Pronouns

[Kemaweyan]

Inclusive «we» means «I + you». Exclusive - it's «I + he» (without you).

[Seze Mune]

Inclusive «we» means «I + you». Exclusive - it's «I + he» (without you).

Srane!  Maybe one way to remember it is that inclusive includes you in.

[Kemaweyan]

Also: «you» - it's to whom you speak.

[Ftiafpi]

Crazy necropost but as long as people are learning. Inclusive is exactly what it sounds like, it includes people.

[WameuiaAnn]

Im sorry I didnt mean to sound so stupid ... I major in space not in grammer  ... I just didnt know what inclusive was  ...

[Ftiafpi]

Im sorry I didnt mean to sound so stupid ... I major in space not in grammer  ... I just didnt know what inclusive was  ...

Oh, not saying that nga lu skxawng. I came off the wrong way entirely, there's nothing wrong with your question. I was simply pointing out that this topic was created over two years ago . Aside from that, ask all the questions you like. The easier the question the simpler it is to answer so don't be afraid to ask anything that you like. In learning a language there really isn't a dumb question. I'm sure I've asked my fair share of them myself.

[Seze Mune]

Imho, it's nice to have these topics occasionally floated to the surface as a refresher, OR as a gold ingot of information which might attract other newbies' attention.

So, at the risk of ticking off some of the mods, I say, "Lìng tsa'ut var!"

[Blue Elf]

Imho, it's nice to have these topics occasionally floated to the surface as a refresher, OR as a gold ingot of information which might attract other newbies' attention.

So, at the risk of ticking off some of the mods, I say, "Lìng tsa'ut var!"

Well, it really is not correct, ngaytxoa ma Seze Mune. Try "Var leykivìng tsat" (lit: continue to cause it to hover)

[Seze Mune]

Imho, it's nice to have these topics occasionally floated to the surface as a refresher, OR as a gold ingot of information which might attract other newbies' attention.

So, at the risk of ticking off some of the mods, I say, "Lìng tsa'ut var!"

Well, it really is not correct, ngaytxoa ma Seze Mune. Try "Var leykivìng tsat" (lit: continue to cause it to hover)

Ma Blue Elf, I was depending on you to correct me.  Irayo seiyi for that!  Tafral tìng oel ngaru tìmeyamit.  

Oh, and that brings us back to pronouns because I need to understand nìwotx the nuances of tsat versus futa, etc. Is there a thread for that?  I didn't find one.  

[Blue Elf]

Well, it really is not correct, ngaytxoa ma Seze Mune. Try "Var leykivìng tsat" (lit: continue to cause it to hover)

Ma Blue Elf, I was depending on you to correct me.  Irayo seiyi for that!  Tafral tìng oel ngaru sämyamittìmeyamit.  

Oh, and that brings us back to pronouns because I need to understand nìwotx the nuances of tsat versus futa, etc. Is there a thread for that?  I didn't find one.  

Sunu oeru xD If you can't find such thread, simply create it (how simple, dear Watson...)

[Yawne Zize’ite]

Imho, it's nice to have these topics occasionally floated to the surface as a refresher, OR as a gold ingot of information which might attract other newbies' attention.

So, at the risk of ticking off some of the mods, I say, "Lìng tsa'ut var!"

Well, it really is not correct, ngaytxoa ma Seze Mune. Try "Var leykivìng tsat" (lit: continue to cause it to hover)

Ma Blue Elf, I was depending on you to correct me.  Irayo seiyi for that!  Tafral tìng oel ngaru tìmeyamit.  

Oh, and that brings us back to pronouns because I need to understand nìwotx the nuances of tsat versus futa, etc. Is there a thread for that?  I didn't find one.  

Ma Seze Mune, what got me my current tenuous grasp on those pronouns was understanding that futa is a contraction derived from fìʼu-t a, "this thing (patientive) that...." If you've studied Japanese, you learned how you can turn an entire sentence into a noun with no and koto, right? It took me a while to pick up that Naʼvi does the same thing, but backwards, and it also builds the case inflection into the fu- series of pronouns. The closest English word to the series is "that", but it means "that" in the sense of "I know that this isn't intuitive to an English speaker" (futa) or "That someone tried to teach his son Klingon is interesting but scary." (fwa or furia)

Wandering further off topic, if you're a native speaker of English the -eyk- infix will be difficult. Most languages have verbs with fixed "transitivity"; that is, a verb must have only a subject, or it must have a subject and an object, or it must have a subject and two objects. English is unusual in allowing many verbs to either take only a subject (intransitive), or take a subject and an object (transitive). A good example is "I walk" versus "I walk the dog". The second could be expressed as "I cause the dog to walk", which is why this form is called "causative". In Naʼvi, you would express this by using -eyk-. Oe tìran, but oe-l t<eyk>ìran nantang-it. A rough rule of thumb is that (except for si-verbs) if you see a verb marked as intransitive in the dictionary but you really want to use a word marked with -(i)t(i) with it, you should make the verb causative with -eyk-.

As I've mentioned before, I have an analytical mind and this sort of analysis helps me greatly; please ignore it if it doesn't help you.

[Blue Elf]

Ma Seze Mune, what got me my current tenuous grasp on those pronouns was understanding that futa is a contraction derived from fìʼu-t a, "this thing (patientive) that...." If you've studied Japanese, you learned how you can turn an entire sentence into a noun with no and koto, right? It took me a while to pick up that Naʼvi does the same thing, but backwards, and it also builds the case inflection into the fu- series of pronouns. The closest English word to the series is "that", but it means "that" in the sense of "I know that this isn't intuitive to an English speaker" (futa) or "That someone tried to teach his son Klingon is interesting but scary." (fwa or furia)

To be exact: Fwa/futa/furia are all based on fì'u - this (thing) + added case ending according position in sentence. But rough meaning is "that", lit. "this thing which is ..." These words refer to something near.
To express something distant, you use words based on tsa'u - that (thing) with tsawa/tsata/tsaria derivations, lit. "that thing which is..."

