Author Topic: my pronoun tables  (Read 1212 times)

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Offline leke

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my pronoun tables
« on: October 26, 2011, 05:46:36 am »
My pronoun tables. Can someone check them?
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/228727/language/navi_tables.pdf
 :-*

Offline Tirea Aean

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Re: my pronoun tables
« Reply #1 on: October 26, 2011, 08:18:22 am »
You've mixed up inclusive and exclusive across the board. INCLUSIVE is INCLUDING the person being spoken to (nga) which mean that the INclusive forms have ng in them. the EXclusive forms are the opposite. they do not have the ng in it from nga.

For possessive, it should be

SingularDualTrialPlural
peyämefeyäpxefeyäayfeyä / feyä

sneyä is sort of in the same category as peyä. sneyä meaning his/her own, and peyä means his/her [speaking about another, different person].

and again for the "possessive pronouns" replace sneyä with peyä and then ayfeyä/feyä

pum sneyä means "his/her own [one] / his/hers"

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Offline Seze Mune

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Re: my pronoun tables
« Reply #2 on: October 26, 2011, 08:49:17 am »
Wou, that's interesting!  I didn't even know there was a sneyä!

Offline Ikran Ahiyìk

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Re: my pronoun tables
« Reply #3 on: October 26, 2011, 11:50:50 am »
sneyä shouldn't in that position...

both po and sno are 3rd person, where sno particularly represents a mentioned person,
something like

     Pol sneyä tskoti tatep.   He lose his own bow.   ~ the two "he" is the same person
     Pol peyä tskoti tatep.   He lose his ("her" maybe) bow.   ~ different persons involved
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Offline leke

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Re: my pronoun tables
« Reply #4 on: October 26, 2011, 04:05:02 pm »
Thanks. A little tricky, but I think I get it :D
So, I guess the third person in the two possessive tables needs an inclusive/exclusive split?
Like...
3rd per. inclusive = owners.
3rd per. exclusive = belonging to somebody else.

Offline Blue Elf

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Re: my pronoun tables
« Reply #5 on: October 27, 2011, 04:47:10 pm »
No - inclusion/exclusion occurs only in first person. Sno is something like reflexive form of po, always refers to single person:
Pol 'olem peyä wutsot - he cooked his (someone else's) meal
Pol 'olem sneyä wutsot - he cooked his own meal
Oe lu skxawng skxakep. Slä oe nerume mi.
"Oe tasyätxaw ulte koren za'u oehu" (Limonádový Joe)


Offline Seze Mune

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Re: my pronoun tables
« Reply #6 on: October 27, 2011, 08:42:16 pm »
Irayo for the clarification, ma Blue Elf.  It helped me as well.   ;)

Offline 'Oma Tirea

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Re: my pronoun tables
« Reply #7 on: October 28, 2011, 12:35:18 am »
Also, don't forget about fko and fkeyä, the indefinite pronoun ;)

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Offline leke

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Re: my pronoun tables
« Reply #8 on: October 31, 2011, 05:07:43 am »
No - inclusion/exclusion occurs only in first person. Sno is something like reflexive form of po, always refers to single person:
Pol 'olem peyä wutsot - he cooked his (someone else's) meal
Pol 'olem sneyä wutsot - he cooked his own meal
So the reflexive form of po is like a reflexive pronoun?
Pol 'olem sneyä wutsot -- He cooked himself a meal.

...and how about...
Ayfol 'olem sneyä wutsot -- They cooked themselves a meal.

Thanks.

Offline Blue Elf

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Re: my pronoun tables
« Reply #9 on: October 31, 2011, 09:29:56 am »
Something like, but not literally (well, my English is probably not fully correct):
Pol 'olem sneyä wutsot -- He cooked a meal for himself.
Ayfol 'olem sneyä wutsot -- They cooked a meal for themselves.

In common:
Po X peyä Y => He do X on someone's Y (not his own)
Po X sneyä Y => He do X on his own Y
Oe lu skxawng skxakep. Slä oe nerume mi.
"Oe tasyätxaw ulte koren za'u oehu" (Limonádový Joe)


Offline Carborundum

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Re: my pronoun tables
« Reply #10 on: October 31, 2011, 10:13:38 am »
Does sneyä not have plural forms? I can't recall.
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Offline Blue Elf

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Re: my pronoun tables
« Reply #11 on: October 31, 2011, 03:13:52 pm »
It has singular only, AFAIK
Oe lu skxawng skxakep. Slä oe nerume mi.
"Oe tasyätxaw ulte koren za'u oehu" (Limonádový Joe)


Offline leke

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Re: my pronoun tables
« Reply #12 on: November 01, 2011, 02:25:00 am »
Also, don't forget about fko and fkeyä, the indefinite pronoun ;)
Care to give an example :P

Thanks.

Offline leke

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Re: my pronoun tables
« Reply #13 on: November 01, 2011, 02:34:28 am »
Does sneyä not have plural forms? I can't recall.
From Na'vi in a Nutshell...
Quote
Language Note #3.11: The possessive pronoun sneyä is used only (for now at least)
with the third person singular and plural to mean his/her/their own.

Offline Blue Elf

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Re: my pronoun tables
« Reply #14 on: November 01, 2011, 02:41:01 am »
Horen leNa'vi:
Quote
3.2.2.8. The reflexive pronoun sno is not altered for number.
See also 3.2.2 - it lists singular only
Oe lu skxawng skxakep. Slä oe nerume mi.
"Oe tasyätxaw ulte koren za'u oehu" (Limonádový Joe)


Offline 'Oma Tirea

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Re: my pronoun tables
« Reply #15 on: November 02, 2011, 12:57:38 am »
Also, don't forget about fko and fkeyä, the indefinite pronoun ;)
Care to give an example :P

Thanks.

It functions like any other singular pronoun:

Fko sì fkeyä tukru zene frakrr txur livu.

It could be oe, nga, or po.

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Offline Blue Elf

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Re: my pronoun tables
« Reply #16 on: November 02, 2011, 01:27:48 am »
... or also indefinite subject:

Fko plltxe san Tìyawnìl 'ärìp ayramit sìk
Oe lu skxawng skxakep. Slä oe nerume mi.
"Oe tasyätxaw ulte koren za'u oehu" (Limonádový Joe)


Offline Tirea Aean

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Re: my pronoun tables
« Reply #17 on: November 03, 2011, 08:34:00 am »
AFAIK, generally, fko is used to translate something written in the passive voice. Otherwise, it has major overlap with 'awpo, which is a word that NObody seems to use for some reason.

EDIT: Here is the Pronoun table as seen in Horen Lì'fyayä leNa'vi:



« Last Edit: November 03, 2011, 08:48:43 am by Tirea Aean »

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