Author Topic: Help from Polyglots  (Read 1451 times)

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Offline wm.annis

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Help from Polyglots
« on: March 02, 2010, 11:22:33 pm »
Frommer is anxious that Na'vi not simply relexicalize English.

If you have the skills to translate his letter into one of the other forum languages, it would be a great service if you did so, and pointed people to this sub-forum.  The submissions don't have to be in English, though some comments in English might help some of the editors.
« Last Edit: March 04, 2010, 01:50:33 pm by Prrton »
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Offline 'itan Na'rìngyä

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Re: Help from Polyglots
« Reply #1 on: March 03, 2010, 12:09:49 am »
I like the Portuguese saudade, which has its own Wikipedia article, possibly because it's often used as an example of a word that doesn't exist in English. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saudade -- a mix of feelings related to the insatiable longing for someone or something that has passed to return... mixed with the knowledge that it cannot happen, but loving them nonetheless. Perhaps with a "fatalist tone."

From a Metafilter discussion: "A more or less melancholy sense of incompleteness, linked to the memory of situations in which one is deprived of the presence of someone or something, or of being far away from some place and thing, or of the absence of certain prior life experiences or pleasures, which the affected person deems desirable." -- http://www.metafilter.com/24976/Are-You-Ready-To-Be-Hearbroken



Some thoughts from http://ask.metafilter.com/10490/What-concepts-do-not-exist-in-the-English-language... not knowing these languages myself, I'll leave some simple ideas here and perhaps others can expand.

* Samoan mana... "in Samoan, I got a picture of a vector of quasi-social, quasi-mystical energy, behind which is sum of a person's social relationships with others"

* "There are heaps of Korean ideas which can only clumsily be expressed in English - kibeun, han, chemyeon, neunchi, bunuiki, and jeong,"

* "Both French and German can distinguish between knowledge that results from recognition (respectively connaître and kennen) and knowledge that results from understanding (savoir and wissen)."

* Finnish sisu http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sisu

* The opposite of "to want"... not as in "I don't want" but instead more like "diswanting" or wanting the opposite of something. The metafilter conversation mentioned that this might be the difference between "nolo" and "volo" in Latin.

* New Guinean mokita - truth that everyone's thinking or knowing, but no one will say it. http://blather.newdream.net/m/mokita.html

* Danish hyggelig / German gemuetlich -- warm/cozy/fuzzy/content

* Schadenfreude comes to mind, since what's-his-name takes pleasure in Jake's seemingly imminent demise when trying to score an ikran.

* Swedish lagom, which apparently is nigh impossible to explain in English. Along the lines of "enough" when used in this sentence: "Enough is as good as a feast." Almost like "perfectly and satisfyingly sufficient, but not too much, and that's a good thing."

* French se démmerder, literally "to unsh*t yourself", to improvise your way out of a tight spot

* Jante Law (Norwegian/Danish Janteloven), which I think I get, but I also think I may be confused about. Look it up and decide for yourself. Depending on the correct understanding, this may be a very appropriate word for the Na'vi people.


Offline Prrton

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Re: Help from Polyglots
« Reply #2 on: March 03, 2010, 12:11:09 am »
Frommer is anxious that Na'vi not simply relexicalize English.

If you have the skills to translate his letter into one of the other forum languages, it would be a great service if you did so, and pointed people to this sub-forum.  The submissions don't have to be in English, though some comments in English might help some of the editors.

YES! SÍ OUI JA はい 对 ᎥᎥ

This is very important. Sebastian is going to add a note to the main announcement too.

PLEASE help translate. Everyone is welcome!

Offline Diegetes

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Re: Help from Polyglots
« Reply #3 on: March 03, 2010, 02:33:47 am »
Quote
Quote
Frommer is anxious that Na'vi not simply relexicalize English.

If you have the skills to translate his letter into one of the other forum languages, it would be a great service if you did so, and pointed people to this sub-forum.  The submissions don't have to be in English, though some comments in English might help some of the editors.

YES! SÍ OUI JA はい 对 ᎥᎥ

This is very important. Sebastian is going to add a note to the main announcement too.

PLEASE help translate. Everyone is welcome!

I'll try to make a Polish version of the letter today. Great and helpful initiative
Lamu oeru unil a leiu Na'vi oe. Ke Tsetay. Ke new oe Tsetay livängu ta set.

Offline Na'rìghawnu

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Re: Help from Polyglots
« Reply #4 on: March 03, 2010, 02:44:21 am »
I'll do the German version.

