, because I don't honestly believe that the average Christian person would think anything was wrong with my views, until they heard the words Wicca, Witchcraft or Magic.  The leaders of the churches are the ones who are narrow minded.  And I can't even say that all of them are like that.  In High School, I had a teacher in Religion class (I went to a Catholic High School) who was a nun.  she was VERY interested in the mystical and understood that I was Strega.  She knew that I was an empath.  She knew that I saw spirits.  She knew that I could communicate with the other side.  And yet she was not afraid of me, nor did she condemn me for a witch.  Instead she tried to teach me that what I had was a gift from the Divine and that it was nothing to be afraid of. 

Again, thanks for the kind words. 

ta TunVrrtep

[Dreamlight]

until they heard the words Wicca, Witchcraft or Magic. 

Exactly.

[Eyamsiyu]

until they heard the words Wicca, Witchcraft or Magic.

And honestly, the only reason why there may be any sort of dislike for that is because of my upbringing, which I grudgingly hate sometimes...

My personal view on things is that I don't care what the actual "label" of your religion as long as you are good to others, which I try to do everyday.  If I hurt someone, it is never intentional, and when I know I hurt them, I immediately feel like ****.

[Maria TunVrrtep]

Exactly.

LOL I knew you'd agree with me Dreamlight.

And honestly, the only reason why there may be any sort of dislike for that is because of my upbringing, which I grudgingly hate sometimes...

My personal view on things is that I don't care what the actual "label" of your religion as long as you are good to others, which I try to do everyday.  If I hurt someone, it is never intentional, and when I know I hurt them, I immediately feel like ****.

Eyamsiyu, I've seen people who said they were not narrow minded suddenly turn their backs on me when they found out I was Wiccan.  You haven't done that.  I would never accuse you of that. 

My feeling is if you are happy with your faith, who am I to judge.  But I expect the same treatment.  I have already seen that same treatment from you.  You do not seem like the type who would suddenly turn away.  You have already proved that you understand my point of view by agreeing with me several times.  I thank you for that.  My life is a lot more peaceful without having to defend my religious views all the time. 

Your story is quite beautiful and, well, maybe a few more heretics like your friend might make a difference eventually, but so far it is too little even if it is not too late.  Part and parcel of the Christian religion is to refuse to look through other aspects of the jewel.

I can't say that I totally disagree with you on this Dreamlight.  Unfortunately many Christians try to convert us without really understanding that we believe in the same things they do.  They don't understand.  However, their ignorance is part and parcel of the ridiculous idea that Pagans are inherently evil because they worship more than one God.  The fact that they do not understand that all the Gods are One is the reason they don't understand us.  I'm not sure how long you have been Pagan (I am assuming you are some sort of Pagan because of your responses to me) but I can tell you from my years of study, combined with my years of being an empath and not knowing what it meant and my age, it will change.  You can see the change coming already.  England has recognized Druidry as an official religion.  The US is not too far behind.  We already can have a Pentacle on gravestones in the Military graveyards.  It's not far off.  When it happens, people will start researching the pagan religions and realize that we are just like them.  We just see different faces of the Gods for different reasons.  Just like the Roman Catholics have the patron saints of everything, they will realize that we simply use a different name for a different reason. 

My pantheon has Jesus, Mary and Yahweh (or whatever you want to call God in the Christian faiths) included.  My patron god is Ganesh.  My patron Goddess is Hestia.  Talk about a really eclectic pantheon - Hindu, Roman and Christian included. 

ta TunVrrtep

[Eanikran]

see my post on religion here.

[Maria TunVrrtep]

see my post on religion here.

Ok.  Now I want a Peanut Butter and Jelly sandwich.   

dangit.

[Dreamlight]

Your story is quite beautiful and, well, maybe a few more heretics like your friend might make a difference eventually, but so far it is too little even if it is not too late.  Part and parcel of the Christian religion is to refuse to look through other aspects of the jewel.

I can't say that I totally disagree with you on this Dreamlight.  Unfortunately many Christians try to convert us without really understanding that we believe in the same things they do.  They don't understand.  However, their ignorance is part and parcel of the ridiculous idea that Pagans are inherently evil because they worship more than one God.  The fact that they do not understand that all the Gods are One is the reason they don't understand us.  I'm not sure how long you have been Pagan (I am assuming you are some sort of Pagan because of your responses to me) but I can tell you from my years of study, combined with my years of being an empath and not knowing what it meant and my age, it will change.  You can see the change coming already.  England has recognized Druidry as an official religion.  The US is not too far behind.  We already can have a Pentacle on gravestones in the Military graveyards.  It's not far off.  When it happens, people will start researching the pagan religions and realize that we are just like them.  We just see different faces of the Gods for different reasons.  Just like the Roman Catholics have the patron saints of everything, they will realize that we simply use a different name for a different reason. 

My pantheon has Jesus, Mary and Yahweh (or whatever you want to call God in the Christian faiths) included.  My patron god is Ganesh.  My patron Goddess is Hestia.  Talk about a really eclectic pantheon - Hindu, Roman and Christian included. 

ta TunVrrtep

Yes, and we had to fight tooth, nail and claw for that.

Also, in retrospect, if these Christians were a millionth as open as the story might imply, there would have been no need on your part to couch your spirituality or his in half-hearted syncretism, as there would have been no need for a broom closet in the first place.

[Maria TunVrrtep]

Yes, and we had to fight tooth, nail and claw for that.

Also, in retrospect, if these Christians were a millionth as open as the story might imply, there would have been no need on your part to couch your spirituality or his in half-hearted syncretism, as there would have been no need for a broom closet in the first place.

Oh I didn't say they were ALL open, I said one of them was open.  The rest of them were just as narrow-minded as most Roman Catholics are the second you mention magic or Wicca. 

I don't go around advertising the fact that I'm Wiccan, but I also don't lie about it.  If someone recognizes the symbols I wear, I don't lie.  However, I do LOVE living in Texas.  Most people think my pentacle is a Texas Star pendant.     Quite useful state symbol.