[WameuiaAnn]

I really just cant learn this way, by reading it all the time  ... I need to hear how its pronounced and hear how its said  ... I play an musical instrament and if anyone else plays and learns by hearing what is played, they can understand how I need to actually hear it spoken  . But  if I dont have anyone who can actually give lessons insted of this rossetta stone fake and trying to learn it myself is near impossible-- I dont know how Im going to excell in this language  ... Im losing faith in learning and I need help  ... I just dont know what to do ...
   Eywa send someone to help me please...

[Seze Mune]

Well, it really is not correct, ngaytxoa ma Seze Mune. Try "Var leykivìng tsat" (lit: continue to cause it to hover)

Ma Blue Elf, I was depending on you to correct me.  Irayo seiyi for that!  Tafral tìng oel ngaru sämyamittìmeyamit.  

Oh, and that brings us back to pronouns because I need to understand nìwotx the nuances of tsat versus futa, etc. Is there a thread for that?  I didn't find one.  

Sunu oeru xD If you can't find such thread, simply create it (how simple, dear Watson...)

Irayo, ma Sherlock Blue Elf! 

[`Eylan Ayfalulukanä]

I really just cant learn this way, by reading it all the time  ... I need to hear how its pronounced and hear how its said  ... I play an musical instrament and if anyone else plays and learns by hearing what is played, they can understand how I need to actually hear it spoken  . But  if I dont have anyone who can actually give lessons insted of this rossetta stone fake and trying to learn it myself is near impossible-- I dont know how Im going to excell in this language  ... Im losing faith in learning and I need help  ... I just dont know what to do ...
   Eywa send someone to help me please...

If there is any way for you to attend AvatarMeet next month, please consider doing so. There will be plenty of people to talk Na'vi with there, and Paul Frommer himself will be giving lessons. Besides this, there is skype and teamspeak chats with other Na'vi speakers.

Don't feel alone. Learning a new language, even a constructed language, is not a trivial task. I have been working on this for 2 1/2 years, and there is still much to learn. right now, I am taking a little break from the grammar/syntax stuff and concentrating on getting word pronunciation and stress right. This is tougher without a speaking partner, but you can learn much by listening to Paul Frommer and other good speakers. the dictionary also has stress marked on every word (and the stress pattern is generally unpredictable, it needs to be remembered word-for-word). I am also working on a tool that I will have out shortly, to help learning pronunciation and stress.

But regardless, you don't have to rush headlong into learning Na'vi. Take your time and enjoy the process. The language will be there for you to use and enjoy for the rest of your life!

[WameuiaAnn]

I really just cant learn this way, by reading it all the time  ... I need to hear how its pronounced and hear how its said  ... I play an musical instrament and if anyone else plays and learns by hearing what is played, they can understand how I need to actually hear it spoken  . But  if I dont have anyone who can actually give lessons insted of this rossetta stone fake and trying to learn it myself is near impossible-- I dont know how Im going to excell in this language  ... Im losing faith in learning and I need help  ... I just dont know what to do ...
   Eywa send someone to help me please...

If there is any way for you to attend AvatarMeet next month, please consider doing so. There will be plenty of people to talk Na'vi with there, and Paul Frommer himself will be giving lessons. Besides this, there is skype and teamspeak chats with other Na'vi speakers.

Don't feel alone. Learning a new language, even a constructed language, is not a trivial task. I have been working on this for 2 1/2 years, and there is still much to learn. right now, I am taking a little break from the grammar/syntax stuff and concentrating on getting word pronunciation and stress right. This is tougher without a speaking partner, but you can learn much by listening to Paul Frommer and other good speakers. the dictionary also has stress marked on every word (and the stress pattern is generally unpredictable, it needs to be remembered word-for-word). I am also working on a tool that I will have out shortly, to help learning pronunciation and stress.

But regardless, you don't have to rush headlong into learning Na'vi. Take your time and enjoy the process. The language will be there for you to use and enjoy for the rest of your life!

I completely agree, I have even made a couple of test power-points that highlights the body and was wondering if there was anyway to post it here for others to use? It also comes with audio clips from one of the members from this very forum... I however cant remember who that is  ... Or I could send it to you to check out first if you dont mind the extra work, Im sure you have plenty of others that you need to help with the language... I just want to do as much as I can to feel like Ive done my share...

[WameuiaAnn]

The AVATAR Meet that your refering to, it isnt the one in Washington State right  ?

[`Eylan Ayfalulukanä]

That is indeed the AvatarMeet I am referring to.

If you want me to look at your Powerpoint, you can email it to the email address below my signature, or the one in my profile.

[WameuiaAnn]

That is indeed the AvatarMeet I am referring to.

If you want me to look at your Powerpoint, you can email it to the email address below my signature, or the one in my profile.

Unfortunately I cant appear for the AVATAR Meet  ... Which I wanted soooo much to I assure you, but I live completely across the united states, and just learned of it within the last few weeks . I dont have the funds  to attend  ... Why on earth do they not just have a Na'vi scholarship  ! Also about my powerpoint, it is not on the computer that Im currently typing on, and if you dont mind you will recieve it as early as possible tomorrow, in your e-mail!

[Seze Mune]

Try this to start, it's something I heard about yesterday:

Tree of Voices

and this:

Na'vi Word of the Day