Edit: Done and posted.
« Last Edit: March 03, 2010, 04:18:34 am by Na'rìghawnu »

Offline Skyinou

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Re: Help from Polyglots
« Reply #5 on: March 03, 2010, 04:48:38 am »
I'll do the french part.
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Offline Tawtakuk

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Re: Help from Polyglots
« Reply #6 on: March 03, 2010, 06:58:52 am »
Czech version - done and posted.
01000011 01011010 00100000 01001101 01101111 01100100 01100101 01110010 01100001 01110100 01101111 01110010 00000000

Offline Nyx

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Re: Help from Polyglots
« Reply #7 on: March 03, 2010, 07:54:14 am »
* Swedish lagom, which apparently is nigh impossible to explain in English. Along the lines of "enough" when used in this sentence: "Enough is as good as a feast." Almost like "perfectly and satisfyingly sufficient, but not too much, and that's a good thing."

I like all your suggestions, some even made me laugh. Like this one. I was just thinking I should post something. Anyway, let me just add this example: If someone asks you how much food you want, you can answer "lagom" and even though they'll complain with a loud sigh, they will know exactly how much you want.

Offline wm.annis

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Re: Help from Polyglots
« Reply #8 on: March 03, 2010, 07:57:06 am »
Aynga nìwotx ralpeng a fì'uri ayngar irayo seiyi oe!
'Awa lì'fya ke tam kawkrr.
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Offline Lance R. Casey

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Re: Help from Polyglots
« Reply #9 on: March 03, 2010, 01:36:53 pm »
* Swedish lagom, which apparently is nigh impossible to explain in English. Along the lines of "enough" when used in this sentence: "Enough is as good as a feast." Almost like "perfectly and satisfyingly sufficient, but not too much, and that's a good thing."
I had a feeling this would come up. Etymologically it harkens back to the old dative plural of "lag" ("law"), and can be construed in the basic sense as "properly". It's also a common misconception (especially among Swedes) that this word (or at least its meaning) is unique to Swedish and the Swedish mindset, which is demonstrably wrong, even though it does not exist in English specifically.

* Jante Law (Norwegian/Danish Janteloven), which I think I get, but I also think I may be confused about. Look it up and decide for yourself. Depending on the correct understanding, this may be a very appropriate word for the Na'vi people.
And "Jantelagen" in Swedish. It's a list of "rules", which can be boiled down thus: Don't think you're better than anyone else -- and don't try to be better either.

If you have the skills to translate his letter into one of the other forum languages, it would be a great service if you did so, and pointed people to this sub-forum.  The submissions don't have to be in English, though some comments in English might help some of the editors.
Swedish translation here.

// Lance R. Casey

Offline Lance R. Casey

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Re: Help from Polyglots
« Reply #10 on: March 04, 2010, 12:43:37 pm »
Ah, what the heck. Klingon version!

// Lance R. Casey

Offline Txur’Itan

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Re: Help from Polyglots
« Reply #11 on: March 04, 2010, 12:47:23 pm »
Ah, what the heck. Klingon version!

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Offline Prrton

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Re: Help from Polyglots
« Reply #12 on: March 04, 2010, 01:00:15 pm »

Offline Na'rìghawnu

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Re: Help from Polyglots
« Reply #13 on: March 04, 2010, 01:26:52 pm »

Quote
Ah, what the heck. Klingon version!

 :o Tewti! Just awesome!

(I thought about translating it into Esperanto too, but I refrained from it, because it most likely wouldn't be read in this language ... but maybe I should do it, just for the fun of it. But unfortunately it would take too much time.)

Offline Nyx

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Re: Help from Polyglots
« Reply #14 on: March 04, 2010, 01:59:59 pm »

Offline omängum fra'uti

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Re: Help from Polyglots
« Reply #15 on: March 04, 2010, 02:15:32 pm »
* Swedish lagom, which apparently is nigh impossible to explain in English. Along the lines of "enough" when used in this sentence: "Enough is as good as a feast." Almost like "perfectly and satisfyingly sufficient, but not too much, and that's a good thing."
I had a feeling this would come up. Etymologically it harkens back to the old dative plural of "lag" ("law"), and can be construed in the basic sense as "properly". It's also a common misconception (especially among Swedes) that this word (or at least its meaning) is unique to Swedish and the Swedish mindset, which is demonstrably wrong, even though it does not exist in English specifically.
If I understand the meaning correctly, I'd just explain the definition as the "Goldilocks amount" of something, or goldilocks zone.

Anyway on topic, I wonder if we have enough words to translate it to Na'vi...  Maybe translating it and leaving missing words as something like _____ would get the message across well enough. :D
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